What would you like in Admiral level play?

[Replica]

There was a mention in the Dev Chat about Admirals having more group missions, and that was a source of joy for some and concern for others. I like having Admirals being fleet mission focused, but I understand that's not for everyone, so I think there should be a "demotion episode" early on in the Admiral missions that allows players that prefer solo play to keep T5 and yet be "demoted" back to (Post)Captain for mission purposes. I use Post-Captain because it was the old British Navy rank for the most experienced Captains.

I would love for Admirals to have fleet based missions, but many of them I would like to have restrictions on them. Instead of a mission for a fleet of 4 ships I would like to see a mission for a fleet of 1-T5, 2-T3, 1-T1 as an example. Mixed tier fleets as a requirement in many of the best Admiral missions would be a wonderful community part of the game. Admirals (being separate from Post-Captains by player choice) should have a built in responsibility to the rest of Starfleet, and I think that distinction would encourage players of all levels to seek out Admirals to group with.

What do you think my fellow forum -hounds?

[Akolythos]

I would like to be the only person with the rank of Admiral.

[Desterion]

Admirals are there to lead. Don't think they'l let you off with scrubbing the plasma manifolds or rushing off to resupply vulcan from earth with an urgently needed shipment of chinese finger traps.

[mirkrim]

I don't mind Admiral gameplay being focused around task forces and fleets; it does make sense. However, what doesn't make sense to me is having Tier 5 ships tied to the rank of Admiral. Effectively, the best ships - including some of the most iconic ships in the Star Trek franchise - will be tied to group/raid content. Can anyone say "World of Warcraft?"

[Zepath]

I expect and want Admiral to be long term extended raid content.

I wish they weren't using Admiral, but we've already had that discussion.

[Admiral-Darren-Wright]

Well we know Admirals will have higher ranking BO'S and more of them, and they can unlock end game content ships/planets/area's/items/mods/equipment etc etc lol

Tho we also know there be 2 ships at Tier 5 for all careers, at Admiral id like more ships to be added in and the ability to collect/unlock them all giving you a special title or achievement or Bo or all three, that would be ace !

[vegetta]

I would probably end up being a Yellow Admiral (get the admiral rank but are pushed into retirement)

Tho I dont think the federation uses the same TO@E of the British navy during the Gerogian period :D

I will wait and see how things pan out I guess

[Zepath]

Is that what the British call an Admiral who immediately retires? Its a new term to me.

[Replica]

I expect and want Admiral to be long term extended raid content.
.
Do you think that raid style content should be for all T5 fleets or would you like to see mixed tier fleets?

[Faerlzress]

I don't think the group gameplay of Admiral will be an issue. First of all if you want to solo you can do that in the lower levels. So players that enjoy that content can always recreate a new character and go solo. Or they can go do other things with the Admiral like explore.

As for the rest of us there will need to be a reason to go out and do things. For most RPG games at end level this means taking on very large dangerous enemies. It gives a reason to group up as well as to keep playing. If it is just something you can go solo in 10 minutes it isn't going to be that special.

[WinterPark1701]

I would like to be the only person with the rank of Admiral.

Seems like that would suck, everyone would be gunning for you personally.

[Zepath]

Do you think that raid style content should be for all T5 fleets or would you like to see mixed tier fleets?

I don't have a problem with there being things for T5 players to do independently ... like continue to explore, craft, etc ... but there really isn't much you can do there in a large group (which is apparently where they seem to be taking the end game).

[Desterion]

I think multilayered raid content would be best. Restrict access to certain raids and dungeons based on rank. Some restricted to T2+ for normal mid range dungeons. For higher end dungeons and most raid content allow it to be T3 captain rank or higher. For the highest level, hardest encounters and best equipment, it should be limited to T4 admirals. With this, captains can still get access to 2nd string raid gear, and those who have earned the admiral title get the option for the best.

[Desterion]

Seems like that would suck, everyone would be gunning for you personally.

No, when things like that happen, people hide, and keep the rank. Like people with the highest bounties in eve online. They stop logging in, or just hide with a swarm of friends deep in friendly territory

[Akolythos]

Seems like that would suck, everyone would be gunning for you personally.

