Star Trek Online or Starfleet Online?

[Veglargh]

Is this game called Star Trek Online or Starfleet Online?

Sure that the shows concentrated on the Federations (because they were following humans) but Star Trek Online is supposed to be a 2 Faction GAME.

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

Sure Cryptic employees keep on saying that the Klingon info is coming in the next PR cycle. But no date or even an estimation of date have been give. Development wise, If you don't have the Klingon Faction figured out that is fine just say so, we don't need things sugar coated. Non-development wise, there is no excuse because this is a game based on Star Trek Online not Starfleet.


EDIT: Summarizing for those who are not able to read
Daganick hit it straight in the head with this post (http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=805857&postcount=42). Those that keep telling us to be patient why shouldn't the Klingon Faction Community have?:

-More pics of ships that Cryptic has already shown (such as the Vo'cha, BOP, Vo'Quv, Raptor, Neghvar) instead of countless shots of Akiras and Mirandas

-More pics of Klingon Buildings that Cryptic has already shown in the videos and even on previous screenshot

-A less Fed style website (a neutral looking site) or a Klingon Skin looking website (it is possible they have done in CO which is the same site "engine/design"

-More community activities oriented to Klingons- Out of 28 Kobayashi Morus only 2 are Klingon oriented

- the Fleet Forum Registration Description from the current "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!" to "finest crew in Starfleet and KDF" or just take out "putting together the fines crew in Starfleet".


Ladies and Gentleman, the topic is very simple. Lack of Klingon Respect. We are NOT asking for them to release "Klingon Game Features Now". We are saying that we want balance representation. I bet if the role was reversed many Fed faction would be asking the same. It is not that hard to at least make the presentation of the game seem unbiased

The Topic of Klingon Material still been developed is a dead horse. So in Awen's words "knock it off". If you are not able to understand a simple topic and reply to it don't bother posting.

[USS_Parallax]

As it has been said... They're simply focusing on the Federation first. All MMOs do this. They don't attack each side at the same time. They get one done and get it done right then move on to the next.

They've probably got a LOT more Federation content right now because they're focusing on it more. That's all it means. Klingon content will get here...

[Banar]

Cryptic has said they don't have Klingons finalized, such as exactly how they will go about House Vs. House pvp.

If the game is being released in early 2010, you know that Klingon info will be made available sometime during the next several months.

[Veglargh]

As it has been said... They're simply focusing on the Federation first. All MMOs do this. They don't attack each side at the same time. They get one done and get it done right then move on to the next.

They've probably got a LOT more Federation content right now because they're focusing on it more. That's all it means. Klingon content will get here...

but non-development wise what is their excuse?

[QuantaStarfire]

What do you want them to do? Given that Star Trek's main focus is humanity and the Federation, it's no surprise that the amount of information on Klingons and other cultures would be sparse. Granted, the Klingons are probably the most well-developed of the non-Federation races, but it still doesn't compare to the wealth of information you'd get following several groups of humans around the galaxy for 5 series and 11 movies.

[Banar]

but non-development wise what is their excuse?

What do you mean? Why would they talk about something that isn't near completion yet? That would be very bad PR. There is no reason that they would need more than one "excuse" for this.

[Replica]

Are Klingons allowed to whine? :D j/k

Yeah it would be nice to see some serious Klingon love from the community team. But they might well reply
"Qu'vatlh" . I hope to see a whole separate page for the Gagh eaters, with an appropriate banner/theme/etc.

[BreachAndClear]

but non-development wise what is their excuse?

Is that kind of like asking "what's the in universe explanation...????"

[Sunborn]

About 90 percent or more of everything star trek has been through the eyes of the Federations Star Fleet. Even when things were through the eyes of someone not Star Fleet affiliated it was usually to add to the story of Star Fleet and how they handle the situation, rather than to add to the story about that race or faction.

Honestly, they will be doing more for the Klingons with this one game then anything else in Star Trek, even including Klingon Academy. I am sure that are a LOT of things that Cryptic has to create themselves, which means they need to get approved from the licenses holders on everything they create for the Klingons. Approval takes time.

[kildar888]

Humies,
You are missing the Point! The point was just tell us. If Major Klingon content is the first supplement, fine, just tell us. I agree that 80% of Star Trek is Human centered, but when all the adds and all the hype has been about both factions, what do you expect? We just want clearification.

[Sunborn]

Humies,
You are missing the Point! The point was just tell us. If Major Klingon content is the first supplement, fine, just tell us. I agree that 80% of Star Trek is Human centered, but when all the adds and all the hype has been about both factions, what do you expect? We just want clearification.

Who exactly is missing the point? The devs said they are not talking about Klingons yet, they are not in that part of the PR cycle, but that when they do they will have a lot of info. I think the point is being missed by a different group of people here.

[Banar]

Humies,
You are missing the Point! The point was just tell us. If Major Klingon content is the first supplement, fine, just tell us. I agree that 80% of Star Trek is Human centered, but when all the adds and all the hype has been about both factions, what do you expect? We just want clearification.

It's simple. They don't have all the content to talk about yet, and they have indeed said as much.

[Veglargh]

I think the point is being missed by a different group of people here.

That's the exact point, the game has been presented for you a Fed. So you have no reason to care about the minority. This is supposed to be a Game that has to factions, not another Star Trek Show.

How many screenshots has Cryptic release of JUST the Akira ??? Compare that number to the combined Klingon Ship Screenshots and we don't even come close.

[yodummy]

were just getting a little antsy is all..can ya blame us?

[Varrangian]

I'm sorry, but it has been known for a very long time that the Devs are putting off talking about the Klingons. While that is frustrating (and trust me I'd love some Klingon love, as I want to play both factions equally), there really is no reason to make such a a big deal about this.

[Eclipse1987]

Who exactly is missing the point? The devs said they are not talking about Klingons yet, they are not in that part of the PR cycle, but that when they do they will have a lot of info. I think the point is being missed by a different group of people here.

QFT. Dems the breaks. we all know it's coming, if we are looking @ a Q1 launch it can't be more than a few months at most.

[Draconianknight]

There is no exscuse with the lack of information on Klingons. I point directly to the last slap in the face and that being the list of playable ships. Several of the videos and screen shots have shown Klingon ships. So you can not say there is no developement or it is coming later.
How can you list a Constitution Class as a player ship and not at least list a BoP. They are after all just list. We all understand that most players will be Fed, so what, game balance is game balance and just because 30 or 40% of the STO community is Klingon faction based. Are we not going to have as much game content as the Federation Faction. The much flaunted Genesis system is supposed to be able to just crank out new systems. If we take the ship listings as a comparison then over 90% of the playable space will be in Federation space. Guess you Feds better warm up the phasers because carebear or not your going to get company real fast.
Don't misunderstand me. I am not whinning, just stating the current facts, every video, every combat chat has been about blasting Klingons. Good luck with that later. Game Devs are supposed to be impartial and release balanced products. If they are taking apps for beta and there is only two Klingon class playable ships there is a problem. If I did something like this where I work...I would be looking for a new job. Course now I have prob lost my shot at beta by curseing the great almighty federation dev gods.
But at least I have my dignity and spine.

[Liberty]

Well... I'd say be patient and its coming but I gotta kinda side on the Klingons for this one. Given, most of the Klingon stuff is going to be coming out later but that doesn't mean they can't throw out a screenshot or two.

I find it hard to believe when the Klingon stuff does come out that they are going to stop talking about Federation stuff given that they have many Federation ship classes left to discuss. They haven't even talked about the standard races yet other than a mention of Vulcans.

Hopefully they will break the site up like City of Heroes and City of Villains did. That should keep everyone happy and then they should start pouring mass content into the Klingon site.

[Archangelwoghd]

.....chillax.

[Varrangian]

There is no exscuse with the lack of information on Klingons. I point directly to the last slap in the face and that being the list of playable ships. Several of the videos and screen shots have shown Klingon ships. So you can not say there is no developement or it is coming later.
How can you list a Constitution Class as a player ship and not at least list a BoP. They are after all just list. We all understand that most players will be Fed, so what, game balance is game balance and just because 30 or 40% of the STO community is Klingon faction based. Are we not going to have as much game content as the Federation Faction. The much flaunted Genesis system is supposed to be able to just crank out new systems. If we take the ship listings as a comparison then over 90% of the playable space will be in Federation space. Guess you Feds better warm up the phasers because carebear or not your going to get company real fast.
Don't misunderstand me. I am not whinning, just stating the current facts, every video, every combat chat has been about blasting Klingons. Good luck with that later. Game Devs are supposed to be impartial and release balanced products. If they are taking apps for beta and there is only two Klingon class playable ships there is a problem. If I did something like this where I work...I would be looking for a new job. Course now I have prob lost my shot at beta by curseing the great almighty federation dev gods.
But at least I have my dignity and spine.

So walk away, don't give Cryptic your dollars :rolleyes:

[yodummy]

Hopefully they will break the site up like City of Heroes and City of Villains did. That should keep everyone happy and then they should start pouring mass content into the Klingon site.[/QUOTE]

I'm sure most of us in BOK would like to see that.

[Draconianknight]

.....chillax.

DUDE! I love that song!!!

[Gruug]

As a Star Trek fan and a fan of STO, I really don't give a rip if they would tell us ANYTHING. I would rather just find out when I play the game and be amazed. I think it is just too over emotional to get wrapped up in such minute detail and start counting what has or has not been announced. Just hold your water and all will be revealed.

[Draconianknight]

So walk away, don't give Cryptic your dollars :rolleyes:

Well brother I am going to enjoy the House vs House aspect of this game. Thanks for the support:eek:

[CaptainQuirk]

Is this game called Star Trek Online or Starfleet Online?

Sure that the shows concentrated on the Federations (because they were following humans) but Star Trek Online is supposed to be a 2 Faction GAME.

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

Sure Cryptic employees keep on saying that the Klingon info is coming in the next PR cycle. But no date or even an estimation of date have been give. Development wise, If you don't have the Klingon Faction figured out that is fine just say so, we don't need things sugar coated. Non-development wise, there is no excuse because this is a game based on Star Trek Online not Starfleet.

I agree with you.

They won't discuss the klingon half of the game.
They won't discuss the exploration aspect.
They won't discuss the Science aspect.
They won't discuss the diplomacy aspect.
All they discuss and have discussed for months is the Federation Combat aspect.

The game is supposed to be released early next year, according to Cryptic.
Well, we're movint into late this year, which means there is less and less time for development.

So far, they've got one eighth of the game done in one year's time. They've got just under nine months to get the other seven eighths ready if they plan to say release is early next year. Because by the end of June, it will be the latter half of next year.

No player crews (understandable)
No ship interiors
No klingon stuff
No non-combat stuff
Just Combat stuff from the Starfleet perspective.

That's what the game is looking like right now. And from my point of view, it ain't Star Trek.

[majicebe]

but non-development wise what is their excuse?

Having 2 team of 10 people each working Klingon and Starfleet (like 2 games at the same time) that somehow have to come together

VS.

Paying 1 team of 20 people to focus mostly on completing Starfleet first, then having the same team go primarily to work on Klingon.

No brainer. It'd be more difficult to have two teams working on completely different stuff then having to somehow collaborate to make sure both teams were coming up with equivalent level stuff, than it would be to have one team finish one side, know how that's setup, then make a comparable counterpart using all the things learned the first time.

Really, the Starfleet side is like the prototype and the Klingon side will benefit from all the experience and realizations that took place making the Starfleet portion. So, in essence, Klingons will probably have more solid gameplay and more thought-out ships.

Fixed ;)

[Tamgros]

We'll see what they do with the Klingons. It's clear at this point that the Factions will play differently, perhaps even in the way they level up and progress through the game. Maybe they have a different type of ship list all together? At this point you can at least rest assured they won't be diminished to the Creeps of LotRO. Lol, the Vo'Quv itself proovs that :p

I asked about Klingons and their content to Zinc in my interview about Klingons. He kinda dodged the question. but I think the non verbals gave some info :) I know Veg's seen it, but at least it's relevant to this thread, It's just after the 2:30 mark here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HailingFrequency#play/uploads/1/evBCLBCBLTQ

[Varrangian]

Well brother I am going to enjoy the House vs House aspect of this game. Thanks for the support:eek:

You prove my point though. You want to play the game (as do I), so you are just going to have to wait on the information (as am I). Is it frustrating? Yes, but is it worth making such a big deal about? No. The information is coming, just not as fast as we'd like.

