How much code did Cryptic get?

[njdss4]

I've heard conflicting reports on how much, if any, code Cryptic got from Perpetual. What's the deal? Did Cryptic get any code or not?

[STOZone]

The reports said they got none whatsoever.

P2 Entertainment - formerly Perpetual Entertainment - has ceased development on Star Trek Online, according to multiple sources at the San Francisco based developer. The news does not, however, mean that the game is canceled. The license, as well as the game's content - but not the code - have been transferred to another Bay Area development studio where work will continue.

Source: http://www.warcry.com/articles/view/breakingnews/2802-Breaking-News-P2-Out-As-Star-Trek-Online-Developer

[njdss4]

Thanks for the info STOZone. I've been asking on a few different forums but no one could come up with that link! Much appreciated.

[vel007]

I think part of the confusion on this matter is the fact that Cryptic is using some of the same concept art Perpetual had.

The reason (I believe) Cryptic got the concept art for Perpetual's game was because it was all done out of house for the game by John Eaves (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/John_Eaves) who probably owned the rights to the art rather than Perpetual. The code, however, was completely in house and therefore completely owned by Perpetual and probably could not feasibly be transferred to Cryptic.

Even if Cryptic had gotten the code most likely it would be unusable to them since they're making a very different game from Perpetual's vision. I'd imagine 90% of the code outside of the basic game engine and in game art would have to have been rewritten to fulfill Cryptic's vision. Also, to easily disseminate what they're looking at and have the code quickly available to use they'd have to hire Perpetual's coders which very easily could not have been an option due to the shakeups at Perpetual near the end. By the time you take this into account it's easier to write new code.

Yes, the game's release is being put back because of all this but, from what I understand, if Perpetual hadn't stepped in we wouldn't have a game at all right now.

[njdss4]

I think part of the confusion on this matter is the fact that Cryptic is using some of the same concept art Perpetual had.

The reason (I believe) Cryptic got the concept art for Perpetual's game was because it was all done out of house for the game by John Eaves (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/John_Eaves) who probably owned the rights to the art rather than Perpetual. The code, however, was completely in house and therefore completely owned by Perpetual and probably could not feasibly be transferred to Cryptic.

Even if Cryptic had gotten the code most likely it would be unusable to them since they're making a very different game from Perpetual's vision. I'd imagine 90% of the code outside of the basic game engine and in game art would have to have been rewritten to fulfill Cryptic's vision. Also, to easily disseminate what they're looking at and have the code quickly available to use they'd have to hire Perpetual's coders which very easily could not have been an option due to the shakeups at Perpetual near the end. By the time you take this into account it's easier to write new code.

Yes, the game's release is being put back because of all this but, from what I understand, if Perpetual hadn't stepped in we wouldn't have a game at all right now.

Hey, I'm just glad the game is being made at all. Still, there was an article that stated that Cryptic Studios was hiring former Perpetual employees shortly after P2 went under. That might have made it worthwhile to get the code, but considering they were working on the game for about 6 months and already have screenshots on this site and a gameplay trailer ready for the 10th I think they will be able to have the game out around the end of 2009, maybe start of 2010.

[CinC-UFPForces-Cardassia]

IThe reason (I believe) Cryptic got the concept art for Perpetual's game was because it was all done out of house for the game by John Eaves (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/John_Eaves) who probably owned the rights to the art rather than Perpetual. The code, however, was completely in house and therefore completely owned by Perpetual and probably could not feasibly be transferred to Cryptic.

Small correction - most of the concept art for Perpetual's version if STO was done by Perpetual artists. John Eaves came in to consult of concept art for many of the starships, and indeed is responsible for many of the images that we saw. But much of the concept art was wholly the product of full-time employees of Perpetual, rather than contractors like John.

[Polt]

Like the fantastic Ryan Denning!!!!

I wonder where he landed... Anyone know?

[Caiman]

I think a lot of people are confused about just what 'Code' is in this case.

I don't understand why people are under the impression Cryptic are buidling a completely different game to what PE had planned. Where's the evidence for this? In 8 months since they acquired the license they are ready to show a gameplay video, that wouldn't be happening if they'd scrapped most of what PE did.

[jayman]

If they didn't use any code from perpetual then the other possibility is they might have licensed some other MMO engine from somewhere. If they didn't have to create their own engine from scratch they might have gotten far enough along to be where they are now.

[IanD967]

I've heard conflicting reports on how much, if any, code Cryptic got from Perpetual. What's the deal? Did Cryptic get any code or not?

zero, nowt, zlitch, naught, diddle-squat, nada, nothing :D

[AaronH]

If they didn't use any code from perpetual then the other possibility is they might have licensed some other MMO engine from somewhere. If they didn't have to create their own engine from scratch they might have gotten far enough along to be where they are now.

Cryptic has an existing engine they are using.

[eNDIE]

If they didn't use any code from perpetual then the other possibility is they might have licensed some other MMO engine from somewhere. If they didn't have to create their own engine from scratch they might have gotten far enough along to be where they are now.

Thought they were using their own engine since they have come further with the co game..

[Dext]

From what I seen Cryptic got every thing from Perpetual but the game engine but Perpetual did not have alot done with the game so Cryptic is takeing what they got an adding on to it.

[Dext]

Thought they were using their own engine since they have come further with the co game..

They are I dont know where that other dude got his info

[jayman]

They are I dont know where that other dude got his info

If you're referring to what I said then there was no info, I merely stated a "possibility" that "might" be. I mean just about everything on these boards right now is up in the air.

[Opus_Penguin]

I hope it is not the exact same game that Perpetual came up with (and from the description it doesn't sound like it) as I was getting turned off of Perpetual's version. I am very much looking forward to this and I hope Cryptic has an announcement on the tenth of the approixamte tiime this will be released.

[The_Rattlesnake]

I tend to believe the warcry article for a few reasons. However, we will probably never know what was actually given to cryptic studos.

As to why I believe the warcry article.

OOP (Object-oriented programming) is a popular concept with computer programmers. One of the reasons why OOP is popular with programmers is because of modules. Modules are blocks of code that link with the source code. Each module represents a certain aspect of the program itself. There might be a module for how phaser fire looks. There might be another module that defines how strong an enemy is. What makes OOP so popular with programmers is that each module can be reused in other programs (with a bit of customization of course). In a sense, oop could be compared to legos or lincoln logs.

If perpetual handed over their source code then cryptic could pick it apart and use bits of it in any other game they make. In other words, cryptic could make a new game based off of someone elses work.