I appreciate your concern sir, but I can take it. :cool:

[frost1977]

i wish as well that they had stopped at captain, (seeing 10 admirals all grouped up in a fleet just doesn't feel right)


but i want a balance of focus on quests, I get tired of having to group or raid , there should be just as much for those who want to go off solo as those who want to group.

to me an MMo means social gaming, and you can have that with out forcing raids and fleet stuff on you to be able to enjoy the game.

if you want to force the MMO as forced grouping than you need to force the RP role playing part as well, if not its hypocritical. both would be forcing people into game play they do not want, so EQUAL support should be given to all sides. RP equal to non-rpers, and solo equal to groups and raids.

[Replica]

I think multilayered raid content would be best. Restrict access to certain raids and dungeons based on rank. Some restricted to T2+ for normal mid range dungeons. For higher end dungeons and most raid content allow it to be T3 captain rank or higher. For the highest level, hardest encounters and best equipment, it should be limited to T4 admirals. With this, captains can still get access to 2nd string raid gear, and those who have earned the admiral title get the option for the best.

I sincerely hope there is no such thing as "raid gear" in STO. It has been mentioned already that a T5 ships will be about twice as effective as a T1 ship. Uber-Raid Gear, (the driving force in WoW) would break that balance and push STO towards being WoW in a Trek uniform.

What I meant by mixed tier episodes was that it would not be restricted to the upper ranks. Admirals should be encouraged by the game to mix and mingle with the newer players. What better player experience for a new player to be flying around in their Miranda, then to have some Admirals and Captains ask if they wanted to help on a mission? What better example of Star Trek style leadership then to pull off a big fleet episode, even with a newb or two in the fleet that needs some coaching and some protection from the more experienced fleet members?

A modern naval battle group isn't made of all aircraft carriers and battleships, they usually only have one or two really big ships and many smaller escort and support vessels. I would hope to see in-game episodes that carry that mix into STO.

[Zepath]

I sincerely hope there is no such thing as "raid gear"

There should be no gear in the game that can't be acquired outside of a raid, and outside of PvP.

There should be no PvE or PvP classifications for gear.

If you can get raid gear outside a raid, it should take a effort comparible to the raid effort ... e.g. if it typically takes you 40 hours of raiding to get the item, it should take you at least that (if not more) to get it solo ... I think it should take more, because you will get getting other things along the way solo, that the raider won't.

Classifying gear as PvP and PvE ruined the game for a lot of people in WoW ... because they were forced to decide whether they would be PvE or PvP. PvE'er sucked at PvP because of their gear, and PvP'ers sucked at raiding because of their gear.

Others would argue that was the end-game content ... building your PvE and PvP sets.

[Desterion]

no matter what you may believe, they've already said there is raid content. Are you going to participate just to save the federation and get some fuzzy warm feelings inside? No, you'l be going for that new borg augmented phaser rifle or and special tetryon particle detector mod or that stolen prototype cannon.


Also, if a Vo Quv or Prommy can be equally matched by 2 mirandas, they've got a serious balancing problem.

[indigowhale345]

Well, after reading the devchat, I kind of envision Admiral fleet missions as something of a general call to grab a group and tackle it. Whether its 5 admirals or an admiral and 4 lower ranked players like someone else mentioned, I think its an interesting idea.

I also think that if admirals can go after lower ranked players for these missions, this shoots down a whole lot of the anti-admiral arguments. And that makes it good from an ICRP standpoint as well.

"Captain's log: We received a hail from Admiral Pwnzj00 calling for a task force to deal with an infestation of dire tribbles on Taco Zeta 4. We are set to rendezvous with him in about 2 hours. I must say I've never met a race that spells with numbers and no vowels, but I'm told Admiral Pwnzj00 has one of the best ships in the fleet, though he can be hotheaded and undiplomatic."

I remain optimistic about this. It sounds like a good idea, and if done right, should be pretty fun.

[vobedarkelf]

What would I like to do at Admiral rank?