As I said further above I want to play both factions equally, so I'm just as SoL as you or any other Klingon fan.

[ibby1kanobi]

/sigh


Cryptic has to stretch info over a 6 month period. They have to partition it out so that it stretches all the way to release....and gives good information all the way. They need to build and foster hype. It's what makes them business.

They have said, this is the Fed PR cycle. The Klingon PR cycle is going to come once the Fed PR cycle is done. Then you'll have soo much Klingon info you'll be sick of it.

Just because they aren't show casing it doesn't mean it isn't being developed and worked on in their offices. I'm SURE that there is just as much Klingon stuff done as there is Fed.

Be a bit patient.

[Liberty]

Klingons are suppose to be emotional. I want my opponent angry! :eek:

[Pipsqueek78]

You know, from what I understand Kilingon play isn't going to be the same as Fed play. This isn't like Star Wars Galaxies where all they're doing is throwing different uniforms on the same characters and giving them a few ships of thier own. The Klingons are going to be vastly different from the Feds in pretty much every way imagineable. Give them time. I don't think we'll get beyond this month without hearing anything susbtantial about the Klingons. I think Beta starting will be the mark.

Honestly, if y'all want to complain to someone, complain to Atari. My understanding is they run the PR team, thus they tell Cryptic what can and can't be released yet.

[Veglargh]

Having 2 team of 10 people each working Klingon and Starfleet (like 2 games at the same time) that somehow have to come together

VS.

Paying 1 team of 20 people to focus mostly on completing Starfleet first, then having the same team go primarily to work on Klingon.

No brainer. It'd be more difficult to have two teams working on completely different stuff then having to somehow collaborate to make sure both teams were coming up with equivalent level stuff, than it would be to have one team finish one side, know how that's setup, then make a comparable counterpart using all the things learned the first time.

Really, the Starfleet side is like the prototype and the Klingon side will benefit from all the experience and realizations that took place making the Starfleet portion. So, in essence, Klingons will probably have more solid gameplay and more thought-out ships.

Fixed ;)

I see what you are saying about development. But that is not the only thing been discussed, there are non-development things that they can do better. Some of the things non-development that does NOT take 2 teams to do is:

Klingon Screenshots- they have Klingon things because we have seen part of it on the videos

The website- the least that hey can do its make it less FED looking. Otherwise we want a site that that has a Klingon fleet. For god sake, even the PM system has a FED style.

The Ships of the Line: We have seen a pic or 2 of the BOP and the Vo'cha is it that hard to post up in the Ship of the line section, and that list is completely Fed.

[dudewhat]

Blizzard did the same thing and developed The Alliance first before making the starting zones of The Horde. They spent the first half of the beta testing the Alliance content and the second half the Horde content. I think Cryptic may be doing the same thing here. Although I find it hard to believe that this game will come out in Q1 2010 if the Klingon content isn't already in the game.

Since Cryptic has just fleshed out what the Federation gameplay will look like I think it is time for them to start showing us what the Klingon side. Both sides must feel like the same amount of work and content has gone into them otherwise there will be a huge faction imbalance.

[Ellsworth]

Relax, it's simply part of marketing. They need to save SOME buzz for closer to launch. Otherwise the game will flop and that will affect the experience for all of us

[erriku]

That's the exact point, the game has been presented for you a Fed. So you have no reason to care about the minority. This is supposed to be a Game that has to factions, not another Star Trek Show.

How many screenshots has Cryptic release of JUST the Akira ??? Compare that number to the combined Klingon Ship Screenshots and we don't even come close.


I don't know about that. I plan to have my main a Klingon yet the lack of Klingon stuff does not bother me at all because I know it is coming. They will get to the Klingons. If they say they can't talk about it, then they can't. I am sure they are not trying to keep us Klingons down. I really can't see the point of this thread other than a useless rant page. If you were a true Klingon, you would not complain so much and keep your Klingon reserve.

[yodummy]

I don't know about that. I plan to have my main a Klingon yet the lack of Klingon stuff does not bother me at all because I know it is coming. They will get to the Klingons. If they say they can't talk about it, then they can't. I am sure they are not trying to keep us Klingons down. I really can't see the point of this thread other than a useless rant page. If you were a true Klingon, you would not complain so much and keep your Klingon reserve. not sure you should use the word "rant", I've read some of you're posts. actually kind of disappointed yer playing a klingon, and so are about 135 other guys.

[erriku]

not sure you should use the word "rant", I've read some of you're posts. actually kind of disappointed yer playing a klingon, and so are about 135 other guys.

Hmmm.... Attempting to start a flame war I see. You prove my point for me. I wonder if you are in the same guild. I can't say I would be surprised to find that all these 135 "other guys" are all in the same guild actually.

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=24&a=2). Thank you, Dionaea

[yodummy]

........................

[erriku]

........................

Yes. Couldn't have said it better myself.

[Facetious]

Is this game called Star Trek Online or Starfleet Online?

Sure that the shows concentrated on the Federations (because they were following humans) but Star Trek Online is supposed to be a 2 Faction GAME.

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

Sure Cryptic employees keep on saying that the Klingon info is coming in the next PR cycle. But no date or even an estimation of date have been give. Development wise, If you don't have the Klingon Faction figured out that is fine just say so, we don't need things sugar coated. Non-development wise, there is no excuse because this is a game based on Star Trek Online not Starfleet.

Great.. another thread I wasted my time reading/clicking...

[dr_truth]

Rofl Captain Eric. very well said.

I agree that people are just getting too wound up about it. Yes it is frustrating, but in the same sense as looking at a Christmas present! Sure you hate not knowing what is in store for you like people who wanna play the Feds. But the longer they keep it a secret the more it is going to blow your mind when you find out.

Heck, the fact they are keeping secrets about the the Klingons can mean that it's their "ace in the hole", the real surprise that they are keeping behind the curtain until the last minute. I am frustrated about the secrecy but more so excited, and frankly, surprised you guys aren't more excited as well.

I bet most of you guys crying now will rejoice and feel it was worth every moment of the wait. the rest of you... well some people cannot be pleased.

[erkenbrand001]

Simply put,

- We know there is Klingon material from the original trailer video.
Vorcha attacking a fed ship
Several shots of Klingon Raiding parties
-We know there is Klingon material from the other various videos
Klingon ships fighting ( many of the other Klingon ships)

There IS Klingon Material out there Period! So one must ask why is Cryptic not releasing anymore information. Only Cryptic can answer that question. However,they released the information that there is going to be 2 playable factions in this game. So, therefore would it not make sense to promote both sides equally ..or at least as much as possible, that is not the case here. There are those who have said that Star Trek is seen only threw the eyes of the Federation. While this is true, this game was ment to be played as a Klingon , not just Star fleet, or else they would just name it Star Fleet Online. So as the Federation outnumbers Klingons would it not make sense to break the marketing strategy and promote the Klingons with new exciting ships and information to even out the numbers ? With out the Klingons there is no pvp for the Federation.With out Klingons the material that Cryptic has put so much time and effort into will be wasted. As a business neglecting these facts in my opinion will turn STO into another SWG , to just another MMO failure.


As far as us "Klingons" ranting ,be cry baby's, whining, emotional. I can say that the lack of Klingon material is a insulting. Let me list them for you again....

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

These insulting gestures ,normally we would just sit by and say nothing , but this most recent ship listing struck the final blow. You cannot deni the evidence! Its not just new material either the Kobayashi Maru has had very little Klingon material. How many Screen shots are there ? And how many of them have Klingon shots in them?

All we want is simply put, more equality in all aspects of the game. This one sided stuff needs to stop. More Klingon screen shots, more Klingon Kobayashi Maru, and plz change the Fleet Registration from "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet?"....Thank you for your time ....

[Delta122]

I could not have put this any better. It does seem as the game is becoming Federation based. But in the end its all the different races that makes Star Trek what it is.

[yodummy]

Rofl Captain Eric. very well said.

I agree that people are just getting too wound up about it. Yes it is frustrating, but in the same sense as looking at a Christmas present! Sure you hate not knowing what is in store for you like people who wanna play the Feds. But the longer they keep it a secret the more it is going to blow your mind when you find out.

Heck, the fact they are keeping secrets about the the Klingons can mean that it's their "ace in the hole", the real surprise that they are keeping behind the curtain until the last minute. I am frustrated about the secrecy but more so excited, and frankly, surprised you guys aren't more excited as well.

I bet most of you guys crying now will rejoice and feel it was worth every moment of the wait. the rest of you... well some people cannot be pleased. no one is crying..I do however think some of us are just a little frustrated, myself, i would just like to see a little more klingon stuff. however, information is key, were going into a war and we don't know really what we have to work with.(unlike the federation). thats all, i'm sure well have all the info we'll need before launch. like I said, we're all just a little antsy, being so close to beta.

[Kaybok]

Hopefully they will break the site up like City of Heroes and City of Villains did. That should keep everyone happy and then they should start pouring mass content into the Klingon site.

I'm sure most of us in BOK would like to see that.

I'm going to play Klingon side as well. I hope they do not have separate dev teams like they did with CoH and CoV. It ended up with a sense of dev favoritism for the hero side among some players. I know it's not 100% true but the hero side seemed to get nice enhancements first and villain side always lagged behind (years passed before villains got Epic AT's for example).

I see the same sense of favoritism and resentment forming here like it did in the City games. At this point Cryptic PR would be wise to loosen their neck ties a little and give Klingons a bit of love.

[EvilBlaze]

There is no excuse with the lack of information on Klingons.

They are not allowed to talk about it. That is the "Non Development" reason. Is it that hard to understand? They are not discriminating, they are doing what they have been told, releasing information on one faction first, before focusing on the other. It is not meant to be balanced.

Game Devs are supposed to be impartial and release balanced products. If I did something like this where I work...I would be looking for a new job

The Devs are impartial, and the product will be balanced, the PR, however, is clearly not. If I revealed information to a client about current development when I was expressly told not to where I work... I would be looking for a new job, and I suspect if you work in a development environment, you would too.

[USS_Parallax]

but non-development wise what is their excuse?

They've given it. Not their fault you're not listening. :p

It doesn't matter if you don't like their excuse. It's their excuse. It's a typical one seen very often in this business. It's not like they're doing this just to **** you off. :)

[yodummy]

I'm going to play Klingon side as well. I hope they do not have separate dev teams like they did with CoH and CoV. It ended up with a sense of dev favoritism for the hero side among some players. I know it's not 100% true but the hero side seemed to get nice enhancements first and villain side always lagged behind (years passed before villains got Epic AT's for example).

I see the same sense of favoritism and resentment forming here like it did in the City games. At this point Cryptic PR would be wise to loosen their neck ties a little and give Klingons a bit of love.

I havent played CoH so ill take your word for it..however i was mainly just suggesting the fleet forums should be seperate..sorry for the confusion.

[Kaybok]

I havent played CoH so ill take your word for it..however i was mainly just suggesting the fleet forums should be seperate..sorry for the confusion.

Np. I'm not confused. A Klingon web/site forums would be awesome but it's equal development and equal release of information that's the heart of the issue. If Cryptic uses the same separate development model like they did with City of Villains then some of the resentment seen in the forums here will continue. I don't think Cryptic is doing that but it's beginning to feel like it to some of us.