As a Starfleet officer, I would look forward to a leasurly life behind a desk, safe at Starfleet command on Earth, enjoying a cup of coffee. I would commission a new ship and call it the USS Lemming. Everyone onboard would wear a red shirt, because they are the elite. These would be my champions. I would trust them with the most dangerous assignments. They would be on the front lines to fend off a Borg attack. They would brave the deepest wormholes, or the most explosive nebulas. I will send them to Qo'nos to establish a new peace treaty with the Klingon Empore. No threat too great, no wormhole too small, these loyal men will boldly go where no man has returned from before.

*sip* Ahh, it is good to be the Admiral.

[Zepath]

Whoooah! Hold up cowboy ...

No apprentice / mentoring system is going to allow you take an ensign on a high level mission. I can't count how many games have tried it, and how many times that has failed.

They may give you the ability ... and you may be able to take them ... but its always a disaster.

All they can do is give you more hit points and raise your resistances ... the system never makes up for the gear or the skills you don't have.

Now, those systems work when you go down and play below your level with your friends, but it never works the other way around.

[Replica]

Whoooah! Hold up cowboy ...

No apprentice / mentoring system is going to allow you take an ensign on a high level mission. I can't count how many games have tried it, and how many times that has failed.

They may give you the ability ... and you may be able to take them ... but its always a disaster.

All they can do is give you more hit points and raise your resistances ... the system never makes up for the gear or the skills you don't have.

Now, those systems work when you go down and play below your level with your friends, but it never works the other way around.

Ok. I hear you there. Maybe T1 is too low, but with the tiers being much closer in ability then in most MMOs (twice the DPS instead of 500Xs the DPS) don't you think that there could be good episodes that would allow the community to mix it up a bit? From reading your other post Zepath it sounds like you have more experience from the development side of things, While most of my experience is more around building communities (not in MMOs but IRL). I've played my fair share of MMOs and one of the things that I like best about them is community, so I push for things that I think would build that community in game. CoH once had some of the best community for decent friendly fun PUGs of any MMO I've ever played (and I'm old) I credit the strong roles, the need for teaming, and the sidekick/exemplar system for that strong community. I think strong community is almost required if this game is going to really deliver "the Star Trek experience".

[Xolox]

I would do any mission on any scale. I wouldn't even mind doing a basic courier mission so long as the rewards are correctly scaled to the level/rank.

My only request is that I would rather be known as Rear Admiral.

[Tain]

no matter what you may believe, they've already said there is raid content. Are you going to participate just to save the federation and get some fuzzy warm feelings inside? No, you'l be going for that new borg augmented phaser rifle or and special tetryon particle detector mod or that stolen prototype cannon.


Also, if a Vo Quv or Prommy can be equally matched by 2 mirandas, they've got a serious balancing problem.

They didn't say equally matched, they said "twice as powerful" referring specifically to the ships themselves. Between the extra BO slots of the T5 ships and all the skills available, its probably going to be more like 3-5 Mirandas, and thats assuming they are not actual new players but people just flying it for kicks. A small group of low tier ships being able to trash a solo T5 sounds great to me, I am awfully sick of high level god syndrome in MMOs nowadays.

[Zepath]

Ok. I hear you there. Maybe T1 is too low, but with the tiers being much closer in ability then in most MMOs (twice the DPS instead of 500Xs the DPS) don't you think that there could be good episodes that would allow the community to mix it up a bit? From reading your other post Zepath it sounds like you have more experience from the development side of things, While most of my experience is more around building communities (not in MMOs but IRL). I've played my fair share of MMOs and one of the things that I like best about them is community, so I push for things that I think would build that community in game. CoH once had some of the best community for decent friendly fun PUGs of any MMO I've ever played (and I'm old) I credit the strong roles, the need for teaming, and the sidekick/exemplar system for that strong community. I think strong community is almost required if this game is going to really deliver "the Star Trek experience".

I think you'll get what you're looking for out of a mentoring system. :)

[cocoa-jin]

A versatile Command & Control interface for NPC and Player team coordination...combat and non-combat coordination.