[dr_truth]

Simply put,

- We know there is Klingon material from the original trailer video.
Vorcha attacking a fed ship
Several shots of Klingon Raiding parties
-We know there is Klingon material from the other various videos
Klingon ships fighting ( many of the other Klingon ships)

There IS Klingon Material out there Period! So one must ask why is Cryptic not releasing anymore information. Only Cryptic can answer that question. However,they released the information that there is going to be 2 playable factions in this game. So, therefore would it not make sense to promote both sides equally ..or at least as much as possible, that is not the case here. There are those who have said that Star Trek is seen only threw the eyes of the Federation. While this is true, this game was ment to be played as a Klingon , not just Star fleet, or else they would just name it Star Fleet Online. So as the Federation outnumbers Klingons would it not make sense to break the marketing strategy and promote the Klingons with new exciting ships and information to even out the numbers ? With out the Klingons there is no pvp for the Federation.With out Klingons the material that Cryptic has put so much time and effort into will be wasted. As a business neglecting these facts in my opinion will turn STO into another SWG , to just another MMO failure.


As far as us "Klingons" ranting ,be cry baby's, whining, emotional. I can say that the lack of Klingon material is a insulting. Let me list them for you again....

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

These insulting gestures ,normally we would just sit by and say nothing , but this most recent ship listing struck the final blow. You cannot deni the evidence! Its not just new material either the Kobayashi Maru has had very little Klingon material. How many Screen shots are there ? And how many of them have Klingon shots in them?

All we want is simply put, more equality in all aspects of the game. This one sided stuff needs to stop. More Klingon screen shots, more Klingon Kobayashi Maru, and plz change the Fleet Registration from "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet?"....Thank you for your time ....

A. Klingon's a fictional race. so to discriminate is impossible.

B. there is still plenty of time for the Klingon stuff to be released, and no they don't need to be released equally and at the same time. They need information to keep between now and launch otherwise they should have to release every detail of the game at once otherwise someone else will feel left out over something.

C. Yes they are talking about there being separate factions. That is a function of the game. there is no rule saying that both factions need to be explained at the same time.

D. @ Daganick And Delta122. Just because they don't release information about a faction does not mean it will be non-existent or lesser of a faction. I know you guys are Frustrated and afraid that the Klingon faction is going to be a disappointment and have half the content ect... While i understand why, Those fears are still unfounded because the simple lack of information is not proof that those fears will come true. STO will not be another SWG simply because they want to keep something a surprise.

[Aethilgar]

Blizzard did the same thing and developed The Alliance first before making the starting zones of The Horde. They spent the first half of the beta testing the Alliance content and the second half the Horde content.

Unfortunately, at release, that's how the game felt, too. Like the Horde had been finished second... less complete, less polished. Much like DAoC and how Albion was finished first... much more polished and complete than Hybernia or Midgard.

And I bring up DAoC and Albion for another reason. Dark Ages of *Camelot*. *Albion*. The very game's name focused toward one side. And it just happened to be the first finished. Can you guess which was the most populous side overall? Ya, you got it! Albion.

So I think the OP has a valid concern particularly in a faction based pvp system.

[yodummy]

Np. I'm not confused. A Klingon web/site forums would be awesome but it's equal development and equal release of information that's the heart of the issue. If Cryptic uses the same separate development model like they did with City of Villains then some of the resentment seen in the forums here will continue. I don't think Cryptic is doing that but it's beginning to feel like it to some of us. thats the thing! were not really asking for "equal", per say, it's just that it's so darn one sided! ahhhwell, guess were beating a dead horse...

[dan6526]

I think that it is now time to refocus on the Klingons myself. I as a Fed kinda guy think that the Klingons need a morale boost. And I need to know what I'm up against LOL! I thoroughly believe Cryptic has made the stuff they just aren't sharing... So it's time to make nice and share.

[erkenbrand001]

A. Klingon's a fictional race. so to discriminate is impossible.

B. there is still plenty of time for the Klingon stuff to be released, and no they don't need to be released equally and at the same time. They need information to keep between now and launch otherwise they should have to release every detail of the game at once otherwise someone else will feel left out over something.

C. Yes they are talking about there being separate factions. That is a function of the game. there is no rule saying that both factions need to be explained at the same time.

D. @ Daganick And Delta122. Just because they don't release information about a faction does not mean it will be non-existent or lesser of a faction. I know you guys are Frustrated and afraid that the Klingon faction is going to be a disappointment and have half the content ect... While i understand why, Those fears are still unfounded because the simple lack of information is not proof that those fears will come true. STO will not be another SWG simply because they want to keep something a surprise.


I read, understand and respect what you are saying but purhaps you dont understand what I'm saying ...
If you look at how much attention is put toward Federation material , in comparison with how much Klingon material ..if you could be observant to notice the HUGE difference ..and I'm not just talking about "new" material. I'm talking about things such as the Kobayashi Maru , The ship listings ( which had almost all of the Known Federation ships even if Cryptic didnt design them, and 2 Klingons ships that Cryptic did design .Why arnt the other Klingon ships on there. You know the ones Crytic didnt design , they put all the Fed ships on there , but not the Klingons ships, I wonder why )The weekly screen shots( I have already mentioned these)The MODs posting in the FED fleets , but none of the Klingon fleets until recently and that was only to rep-remand us ( which had nothing to do with us). I understand the idea of them not releasing all of there material till the end ...fine ...but as a business in my opinion don't put all your eggs in one basket ...and that is what they are doing ...You seem like a smart guy ...look at the facts ....

[Sunborn]

That's the exact point, the game has been presented for you a Fed. So you have no reason to care about the minority. This is supposed to be a Game that has to factions, not another Star Trek Show.

How many screenshots has Cryptic release of JUST the Akira ??? Compare that number to the combined Klingon Ship Screenshots and we don't even come close.


Again. My point was that they most likely need to have klingon stuff approved, that takes time. They need to create much more stuff for the ridgeheads because so much more already exists for the feds. So, would you like very little info and the excuse, “Sorry we cant talk about the game, but we cant get the next bit of news about klingons approved, and by God we promised more Klingon info before fed info!”, or would you rather them release the info they have, and once they get all the stuff for klingons gathered and approved release info for that?

There is no exscuse with the lack of information on Klingons.

Sure there is. It's been stated many many times by the devs, right here on these forums actually! Isnt that exciting? Would you like to know that excuse? They are not ready to release more info! It's almost like that has been stated before. There are legal issues to keep in mind with the Star Trek copyright holders. You will NOT get info from devs on any game if they are not ready to release it. Deal with it. Seriously.


[COLOR="DarkOrange"]Simply put,

- We know there is Klingon material from the original trailer video.
Vorcha attacking a fed ship
Several shots of Klingon Raiding parties
-We know there is Klingon material from the other various videos
Klingon ships fighting ( many of the other Klingon ships)

There IS Klingon Material out there Period! So one must ask why is Cryptic not releasing anymore information. Only Cryptic can answer that question.

Psst! I have a secret. There is a reason the info has not been released. And that information was given by a Cryptic Dev. Shh, dont tell anyone. Word is, they are tottaly not ready to release more Klingon info. Bummer eh? But, you know, shh, don't tell anyone. Mums the word.

thats the thing! were not really asking for "equal", per say, it's just that it's so darn one sided! ahhhwell, guess were beating a dead horse...

I bet it will feel one sided when we get an onslaught of Klingon info with very little fed info. And who knows, maybe I'll even chime in asking for more fed info at that time. For now, that's their plan. Fed info, then Klingon info.

[Aslan_chShran]

Sure Cryptic employees keep on saying that the Klingon info is coming in the next PR cycle. But no date or even an estimation of date have been give. Development wise, If you don't have the Klingon Faction figured out that is fine just say so, we don't need things sugar coated. Non-development wise, there is no excuse because this is a game based on Star Trek Online not Starfleet.

Good thing I don't care about the Klingon faction, eh? ;)

[erkenbrand001]

Sure there is. It's been stated many many times by the devs, right here on these forums actually! Isnt that exciting? Would you like to know that excuse? They are not ready to release more info! It's almost like that has been stated before. There are legal issues to keep in mind with the Star Trek copyright holders. You will NOT get info from devs on any game if they are not ready to release it. Deal with it. Seriously.

Psst! I have a secret. There is a reason the info has not been released. And that information was given by a Cryptic Dev. Shh, dont tell anyone. Word is, they are tottaly not ready to release more Klingon info. Bummer eh? But, you know, shh, don't tell anyone. Mums the word.



Can I just say how intelligent of a response this is.....

[SelorKiith]

Well... you puny klingons don't have much of PR do you?
Yeah obviously you would spit out infos uncoordinated and as they come...

It's not your time in the PR Cycle yet... deal with it... I want more infos myself, I'd like to know what I am going to blast away...

And just because they don't talk about something doesn't mean they haven't done it yet...
Just because you don't get infos, doesn't mean they aren't working on it...

Seriously, sometimes the whole Forum is acting up like they have the right to know every single move the Devs make...

[erkenbrand001]

Well... you puny klingons don't have much of PR do you?
Yeah obviously you would spit out infos uncoordinated and as they come...

It's not your time in the PR Cycle yet... deal with it... I want more infos myself, I'd like to know what I am going to blast away...

And just because they don't talk about something doesn't mean they haven't done it yet...

puny uh ? ......perhaps you should go back and read all the the posts in this thread . Maybe then you will realize its not just about new material......

[slingbladez]

Unfortunately, at release, that's how the game felt, too. Like the Horde had been finished second... less complete, less polished. Much like DAoC and how Albion was finished first... much more polished and complete than Hybernia or Midgard.

So I think the OP has a valid concern particularly in a faction based pvp system.

That's my main concern at the moment. I think they are delaying Klingon to a later part of the PR cycle because there actually isn't enough Klingon content to justify it at the moment.

[Mile5]

Patience, it does not seem to be a Klingon trait.. ;)

[Peregrine_Falcon]

That's what the game is looking like right now. And from my point of view, it ain't Star Trek.
Why are you still here then? Don't let the door crit you on the way out.


I take it that many of you haven't worked for a big corporation before. Let me tell you how it works. When the marketing people tell you not to spill the beans and you do, you lose your job!

I'm fairly certain that Awen and Rekhan don't want to suddenly become unemployed, so no matter how many threads you guys start about this it ain't gonna get answered until marketing says it's time.

I agree with Ellsworth. All of you who are getting upset about this need to relax. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lzvKhDejPFQ)

[Mogfire]

That's my main concern at the moment. I think they are delaying Klingon to a later part of the PR cycle because there actually isn't enough Klingon content to justify it at the moment.


I had the same thoughts when they failed to mention the D7, BOP, K'tinga, Vor'cha and Negh'Var on the ships of the line page. I think this ticked everyone off the most, I fail to see any PR strategy in not showing these ships. Its not really a huge PR deal to hide details everyone knows will be in the game. I'm sorry to say but this game is Starfleet online until more Klingon material arrives.

[erkenbrand001]

I guess I'm gonna say this a few more times...

Its not just about new material ....its about how bias everybody is to the Federation over Klingons. Were not looking to for a Flame war , or trolls, orcs , goblins or whatever we are just stating facts. All the things that shows that Cryptic just dost care about Klingons ...or cares very little about us .. let me re post something for you ..


I'm talking about things such as the Kobayashi Maru , The ship listings ( which had almost all of the Known Federation ships even if Cryptic didnt design them, and 2 Klingons ships that Cryptic did design .Why arnt the other Klingon ships on there. You know the ones Crytic didnt design , they put all the Fed ships on there , but not the Klingons ships, I wonder why )The weekly screen shots( I have already mentioned these)The MODs posting in the FED fleets , but none of the Klingon fleets until recently and that was only to rep-remand us ( which had nothing to do with us)

[Nindran]

let ask Klingon a question do Klingon have science ship or engine ships? I think i can answer that question No they don't. there warrior race. Now how cryptic suppose give warrior race science and engineer ship with race love battle and conflict. first they need make ever from scratch then they need get all approve by CBS and Parmount then they post on website. CBS and Parmount is a lot red tape that got be go through and agreements and thing need be sign. So i going say that you guys really need be patient and wait till all it is approve then you get you content:)

[The.Grand.Nagus]

As it has been said... They're simply focusing on the Federation first. All MMOs do this. They don't attack each side at the same time. They get one done and get it done right then move on to the next.

False. Most MMOs release info on both sides at the same time.

[Xenoshaft]

The facts are that they not only ARE focused on the Feds right now- the PR cycle allows them to share info with us when THEY want to- so when they are darn good and ready they will show you what they have under the hood for the klingons. and after all the detail i have seen in the other parts of the game. I'm sure its going to be fantastic. I know your excited for the game. Please dont get angery b/c you didnt get the information you wanted. I'm glad they are going to give out the info a bit slower- It keeps me excited about the game. If I could read it all at once I would and in 5 months I would be like, What game? Also by doing the Klingons last, every time they show new klingon stuff they will be gathering more and more followers of feds to join them as klingons.

[Nindran]

here another question what happen if star trek online wasn't release because they release content without permission of CBS or Parmount.:)

[The.Grand.Nagus]

The facts are that they not only ARE focused on the Feds right now- the PR cycle allows them to share info with us when THEY want to- so when they are darn good and ready they will show you what they have under the hood for the klingons.

No one is denying that they are in control, thats pretty obvious but thanks for stating it anyway. That said, there is nothing wrong with people asking for some Klingon info so long as they do it in a mature way.

[Exist-nl-]

Damm whiners !!!! :)

Look at it like this :

1: Cryptic wants to have the population balanced.

2: If they released federation content and Klingon content at the same time the fed's content will overshadow the klingons because of fedaration being the focus of the startrek shows/movies.

3: If they save all the awesome klingons stuff for the end a lot of people are going to change their mind on the last moments and go for the KDF.

Be patience and use some common sense , posting this thread going to change anything.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

Damm whiners !!!!

Whining about "whiners" makes you a whiner too ;)

[Antagonist]

No one is denying that they are in control, thats pretty obvious but thanks for stating it anyway. That said, there is nothing wrong with people asking for some Klingon info so long as they do it in a mature way.

unfourtunately, this thread hardly qualifies as mature:(

[The.Grand.Nagus]

unfourtunately, this thread hardly qualifies as mature:(

Not saying I disagree, however just because the person who posts a thread may not be mature, doesnt mean that none of the people that reply are :o

[Antagonist]

Not saying I disagree, however just because the person who posts a thread may not be mature, doesnt mean that none of the people that reply are :o

very true. i simply ment the OP. sorry about the misunderstanding:)
....wow, civil conversation on this thread is rare, guess we just got lucky:D

[Ballping]

Hey, just because the Klingons have two ships just shows that their going to be the uber pvp faction. They only need two ships to whip the floor with the federation. ;-p

Seriously though, i understand where the op is comming from. Its kind of hard to plan your game play and what exactly you want to do in the game when it is released if you don't even know how your race will rank up, or what ships you will have access to when, etc. etc. etc. And its also very hard to get excited about the PvP when you know next to nothing about the second faction. Just imagine how you felt before all the flood of info on the federation was released.

That being said i would say to the OP to have patience. This game will either go one of two ways. Either Cryptic is with holding information about the Klingons because they have something super awesome in mind for them and they don't want other developer's stealing their game design ideas before their finalized, or Cryptic is hyping vapor ware that their making up as they go along and the game will just be thrown together at the last minute ie: Vanguard, Saga of Heroes.

Either way only time will tell.

[CaptainQuirk]

That's what the game is looking like right now. And from my point of view, it ain't Star Trek.

Why are you still here then? Don't let the door crit you on the way out.

Do us all a favor and pull your head out of your "Star Trek fans are STO's biggest problem" butt. You may be willing to settle for a half-baked game, but I am not, and neither are a lot of people.

I had a former boss who was fond of the phrase, "Perception is reality," and he would apply it when he'd tell an employee to stop goofing off. The employee would deny it, and he would say, Well, what I saw looked like googing off to me. And as far as I am concerned, perception is reality."

What I see when I look at everything we've been shown so far is a game that is missing EVERYTHING but federation combat mechanics. And as far as I am concerned, my perception is reality.


I take it that many of you haven't worked for a big corporation before. Let me tell you how it works. When the marketing people tell you not to spill the beans and you do, you lose your job!

Except for one thing... Cryptic has full creative control over this project. The license includes ALL of Star Trek. It's all Cryptic's doing. What to tell us. What to show us and When to do either. It is Cryptic hat has laid out the marketing cycle.

I'm fairly certain that Awen and Rekhan don't want to suddenly become unemployed, so no matter how many threads you guys start about this it ain't gonna get answered until marketing says it's time.

Do you work for Cryptic? No? I didn't think so.

Let me remind you that Cryptic has stated that STO WILL be out early next year. For me, early next year means between January 1 and April 1. Bit I am willing to give the benefit of the doubt and allow for the possibility that to Cryptic, Early next year means between Jan 1 and July 1. Taking both into account, we're looking at somewhere between 6 and 9 months.

In a YEAR'S time, all we've managed to be shown is Starfleet space and ground combat, and a bunch of space and ground screenshots with a very heavy starfleet slant.

If it looks like a duck, wattles like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then dammit, it's a duck!

[Exist-nl-]

Do us all a favor and pull your head out of your "Star Trek fans are STO's biggest problem" butt. You may be willing to settle for a half-baked game, but I am not, and neither are a lot of people.

I had a former boss who was fond of the phrase, "Perception is reality," and he would apply it when he'd tell an employee to stop goofing off. The employee would deny it, and he would say, Well, what I saw looked like googing off to me. And as far as I am concerned, perception is reality."

What I see when I look at everything we've been shown so far is a game that is missing EVERYTHING but federation combat mechanics. And as far as I am concerned, my perception is reality.




Except for one thing... Cryptic has full creative control over this project. The license includes ALL of Star Trek. It's all Cryptic's doing. What to tell us. What to show us and When to do either. It is Cryptic hat has laid out the marketing cycle.


You have just proven how narrow-minded you are. congratulations.

Maybe you should read my post since you obviously have no clue on how marketing works.

[CaptainQuirk]

You have just proven how narrow-minded you are. congratulations.

Maybe you should read my post since you obviously have no clue on how marketing works.

This is NOT the first MMO I have followed the full-term of development discussion. And one thing I do know is that Development develops a product and Marketing markets that product. You cannot market what doesn't exist, lest you run a strong risk of false advertising.

Marketing does not tell the dvelopers what to develop. They can only talk about what either has been developed or is CERTAIN to be developed within the timeframe allotted. Because Marketing has not said a WORD about anything other than Starfleet Combat, then from my point of view, it is because they have nothing else TO talk about because it either it will not be ready within the allotted timeframe or has not been developed yet.

Remember... A full year just to get the Starfleet combat aspect. That still leaves Starfleet science, Starfleet Exploration ans Starfleet Diplomacy. Then you have the klingon counterparts to these things as well... So at roughly six to nine months out from launch, the gameplay elements are all of one eighth completed.

I don't see how they are going to manage the other seven eighths within the allotted timeframe without rushing it, in which case, when it goes live, everything but Starfleet Combat will feel incomplete, as if it were just thrown in as an afterthought because they said it would be in.

I followed the entirety of SWG's development process. And that game launched grossly incomplete. And I am telling you the truth when I say that I am getting the same vibe with STO that I got from SWG. You can choose to believe me or not. In six to nine months, we'll all know. And if I am wrong, I will actually be a very happy person. I want to be wrong on this. But based on the paterns I observed with SWG and the patterns I am observing here, I do not think I will be.

[ibby1kanobi]

You know what, it's been stated a million times....THERES STILL SIX MONTHS WORTH OF INFO LEFT. We've only seen about 2 months worth of Fed news. So there's plenty of time to give the Klingons an equal showing. When it gets to the Kling cycle, we'll get plenty of news.

Having said that. I hope this is Starfleet Online.....and I hope it's all combat....and I hope Klingons are a blow off. I'm starting to get really annoyed by all the whining after you've been told WHY it's like this. I hope that statement annoyed you guys....then were even.

Save your complaints for when you get Kling info and your upset about certain aspects (like Fed players are doing now), instead of complaining about an apparent "lack" of info.

There's a reason the Feds came first in the PR cycle; because they are what the movies and tv shows and novels are based on. They are the face of Star Trek that people know. They have MORE to talk about with the Feds than the Klingons.

Your time is coming. Just be PATIENT.

For the record, I'm planning on playing both factions, and I'm not bias one way or another. I just don't have a six year old mentality like some people who keep crying "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme".

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I just don't have a six year old mentality like some people who keep crying "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme".

Neither do alot of the people asking for Klingon info. There is nothing "childish" or "immature" about someone wanting to know about more than one side of the game, although it IS childish and immature for you to bash them just because you dont agree with them.

[CaptainQuirk]

You know what, it's been stated a million times....THERES STILL SIX MONTHS WORTH OF INFO LEFT. We've only seen about 2 months worth of Fed news. So there's plenty of time to give the Klingons an equal showing. When it gets to the Kling cycle, we'll get plenty of news.

Having said that. I hope this is Starfleet Online.....and I hope it's all combat....and I hope Klingons are a blow off. I'm starting to get really annoyed by all the whining after you've been told WHY it's like this. I hope that statement annoyed you guys....then were even.

Save your complaints for when you get Kling info and your upset about certain aspects (like Fed players are doing now), instead of complaining about an apparent "lack" of info.

There's a reason the Feds came first in the PR cycle; because they are what the movies and tv shows and novels are based on. They are the face of Star Trek that people know. They have MORE to talk about with the Feds than the Klingons.

Your time is coming. Just be PATIENT.

For the record, I'm planning on playing both factions, and I'm not bias one way or another. I just don't have a six year old mentality like some people who keep crying "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme".

About three months before SWG launched, someone said almost the same exact thing you did when people were voicing their very passionate concerns that Player Cities, Vehicles and Mounts were not going t omae it in, because they were not being discussed except to hype them to death...

...Two weeks before the game went live, SOE admitted that they were not far enough along in the development of those systems to be able to make launch with them... Imagine... th three key elements that were used to hype the game and get as many people interested were the last systems to be developed.

Oh, and when that announcement came down, the person on the SWG forums who said pretty much what you just did totally went off on SOE and had most of the community behind him.

And by the way... that person was ME!

[Exist-nl-]

This is NOT the first MMO I have followed the full-term of development discussion. And one thing I do know is that Development develops a product and Marketing markets that product. You cannot market what doesn't exist, lest you run a strong risk of false advertising.



Then you SHOULD know that just dumping information is a very bad idea especially when not all things are finished. And we aren't even in beta yet ....

And marketing doesn't have to release info on anything that gets developed like stated in my previous post they focus on federation first because that's what startrek is most known for but to draw players to the KDF they are probably going to promote and market the Klingon big time later in the Pr cycle.

And if you have been tracking other mmo's in development then you should know that complaining about a "lack of information before beta has even started is useless.





Neither do alot of the people asking for Klingon info. There is nothing "childish" or "immature" about someone wanting to know about more than one side of the game, although it IS childish and immature for you to bash them just because you dont agree with them.

Hmm he said some people not all .........

[Exist-nl-]

SOE screws up everything so comparing them to cryptic is hillarious.

[CaptainQuirk]

Then you SHOULD know that just dumping information is a very bad idea especially when not all things are finished. And we aren't even in beta yet ....

And marketing doesn't have to release info on anything that gets developed like stated in my previous post they focus on federation first because that's what startrek is most known for but to draw players to the KDF they are probably going to promote and market the Klingon big time later in the Pr cycle.

And if you have been tracking other mmo's in development then you should know that complaining about a "lack of information before beta has even started is useless.

But here's the thing... Every MMO that I have follwed where they don't talk about half of their gameplay during the development process ends up feeling like the undiscussed half is rushed or incomplete.

Lord of the Rings Online, on the other hand, was an example of how information should be revealed. They talked about the different aspects they planned to have. They even released charts and diagrams of how the Crafting system was going to work, where the different crafting professions would overlap resulting in interdependency.

They did roll out class reveals over time, but they always talked about how the mechanics would work, and how fundamentally those mechanics were being tied to Tolkien's work. And they started talking about these things early on.

How much do we know, fundamentally, about STO?

[The.Grand.Nagus]

Hmm he said some people not all .........

He said: I just don't have a six year old mentality like some people who keep crying "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme".

However, not ONE person on these forums has actualy said "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme", so either he has no idea what he's talking about, or he's talking about anyone who would like to see info about the other faction in the game.

[CaptainQuirk]

SOE screws up everything so comparing them to cryptic is hillarious.

Let me be blunt so you'll get my point... I've seen the opinions of people away from these forums concerning what they think of CO. It ain't all that and a bag of chips to hear them tell it. People from these forums who tested CO and voiced concerns about how closely STO is going to systemically tie with it had their threads locked.

Oh, and COH and COV were such raging successes that they had to be sold to another company...

[Drexxus3d]

All you people are going to accomplish with your whinning is they won't release ANY INFORMATION AT ALL if you keep it up.

They are doing starfleet first, get over it. When they make something, they tell us and show us. But if you keep whinning you want exactly equal klingon content at the same times, they can't deliver that because they aren't focusing on klingons yet, all it will mean is media blackout and they won't be telling us anything at all for fear of offending the hypersensitive klingons.

I mean my god, you people are supposed to be a warrior race and all you do is sit around crying like babies.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

All you people are going to accomplish with your whinning is they won't release ANY INFORMATION AT ALL if you keep it up.

Basicly, you just said that Cryptic is so unprofessional that they will refuse to release info just to spite what some people on the forums are doing. Way to insult the Devs :rolleyes:

[Drexxus3d]

Basicly, you just said that Cryptic is so unprofessional that they will refuse to release info just to spite what some people on the forums are doing. Way to insult the Devs :rolleyes:

You missed the entire point, don't try so poorly to twist my words around.

If it's so offensive and terrible and awful for klingon players to keep receiving information about the federation that they are working on and no info about the klingons which they are not working on yet, they might just stop releasing information. Not to SPITE anyone but to avoid "offending" the hypersensitive klingon players who believe they should be designing both factions simultaneously and inefficiently just to meet their media hungry needs. It wouldn't be the first time something like this has happened, people just need to stop whinning and wait.

If you convince them giving info on the federation but not klingons is unfair, what do you think they're gonna do? They don't have all the klingon content ready to go yet, so what is their alternative?

[The.Grand.Nagus]

You missed the entire point, don't try so poorly to twist my words around.

I didnt "twist" anything. Here is what you said, in case you forgot:

"All you people are going to accomplish with your whinning is they won't release ANY INFORMATION AT ALL if you keep it up."

That is an insult to the Devs, because you are saying they are so unprofessional that they will refuse to release game info just to spite the people who are "complaining" on the forums.

/epic fail

[karl-just-karl]

Meh. All of this would be a lot less heated if they had just said "hey, there are a lot fewer ready made models of Klingon stuff so we will have to be playing catch up on that side of things" rather than couching the thing with talk of marketing cycles and the like. People see through that kind of spin pretty easily and start to imagine conspiracies around every corner.

[Varrangian]

Oh, and COH and COV were such raging successes that they had to be sold to another company...

I think you'd better check your facts before spreading falsities...

[Peregrine_Falcon]

Do us all a favor and pull your head out of your "Star Trek fans are STO's biggest problem" butt. You may be willing to settle for a half-baked game, but I am not, and neither are a lot of people.
It has nothing to do with that. It has to do with the fact that every post of yours that I've read is critical of STO and its devs. You keep making these big sweeping generalizations about a game that you have never played.

I had a former boss who was fond of the phrase, "Perception is reality," and he would apply it when he'd tell an employee to stop goofing off. The employee would deny it, and he would say, Well, what I saw looked like googing off to me. And as far as I am concerned, perception is reality."

What I see when I look at everything we've been shown so far is a game that is missing EVERYTHING but federation combat mechanics. And as far as I am concerned, my perception is reality.
I agree that perception often is reality, but you're criticizing a game that isn't even done yet. Have you ever seen a pie before it's baked and then criticized the chef because it doesn't look edible? Because that's what you're doing here. STO isn't done cooking yet. When it's done or nearly so then I'll accept your criticism at face value. Until then you don't know any more about STO than the rest of us. And none of us have seen enough of the finished product yet to make an accurate judgement.

[Drexxus3d]

Meh. All of this would be a lot less heated if they had just said "hey, there are a lot fewer ready made models of Klingon stuff so we will have to be playing catch up on that side of things" rather than couching the thing with talk of marketing cycles and the like. People see through that kind of spin pretty easily and start to imagine conspiracies behind every corner.

I'll say this again here in this thread. The developers are employees, they do not run the company. They can only make the game, they aren't allowed to freely spill their guts about all the information in the game to us. They are under their own forms of NDAs and are only allowed to tell us things the company's PR department allows them to. I'm sure zinc would love to get on here and spend hours explaining every nuance of the game design process and whats in and what isn't and so on but he cannot do that. You cannot blame the developers for this, it isn't their fault.

People just need to sit back, relax, take a deep breath, and be patient.

Having Klingons and a second faction in the game is one of their major selling points, they aren't just going to scrap klingons or make them sub-par people, just relax. Honestly I wish they had done klingons first instead of federation, because the second faction is always more polished as the team has been working together longer at that point and has a better idea of what they're doing.

[Sunborn]

While I do not think there is a fundamental problem with Cryptic wanting to wait to release the info about Klingons, I do think we need to stop calling the Klingon players whiners.

I'll admit, I'd like to see some Klingon info, but I feel that if Cryptic wants to wait then so be it. In all these threads asking for more Klingon info, they have only expressed that we need to wait, so it seems very likely that no one is going to change their minds here.

[karl-just-karl]

I'll say this again here in this thread. The developers are employees, they do not run the company. They can only make the game, they aren't allowed to freely spill their guts about all the information in the game to us. They are under their own forms of NDAs and are only allowed to tell us things the company's PR department allows them to. I'm sure zinc would love to get on here and spend hours explaining every nuance of the game design process and whats in and what isn't and so on but he cannot do that. You cannot blame the developers for this, it isn't their fault.

Okay...then by "they" I mean whoever made the choice to put it in those terms; Devs, marketing people, doesn't matter which. It's a silly way to do things. People just don't buy it.

[Peregrine_Falcon]

Oh, and COH and COV were such raging successes that they had to be sold to another company...
Which just goes to show just exactly how much you don't know. Cryptic sold CoH/V to NCSoft because they wanted to be free to create and market a competing product.

While we don't know how much money Cryptic has received over the years from CoH/V, we do know that in one of it's stockholder reports NCSoft publicly stated that they have made over $100 MILLION US DOLLARS from CoH/V since it was launched. So yeah. CoH/V really hasn't made much money at all. It's only managed to make over $100 Million US, and it's managed to survive while other MMOs have been shut down.

Way to make your point about what an MMO expert you are. Next time try doing some research before you insert foot into mouth.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

can see theres no point arguing with someone that is so ignorant and stubborn simultaneously.

Always funny to see children insult people they disagree with. Thanks for the laugh :o

[CaptainQuirk]

I agree that perception often is reality, but you're criticizing a game that isn't even done yet. Have you ever seen a pie before it's baked and then criticized the chef because it doesn't look edible? Because that's what you're doing here. STO isn't done cooking yet. When it's done or nearly so then I'll accept your criticism at face value. Until then you don't know any more about STO than the rest of us. And none of us have seen enough of the finished product yet to make an accurate judgement.

I would criticize a chef if I do not see the key ingredients that go into a meal even on the counter, in the pantry or in the pot cooking. I see STO as it is now as a meal being prepared with no seasoning or side dishes.

More accurately, I see it as a choice between the brown food with grey sauce or the grey food with brown sauce.

[karl-just-karl]

You haven't even tasted it yet...

[CaptainQuirk]

Which just goes to show just exactly how much you don't know. Cryptic sold CoH/V to NCSoft because they wanted to be free to create and market a competing product.

While we don't know how much money Cryptic has received over the years from CoH/V, we do know that in one of it's stockholder reports NCSoft publicly stated that they have made over $100 MILLION US DOLLARS from CoH/V since it was launched. So yeah. CoH/V really hasn't made much money at all. It's only managed to make over $100 Million US, and it's managed to survive while other MMOs have been shut down.

Way to make your point about what an MMO expert you are. Next time try doing some research before you insert foot into mouth.

You nailed me.

But then I never play CoX, and never really followed Cryptic's work until now. I apologize for proceeding under a false assumption... The reviews I had read of COX were that it was a mediocre MMO at best and a boring exercise in repetition at worst. I am glad to have the record set straight...

[The.Grand.Nagus]

You nailed me.

But then I never play CoX, and never really followed Cryptic's work until now. I apologize for proceeding under a false assumption... The reviews I had read of COX were that it was a mediocre MMO at best and a boring exercise in repetition at worst. I am glad to have the record set straight...

COX is painfully repetitive, that much is true. Been a year since I played though.

[Peregrine_Falcon]

COX is painfully repetitive, that much is true. Been a year since I played though.
*SIGH*

I really really wish that I could vehemently disagree with you on that. But I just can't.

It's a great game and all, the classes and powers and other non-combat options are great fun. But 99% of the missions utilize the same 100 or so maps. After a few months of play you get to where you've seen every mission map a thousand times and you know where everything is at.

It's the game's one weakness, and the reason that I'm not playing it anymore.

[Drexxus3d]

Okay...then by "they" I mean whoever made the choice to put it in those terms; Devs, marketing people, doesn't matter which. It's a silly way to do things. People just don't buy it.

Well I don't like it much, for the simple fact we aren't getting as much information as we'd like. But I'm not sure i'd call it a silly way to do things, you couldn't really make that kind of assessment without being in the industry first hand and seeing it and how it works. Presumably PR people make their choices based on projected sales. It's a proven fact people get more upset and rant more about getting information early then seeing it changed multiple times than them not getting information at all until it's finalized. That is why it's industry standard to be so tight-lipped about everything.

Even though the PR people suck, to us, for keeping information from us, ultimately they're doing what they believe is in the best interest of the financial success of the game so you can't really fault them for that. Any of us may think we would do things differently, but actually being in that situation, with that job and responsibility, maybe we would be doing the same things they are. Everyone is just angry about the lack of klingon info and are just looking for people to blame and take that anger out on, but that isn't going to help anything here. I want to know more about their designs and ship classes as well, but I understand why it isn't available yet and that part does make sense. Everyones just so excited to play this game, it's easy to turn that energy into other things like aggression.

Always funny to see children insult people they disagree with. Thanks for the laugh :o

There you go again, baseless assumptions and ignorance. I'm not a child nor have I given you any indication of which, it's just your mediocre way to attempt to insult me and you haven't disagreed with me, all you have done is poorly attempt to twist my words around to try to imply I was saying something that I did not say. That isn't disagreement. Only thing I disagreed with is what you are trying to convince yourself of that I supposedly said. I know you're arrogant and everything, but believe me when I say I know what I said and intended better than you do. So keep your insults and ignorance to yourself, it doesn't interest me and it also has no place in this thread.

*SIGH*

I really really wish that I could vehemently disagree with you on that. But I just can't.

It's a great game and all, the classes and powers and other non-combat options are great fun. But 99% of the missions utilize the same 100 or so maps. After a few months of play you get to where you've seen every mission map a thousand times and you know where everything is at.

It's the game's one weakness, and the reason that I'm not playing it anymore.

Yeah, by the time you're level 15 you've seen all the "random" maps, they just put new random bad guys in them. It's a real shame. It would be a lot more interesting as a game if it wasn't so limited in scope like that. =/ It actually has one of the attributes I really love in a MMO, which is the a pet class that can use multiple pets at once.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

There you go again, baseless assumptions and ignorance.

Here (http://treesflowersbirds.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/211_kleenex.jpg), you go. That should help :o

[Wardog00]

*SIGH*

I really really wish that I could vehemently disagree with you on that. But I just can't.

It's a great game and all, the classes and powers and other non-combat options are great fun. But 99% of the missions utilize the same 100 or so maps. After a few months of play you get to where you've seen every mission map a thousand times and you know where everything is at.

It's the game's one weakness, and the reason that I'm not playing it anymore.



The funny thing about the last couple post are, they are completely true. I left CoH &CoV because of the repetitive instances and mobs through out the game. I went to WoW (a game that got it right.) I decided to give Champions Online a try to my disappointment. CO is a complete spawn of CoH with horrible Cartoon strip graphics. It's the same BS load screens, BS quests and crappy fights. I pray that STO is not like this crap game. Like i said before I play WoW and have 5 accounts for me, my wife and kids. I am fully ready to invest my money and time in STO (being a huge ST fan) but, if it is as horrible as CO, I'll spend my cash on Star Wars: Old Republic.

[DarkOrion69]

Can't we all show a little more patience and respect the business decisions of Cryptic?

They will release STO information in whatever manner, amount, or content they choose. We could be diplomatically asking for Klingon information if we are truly desirous of gaining their cooperation. We could refrain from acting like we are entitled to Klingon information because we belong to a certain Klingon Fleet that will remain Khale....umm nameless :)

Together, as a community, we need to just chillax as another poster opined. We need to stop jumping at shadows and making assumptions about 'the real reason' Cryptic is withholding Klingon information. Let us all accept in good faith that they are being genuine and demonstrate patience with their ambitious work on a complex MMORPG like STO. Let's just wait and see...okay folks?

[Drexxus3d]

Can't we all show a little more patience and respect the business decisions of Cryptic?

They will release STO information in whatever manner, amount, or content they choose. We could be diplomatically asking for Klingon information if we are truly desirous of gaining their cooperation. We could refrain from acting like we are entitled to Klingon information because we belong to a certain Klingon Fleet that will remain Khale....umm nameless :)

Together, as a community, we need to just chillax as another poster opined. We need to stop jumping at shadows and making assumptions about 'the real reason' Cryptic is withholding Klingon information. Let us all accept in good faith that they are being genuine and demonstrate patience with their ambitious work on a complex MMORPG like STO. Let's just wait and see...okay folks?

I think the klingon players would rather get out virtual soap boxes, and stand on them and preach about how oppressed their people are and how they are discriminated against and living in an unfair world, etc etc. Rather than just ask nicely and be patient. :)

[Ballping]

Hey guys, i've noticed a few people are kinda getting hot under the collar in here, please remember we're all adults here and can agree to disagree without resorting to name calling.

That being said i just got confirmation from one of the devs in irc that they are working on some developer diaries for us. No eta on them but those should atleast give us a bit more info to chew on.

[CaptainQuirk]

Hey guys, i've noticed a few people are kinda getting hot under the collar in here, please remember we're all adults here and can agree to disagree without resorting to name calling.

That being said i just got confirmation from one of the devs in irc that they are working on some developer diaries for us. No eta on them but those should atleast give us a bit more info to chew on.

If you are talking to them now, ask if the diaries are going to be more about combat, or finally about other gameplay elements... Klingon or otherwise...

[Ballping]

If you are talking to them now, ask if the diaries are going to be more about combat, or finally about other gameplay elements... Klingon or otherwise...

It was one dev that took the time to answer that they were indeed working on them, but he was not personally working on it. I however would suggest that you hop on irc yourself and ask, you never know if they'll answer or not.

[andrewprofit]

Is this game called Star Trek Online or Starfleet Online?

Sure that the shows concentrated on the Federations (because they were following humans) but Star Trek Online is supposed to be a 2 Faction GAME.

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

Sure Cryptic employees keep on saying that the Klingon info is coming in the next PR cycle. But no date or even an estimation of date have been give. Development wise, If you don't have the Klingon Faction figured out that is fine just say so, we don't need things sugar coated. Non-development wise, there is no excuse because this is a game based on Star Trek Online not Starfleet.

There is no reason to think they must develop as much content for other faction other than star fleet. Since this is not a new IP like wow with the horde and the alliance and each race must be balanced and equal. The Star Trek IP is primarly about Starfleet the fact that they will be other factions just makes it that much better.

Even the ship list need not be equal or similar between factions. I would rather just have the ships we have seen in the IP for the Klingons than new ships to match exactly the federation ships. I know the game is not a sim its a game but a game does not need to be equally fair to be fun. If pvp is only a small part of the game why orient the whole game around it?

[alucard1]

Having 2 team of 10 people each working Klingon and Starfleet (like 2 games at the same time) that somehow have to come together

VS.

Paying 1 team of 20 people to focus mostly on completing Starfleet first, then having the same team go primarily to work on Klingon.

No brainer. It'd be more difficult to have two teams working on completely different stuff then having to somehow collaborate to make sure both teams were coming up with equivalent level stuff, than it would be to have one team finish one side, know how that's setup, then make a comparable counterpart using all the things learned the first time.

Really, the Starfleet side is like the prototype and the Klingon side will benefit from all the experience and realizations that took place making the Starfleet portion. So, in essence, Klingons will probably have more solid gameplay and more thought-out ships.

Fixed ;)


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This...

To the OP, and the others in BoK... at least you get to play your desired Faction upon launch... *Some* of us won't be able to do that unless/until there is an expansion released...

As has already been said.. they will release the information when they have the information to release. Posting these b*tch threads about the lack of updates/information accomplishes nothing but making the BoK look like a bunch of whingers...

All that being said, and despite what has been implied here in the thread, 'well, you're FEDERATION, you don't care that their isn't Klingon content' is both rather unfair and inaccurate. I myself will be playing Federation until the Romulans are allowed their own expansion... but I have stated before in other threads like this, here.. and on other forums on the net that I sympathize with the Klingon fans on the lack of info... but the fact remains... they will release the information when they have the information to release.

Saith

[Loekii]

This issue has already been addressed.

They are focusing on the Federation side first, and have decided to hold off on posting Klingon Content until later.

We may not all like that response, but that is the answer.

They will be tweaking the website in the coming months - to the release version. Hopefully that will be more 'neutral' -- showing both Klingon and Starfleet aspects.

[Arsmajka]

He said: I just don't have a six year old mentality like some people who keep crying "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme".

However, not ONE person on these forums has actualy said "Me Me Me' "Gimme Gimme Gimme", so either he has no idea what he's talking about, or he's talking about anyone who would like to see info about the other faction in the game.

Me Me Me , Gimmie Gimmie Gimmie :mad:
Heheh sorry couldn't pass that up lol

[TFO_KillSwitch]

come on people do you all have to turn this in to a bashing each othere fest

[Kaybok]

As I feared, this is the same thing that happened in City of Villains... a feeling of one-sided development. I understand the reasons that have been stated as to why we don't have more Klingon related material. I don't like it... I would like more material myself and I'm going to be patient. I have no problems there.

What I have a problem with is the demeanor of some of these responses to the OP and Klingon RP'ers. Like I told the Klingons who strongly argued against one of my theads, we need to consider the human beings on the other end - not this "haha klingons who cares stop moaning" stuff. These guys are arguing NO HARDER than YOU DID in whatever thread where you wanted your favorite starfleet ship to be Tier 4 and not Tier 3!!! Or the other thread where you didn't want something in game because it RUINED YOUR IMMERSION!!!!

This is an issue these guys are passionate about. I'm 100% sure the devs would love to jump in here and settle this issue but they can't because of PR and the NDAs. This thread would have been locked long ago if the community guys didn't want them to voice their opinions. I wish people would be more civil and supportive here. Consider how other people feel and maybe the next thread won't look so bad. We are better than some of these posts.

[Tirus]

Deep within the depths of a Romulan Star Empire cloaked Raptor a conversation continues….

Tirus: It was easier than even we thought possible. Cryptic never saw it coming.

Vaebn: Yes, they continue to underestimate the Tal Shiar.

Tirus: True, once the fools fell for our deep cover agent’s suggestion that the Cryptic’s Klingon development team take a much deserved break and head to a nearby drinking establishment for a few hours of friendly Cryptic Klingon team camaraderie the rest was inevitable.

Vaebn: Our deep cover agent followed your instructions to the letter with satisfying results. Having her start the argument with the heads of the Cryptic Klingon team regarding which was better…Klingon smooth foreheads or Klingon foreheads with ridges was brilliant. But the pièce de résistance was leaving four Klingon reproduction bat’leths on the bar counter nearby.

Tirus: Yes, the carnage soon ensued with our operative quickly excusing herself stating she was late for her Star Trek book club meeting. Having her carry a Tal Shiar reproduction “The Physics of Star Trek” book was a nice touch.

Vaebn: Yes, yes, our operative Stephen Hawkings has just transmitted coded broadcasts from Earth regarding a highly unusual and bloody bar fight. There were no survivors.

Tirus: Good, good. With Cryptic’s Klingon development team wiped out all we need to do is have our operative continue with the rest of her mission.

Vaebn: Now that she has erased all of the Cryptic Klingon development team’s progress from Cryptic’s computers, we need just transmit our own Tal Shiar development team’s Romulan Star Empire work onto her Cryptic computer.

Tirus: Once Cryptic realizes their Klingon development team’s work is irretrievable, we will have our deep cover operative casually mention the progress she has made in her spare time regarding a Cryptic Romulan faction. If our plans come to fruition it will be the Romulan Star Empire and not the Klingons who will be facing the despicable Federation in the launch of Cryptic’s new game. Muhahahahahaha (cough, cough) hahahaaaaaaaa.

Vaebn: You should really lay off those RSE clovien cigarettes. I’ve been telling you forever, they are going to be the death of you.

Tirus: Yeah, I’ve been trying to cut back, but the stress of this job is killing me.

Vaebn: I hear you.

[Veglargh]

Simply put,

- We know there is Klingon material from the original trailer video.
Vorcha attacking a fed ship
Several shots of Klingon Raiding parties
-We know there is Klingon material from the other various videos
Klingon ships fighting ( many of the other Klingon ships)

There IS Klingon Material out there Period! So one must ask why is Cryptic not releasing anymore information. Only Cryptic can answer that question. However,they released the information that there is going to be 2 playable factions in this game. So, therefore would it not make sense to promote both sides equally ..or at least as much as possible, that is not the case here. There are those who have said that Star Trek is seen only threw the eyes of the Federation. While this is true, this game was ment to be played as a Klingon , not just Star fleet, or else they would just name it Star Fleet Online. So as the Federation outnumbers Klingons would it not make sense to break the marketing strategy and promote the Klingons with new exciting ships and information to even out the numbers ? With out the Klingons there is no pvp for the Federation.With out Klingons the material that Cryptic has put so much time and effort into will be wasted. As a business neglecting these facts in my opinion will turn STO into another SWG , to just another MMO failure.


As far as us "Klingons" ranting ,be cry baby's, whining, emotional. I can say that the lack of Klingon material is a insulting. Let me list them for you again....

So far Cryptic has overly discriminated against the Klingon Faction in all aspects of the game's presentation. The majority if not everything has presented in the federations point of view. Been too quite for too long, too much is too much.
-The Website
-The PM System
-The Screenshots
-Movie Trailer
-Game Trailer
-Ships of the line ( 2 out of 8)
-Ship List
-Kobayashi Maru (1-2 out of 28)
-Even the description of Fleet Registration Station says "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!"

The only thing that has done an "ok" job has been the recent Paths to 2409. (Thank you Alivet or who ever is writing those).

These insulting gestures ,normally we would just sit by and say nothing , but this most recent ship listing struck the final blow. You cannot deni the evidence! Its not just new material either the Kobayashi Maru has had very little Klingon material. How many Screen shots are there ? And how many of them have Klingon shots in them?

All we want is simply put, more equality in all aspects of the game. This one sided stuff needs to stop. More Klingon screen shots, more Klingon Kobayashi Maru, and plz change the Fleet Registration from "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet?"....Thank you for your time ....

Daganick hit it straight in the head with this post. Those that keep telling us to be patient why shouldn't the Klingon Faction Community have?:

-More pics of ships that Cryptic has already shown (such as the Vo'cha, BOP, Vo'Quv, Raptor, Neghvar) instead of countless shots of Akiras and Mirandas

-A less Fed style website (a neutral looking site) or a Klingon Skin looking website (it is possible they have done in CO which is the same site "engine/design"

-More community activities oriented to Klingons- Out of 28 Kobayashi Morus only 2 are Klingon oriented

- the Fleet Forum Registration Description from the current "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!" to "finest crew in Starfleet and KDF" or just take out "putting together the fines crew in Starfleet".


Ladies and Gentleman, the topic is very simple. Lack of Klingon Respect. We are NOT asking for them to release "Klingon Game Features Now". We are saying that we want balance representation. I bet if the role was reversed many Fed faction would be asking the same. It is not that hard to at least make the presentation of the game seem unbiased

The Topic of Klingon Material still been developed is a dead horse. So in Awen's words "knock it off". If you are not able to understand a simple topic and reply to it don't bother posting.

[Kaybok]

thats the thing! were not really asking for "equal", per say, it's just that it's so darn one sided! ahhhwell, guess were beating a dead horse...

You know what... My 1st post here was a little skewed because as soon as anyone asks about Klingon info the immediate reaction is to jump on the "Klingon info not ready yet. Be patient." bandwagon.

I see now you are really talking about the pure marketing job Cryptic has done thus far and how it has been very Starfleet oriented. This has nothing to do with the amount of Klingon gameplay info that has been released. I agree with you guys that more could have be done to draw more players into the game specifically to play the Klingon faction. And the City of Heroe's / City of Villains disparity issue still applies because their marketing is mostly hero side oriented. They got a little better but most players are drawn to the hero side by their marketing efforts.

In any case, I support the Klingon's view on this. The website is being redesigned right now. Maybe one of the web devs can jump in here and tell us if the new web site will have more marketing towards bringing players into the Klingon faction. That would help a great deal.

[gogarty]

I think one of the major concerns from Cryptic is not the lack of content released for Klingons, it's opening these forums as early as they did. Ever since Cryptic launched the site the forums have been active and the rants began. The fact of the matter is that the game is still being developed. If the game was launched right now with only a handful of KDF ships but a whole list of FED ships I would understand everyone's plight.

But the fact of the matter is that Cryptic has to keep a good PR about the game and they do so by releasing little tid-bits of the game here and there to keep people enticed. They're not saying "the game is only x% completed and here is our progress to an exact written specification". The main point of the PR staff is to keep an active interest in the game while using as little details as possible while at the same time not releasing too much and telling the world that the game is playable now.

Can people please stop complaining about Klingons until there is actually more info about them released? Or how about we wait until Beta and everyone can actually see the balance issues and then complain. And until people actually start paying for Cryptic's services as it pertains to playing the game, then please stfu. Be greatful for the fact that their PR team is even willing to do semi-regular updates with the information we have right now.

Yes, we know the devs can regularly log into the game, as it stands now, and test their development so far. What's to say that there isn't a ton more content on the Klingon side and they're just waiting, as they have already stated for months, to release it? For all anyone knows the website and focus of the PR staff could shift entirely towards nothing but the KDF side here soon and we'll hear little to no info about the remaining FED ships or any other details as it pertains to the Federation side.

Just wait like everyone else for the development to continue to progress and see how it goes from there.

[erkenbrand001]

I would like to thank all those people who actually have read the posts and realize WE ARE NOT TALKING ABOUT NEW GAME CONTENT. We are talking about balanced representation , as Veglargh put it

-More pics of ships that Cryptic has already shown (such as the Vo'cha, BOP, Vo'Quv, Raptor, Neghvar) instead of countless shots of Akiras and Mirandas

-A less Fed style website (a neutral looking site) or a Klingon Skin looking website (it is possible they have done in CO which is the same site "engine/design"

-More community activities oriented to Klingons- Out of 28 Kobayashi Morus only 2 are Klingon oriented

- the Fleet Forum Registration Description from the current "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!" to "finest crew in Starfleet and KDF" or just take out "putting together the fines crew in Starfleet".


So lets reviews ......we are not talking about new game content ,we are talking about as I said prevesly, balanced representation. I'm sure that this will be stated many many times more in the future, but I guess its my turn to post about it. Please read the posts people, its not that hard.

Secondly , I would like to thank the mature players who have posted and actually have posted valid points and facts even if it didn't support the OP. I thank you for not posting belittling and degrading remarks. We believe we have valid points here , and we want other people to post there thoughts and there opinions as well. This cant happen if people act like children because the MODS will close this thread if they do. Which I suspect is their initial reason for posting why they are posting these unwarranted remarks. I am sure that this will also be stated several times more in this thread. Thank you for those that have taken the time to read all the posts and added there constructive points of view.

[TheRealNaveed]

A Klingon skin might be cool, but not a de-Trekking of the way the site looks. When people go to this site they need to be reminded of Star Trek, and for most people that will be a Star-Fleetish kind of style. For the skin, though, that's actually a lot of design time and I doubt it would be used by more than even 10-20% of users.

[Pontious]

Actually, there already was a Starfleet Online ... it was a MUD that was in exsistance from about 1996 to 2002.

And I think we've now begun to see how PMS'ish those Klingon, and Klingon-faction races can really be. I see a Wookie-strike in the making all over again ....

[erriku]

This thread is becoming even more ridiculous.

[J.L.Picard]

for all i care they could remove them from the game they wouldnt be miseed.

[FlabaFlopesa]

the way the game is going at the moment, I wouldn't be surprised if its called Starfleet online - however, saying this, the next trailer will probably be a Klingon propaganda film!

[Loekii]

Ladies and Gentleman, the topic is very simple. Lack of Klingon Respect. We are NOT asking for them to release "Klingon Game Features Now". We are saying that we want balance representation. I bet if the role was reversed many Fed faction would be asking the same. It is not that hard to at least make the presentation of the game seem unbiased

The Topic of Klingon Material still been developed is a dead horse. So in Awen's words "knock it off". If you are not able to understand a simple topic and reply to it don't bother posting.
As a Klingon player, I would say you have long left the 'asking' aspect, and are now just demanding.

We have inquired about the lack of klingon content on the webspace before, and they have told us that they will be adding stuff in the future.

That is asking.

This post is simply dismissing that as an acceptable answer and making demands.

That is demanding.

It is their site. They have stated they have their own schedule for releasing Klingon content, and for upgrading the website.

It doesn't matter that it doesn't work for you. It works for Cryptic, and it works for those of us Klingon players that are fine with waiting for that schedule.

[erriku]

As a Klingon player, I would say you have long left the 'asking' aspect, and are now just demanding.

We have inquired about the lack of klingon content on the webspace before, and they have told us that they will be adding stuff in the future.

That is asking.

This post is simply dismissing that as an acceptable answer and making demands.

That is demanding.

It is their site. They have stated they have their own schedule for releasing Klingon content, and for upgrading the website.

It doesn't matter that it doesn't work for you. It works for Cryptic, and it works for those of us Klingon players that are fine with waiting for that schedule.


^^^^^^^^ This!

I agree. Some peoples sense of entitlement here is disgusting.

[Loekii]

^^^^^^^^ This!

I agree. Some peoples sense of entitlement here is disgusting.

I agree.

It is fine to critique the website layout.

It is quite another to demand change, even though Cryptic has explained that we need to just wait.

Cryptic has their own schedule and plans.

They have asked us to wait. So we wait.

[FlabaFlopesa]

To be fair, I don't really care, a ship is a ship to me, it just gives me something to cause trouble with!

[CapnBludd]

As has been said before, the ubernerds ruin things for the rest of us.

Relax, go wax your ridges and play with your targ, info will come later. And the whole representation rant, like it was some real world racial thing is insane. I fully intend to have a Klingon char myself as do MANY other people, but most of us aren't raving and frothing about it. Relax and have some more bloodwine. Don't be such a petaQ.

[Demyk]

As a player who wants to play two Bynar, we would like to protest against both other unfairly promoted federation races, as well as the Klingions, and even the Romulans and Cardies.

After all we have not been mentioned even TWICE in the Path to 2409!

[Hagon]

You darn right some have a sense of entitlement. Some have been loyally following, and promoting, this game for well over a year now, and have essentially been treated to just a smidge of info about what is supposed to be an equal part of the game.

So what if Cryptic had a schedule? Their schedule obviously is faulty and they should be listening to their community and adjusting it. So far they haven't been.

I'm not sure where people's heads are at sometimes with some of these games that are in development. They suck up and act like it's a privilege that Cryptic is making this game they can PAY to play, and we should all be good little lap dogs and wait for our bones. :rolleyes: Yet, as recent history has clearly shown us, all that kind of sycophantic attitude gets us is arrogant developers that put out a crappy game.

Truth is, Cryptic has used us. Sure we have been more than willing to be used, but that doesn't change the FACT they need us here, all of us regardless of what we're going to play, showing activity and eagerness to play this game (if you don't think our activity here helped them with the Atari deal, and continues to help them in many other ways, then you're just naive). This isn't a situation where we're supposed to sit with our paws up begging and jumping up rolling in the air when we get a little pat on the head (even though some on their team really seem to think that's how it works). The onus is completely on them to keep us interested, and frankly they've been doing a very poor job at keeping the majority of the community that intends to play Klingon satisfied, and have shown a somewhat arrogant attitude when explaining why they have not.

[erriku]

You darn right some have a sense of entitlement. Some have been loyally following, and promoting, this game for well over a year now, and have essentially been treated to just a smidge of info about what is supposed to be an equal part of the game.

So what if Cryptic had a schedule? Their schedule obviously is faulty and they should be listening to their community and adjusting it. I'm not sure where people's heads are at sometimes with some of these games that are in development. They suck up and act like it's a privilege that Cryptic is making this game they can PAY to play, and we should all be good little lap dogs and wait for our bones. :rolleyes: Yet, as recent history has clearly shown us, all that kind of sycophantic attitude gets us is arrogant developers that put out a crappy game.

Truth is, Cryptic has used us. Sure we have been more than willing to be used, but that doesn't change the FACT they need us here, all of us regardless of what we're going to play, showing activity and eagerness to play this game (if you don't think our activity here helped them with the Atari deal, and continues to help them in many other ways, then you're just naive). This isn't a situation where we're supposed to sit with our paws up begging. The onus is completely on them to keep us interested, and frankly they've been doing a very poor job at keeping the majority of the community that intends to play Klingon satisfied, and have shown a somewhat arrogant attitude when explaining why they have not.

You have no idea what you are talking about and are just spewing out conspiracy theories. No matter how long you have followed the game, you are entitled to nothing. It is not your game. You haven't even paid for it yet. Even if you had paid for it, you still are entitled to nothing. You are just trying to muddy the waters.

[TFO_KillSwitch]

You have no idea what you are talking about and are just spewing out conspiracy theories. No matter how long you have followed the game, you are entitled to nothing. It is not your game. You haven't even paid for it yet. Even if you had paid for it, you still are entitled to nothing. You are just trying to muddy the waters.

he is correct. we will not own this game when it comes out . all we will be doing is buying a license to play there game. this is with all games. you pay for a license. at any given time they can pull that license form you and band you form a game. good warriors no when to strike. this is not a good time.
in the end all of this wont really matter. they are subject to the RP department.
in giving out info be for it is approved . can get a Dev in trouble. not with just the pr department but all so with the fans if the info is not wright. look what happen one Dev sed they would be letting out a noe trailer super soon. he wasn't approved to say this. and look what happen there having problems with the vid .and have no idea when it will come out and i quote him
It was super soon, then we ran into an unforeseen problem with the video. This is what I get for telling you guys stuff before it's officially done.
__________________
Rekhan
Online Community Representative, Star Trek Online/Champions Online
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thisis y some devs will not give out info until it is approved

[Hagon]

he is correct. we will not own this game when it comes out . all we will be doing is buying a license to play there game. this is with all games. you pay for a license. at any given time they can pull that license form you and band you form a game. good warriors no when to strike. this is not a good time.
in the end all of this wont really matter. they are subject to the RP department.
in giving out info be for it is approved . can get a Dev in trouble. not with just the pr department but all so with the fans if the info is not wright. look what happen one Dev sed they would be letting out a noe trailer super soon. he wasn't approved to say this. and look what happen there having problems with the vid .and have no idea when it will come out and i quote him

thisis y some devs will not give out info until it is approvedNo one is tallkng about thinking it's not Crytic's game. Cryptic's game wouldn't be much right now without all us fans here though, and won't be anything without us in the end. That it's their game doesn't change that they need us, and that they need to listen to their fans a bit better and adjust things accordingly sometimes.

[erriku]

No one is tallkng about thinking it's not Crytic's game. Cryptic's game wouldn't be much right now without all us fans here though, and won't be anything without us in the end. That it's their game doesn't change that they need us, and that they need to listen to their fans a bit better and adjust things accordingly sometimes.

They do listen to their fans. Often in fact. Now just because they decide not to listen to the rabid few, doesn't disprove my point. The way you approach getting what you want is hardly ever constructive. I can guarantee you that Klingon material will come to us on Cryptics terms. No matter how much you ***** or threaten to drop all support for the game. Once again, as a person who plans on playing Klingon as his main, I have no problem with the way Cryptic is handling information release.

[TFO_KillSwitch]

i under stand but look at the quote from the dve i posted in that last post
this is y nothing is coming out . if it is not made to be official then it is subject to change.
and giving out info that is subject to change can always get some one intruble.some company's
will go as far as suspending or firing an employee for giving out info that is not official

[MadAlaskan]

I agree with Hagon, there has been an under representation of Klingons, which is half the game. I'm not quite sure why this is going on, and I won't pretend to know. What I do know, is that we can sit here and discuss/flame/nerdrage all we want. If Cryptic was going to somehow change their mind, they would have by now.

Some posters in here have posted valid, sincere, and intelligently. They are the minority.

This thread is closer to being closed than answered.

[TFO_KillSwitch]

I agree with Hagon, there has been an under representation of Klingons, which is half the game. I'm not quite sure why this is going on, and I won't pretend to know. What I do know, is that we can sit here and discuss/flame/nerdrage all we want. If Cryptic was going to somehow change their mind, they would have by now.

Some posters in here have posted valid, sincere, and intelligently. They are the minority.

This thread is closer to being closed than answered.

you all have to remmber this is not the Dev choice. it is the PR department
.now who runs the PR I do not know.
but thats who gives the go ahead to release info

[erriku]

I agree with Hagon, there has been an under representation of Klingons, which is half the game. I'm not quite sure why this is going on, and I won't pretend to know. What I do know, is that we can sit here and discuss/flame/nerdrage all we want. If Cryptic was going to somehow change their mind, they would have by now.

Some posters in here have posted valid, sincere, and intelligently. They are the minority.

This thread is closer to being closed than answered.

I agree with everything you have said. Demanding information will likely just get the thread locked. I do also agree that as of right now, the Klingon half of the game has been undersold. But I know that information is coming so I choose to be patient. No amount of whining or demanding will change when the Devs PR choose to release information.

[Liberty]

Well... I think the OP has a right to express his feelings. Yeah.... It kinda sounded a bit demanding but I kinda throw all those adult and maturity arguments out the window. Heh. You don't think adults screw MMOs up? Even immature people can throw out a unique point of view or at least speak honestly. I also toss out all those arguments that its blah blah Cryptic's game and its in the blah blah blah PR cycle.

Contrary to belief. Devs and others do read these threads although they don't always post on them. As to does anything we say effect whats going to happen in the game? Errr.... Thats a tough call and I have no idea. My answer to that would be it depends on the company. So.... a company like SOE I'd say not a snowballs chance in Perditions Flames is the company going to listen to the playerbase and potential subscribers. On the other hand, Bioware, Blizzard, and Cryptic do on occasion listen to the player base. Course. Heh. They can flat out ignore em too.

So.... I say go ahead and keep posting what you want and feel. Its either probly gonna do one of three things. 1. Start a Flame War heh or at least one where others say how much more mature, intelligent, or greater than you they are. 2. Be listened too and gain input both positive or negative. or 3. Be flat out ignored and on the soon to be migrated to the bottom of the posts thread in a few hours time.

If ya want to be demanding, heated, give a intellectual debate, quote Shakespear, say a funny pun, claim BS or whatever its all good. Long as all the posters are being civil about it. Meh. My two cents anyways. Oh, and I still want and hope to see more Klingon Content. Freaking FedRats! Jus kidden. :)

[riggs16]

The only thing that worries me is if they rush the klingon side of things. Too many times ive played an mmo and you can tell certain factions or races have not had as much time as the others put into them.

From a development perspective it does however make sense to work on one side and then work to the next but the closer the game gets to release the more pressure the developers are put under and then you end up with things being rushed.

Then suddenly the klingons are missing some important ship type that throws the game out of balance and their quests are not as interesting as federation.

I fully intend to beta test the klingon side of things should that be possible in the beta process as i want it to be just as good as the federation experiance if not better.

[Liberty]

I don't think they are going to let us down in the terms of Klingon content. Um..... Not sure about Klingon and Fed balance tho. Hopefully they won't try to rush the game out of Beta and end up with a army of Dev wielding Nerf Bats.

[erriku]

I don't think they are going to let us down in the terms of Klingon content. Um..... Not sure about Klingon and Fed balance tho. Hopefully they won't try to rush the game out of Beta and end up with a army of Dev wielding Nerf Bats.

I don't think they are either. I imagine that is part of the reason they will not currently give an official release date. They know that there are a lot of people that want to play Klingon. Many people that intend to play Federation at least want to have a toon in the Klingon faction.

[Liberty]

I only have wild guesses as to why more Klingon content has not been released. Theres what the Devs have told us. Heh. Not much. Theres what the Devs have not told us. Probly much. Heh.

I suspect alot of new Klingon ship designs are being implemented. There have been alot of Federation ships seen and their newly released class structure also implys new ships. That means they probly have to make a whole heck of alot of Klingon ships if they are going to be equally balance (in number of ships anyways). Either that or they also have to make a bunch of Orion and Gorn ships to mix in with the Klingon's fleet structure. Likely a bit tougher to do than the Federation Tier slots. We all have a rough idea which Federation ship goes where and roughly how powerful they are. Not without debate of course. Heh, if you thought those fights in the threads such as Akira vs Defiant or Galaxy vs Sovereign were bad (Isn't that thread still going?) then wait till they release the Klingon Tier Structure. (reaches for earplugs early)

Heh, but ya gotta have both positive and negative feedback. I think once they decide on the final layout they will likely start putting Klingon stuff out. Mind you I'm still guessin. The PR cycle thing is mostly just to say we aren't ready yet dangit! Stop askin. Heh. I still have sympathy for those wanting Klingon content now tho. At least throw em a bone or two such as screen shots on Klingon classes already announced.

[Kreedo]

They need to advertise both factions and do a PR through game stores of Klingon VS Federation which side will you choose??? Need in store advertising , no question. So far for MMO"S the only advertising I have ever seen was World of Warcraft and look how well that worked. War hammer had a brief ads. LOtro ,age of conan and dungens and dragons had ZERO instore advertising and clearly that showed through subscriptions. If you dont promote the product your going to get less subscriptions no if and or buts . To many people who would buy the game if they knew it was out there are not getting the informantion that this game is going to be released.

There is so much that can be done to build up bothsides of the factions for easy promotions to the gamer masses. As many experts on making business productive and profitable will say , dont cut back your PR department, increase it in tough times. The Poorest and crappiest product that doesnt work worth $h %% can be bought by millions just because it was marketed properly and PR department was on their game. After all look at hamburger helper when iit came out decades ago.....They PR'ed the stuff out of that...

[Liberty]

I think that STO should definitely be released in two boxed sets. A collector edition Klingon box with some bonus ship. Stronger Brel maybe? Then a Federation Collector edition with a some bonus Fed ship. Would have to be different than the bonus one in the standard preorder of the game.

[Arctic_Wolf]

but non-development wise what is their excuse?

Plain and simple they dont owe you or anyone else an explanation for why they do what they do. Now man up and get on with your life. :cool:

[klingon_christian]

i wholehartedly agree. we need to have equal representation

[erriku]

i wholehartedly agree. we need to have equal representation

It will happen. You need to be patient and let them make the material first.

[erkenbrand001]

Plain and simple they dont owe you or anyone else an explanation for why they do what they do. Now man up and get on with your life. :cool:

nope they don't , but we also don't have to buy the game either,
We dont have to promote the game
We don't have to give positive reviews

Its a business, they need us to buy the product and promote it
For every dissatisfied customer they tell 5 people about their bad experience
For every satisfied customer they may tell 2 or 3 people about their good experience
Its a uphill battle for a business especially for the entertainment industry

[Liberty]

Hmmm.... Well in the mean time maybe you can make a thread listing all the things you expect and would like to see when Klingon content is released. Enable the thread for others to post what they would like to see for Klingons. This might give the Dev team ideas. Heh, or ya can always be patient (not really Klingon-like) or keep stoking your fury and saving it for the Feds on the games release.

[Loekii]

No one is tallkng about thinking it's not Crytic's game. Cryptic's game wouldn't be much right now without all us fans here though, and won't be anything without us in the end. That it's their game doesn't change that they need us, and that they need to listen to their fans a bit better and adjust things accordingly sometimes.

I think STO would be doing just fine if this site was not opened yet.

This website reflects a small portion of their ultimate player base. The notion that Cryptic 'needs' us, is childish and inaccurate.

Yes, the forum is one part of the PR, but it is not the only part of PR. Infact, I am willing to bet, they got more 'Bang for the Buck' from their PAX demos and the various press coverage on OTHER SITES, than they are getting here on this forum -- not the website, but specifically the forum.

STO would be just fine without the Forums right now. As a vet poster that has been a very active member of the forum community, I realize that I am nothing but just a name on a forum. STO does not 'owe' me anything, nor will the game 'fail' without me or my endorsement. We are just one voice in a stadium full of people. And we are not even a 'united' voice.

Overall, I think your sense of our worth is vastly over inflated. We are simply guests and potential customers. We are not owners, nor shareholders, nor even employees.


Plain and simple they dont owe you or anyone else an explanation for why they do what they do. Now man up and get on with your life. :cool:

The thing is that they have provided an explaination. It is simply not inline with their schedule.

They will be adding more Klingon content, later. They will be revamping the Website look, later.

So they have given an explanation -- and were rather kind about it, imo.

[Cardassian_Vole]

Agh! Too much pages to read. Too much ranting... :eek:

But, to answer the question: at the moment I would say Starfleet Online.

What will come in the future is up to Cryptic...

[Hagon]

I agree with everything you have said. Demanding information will likely just get the thread locked. I do also agree that as of right now, the Klingon half of the game has been undersold. But I know that information is coming so I choose to be patient. No amount of whining or demanding will change when the Devs PR choose to release information.Actually it's your rude behaviour, flaming, and trying to draw people into arguments that will most likely go the longest way toward getting the thread closed. Please move on troll.

[fyreblayd33]

I keep seeing everyone talk about how they will release info later for PR reasons. That they are holding back on what they talk about for PR reasons. That if they release too much too soon then they will lose people.

So how do you explain ignoring an entire faction. I understand people are saying that we are only 30% to 40% of the player base but as it is right now that is the 30% to 40% that will not be playing the game because there is nothing for them. How do we know that since everything is slanted towards fedrats right now that game balance will not be the same.

When you have a two faction game you need to treat each faction equally. You need to release information equally. You do not want to seem partial to one side like it seems now.

Let's not mention that if Klingon stuff is not finished yet and they are still working on the fedrats that tells me that I should expect a thrown together hodge podge on the Klingon side and probably 20% to 30% more bugs and problems than Feds will. People are explaining this away as they will work things out by working on the starfleet then they will have most of the issues ironed out and make it easier to do Klingon side. But if the two are different from game play up then how can they iron anything out. Everything will be different.

They should not ignore a group that is actually poor PR because again that population will feel slanted against and not want to play. They will feel that there is nothing there and not want to play. They are throwing away a good portion of the population that would be playing this game.

[erriku]

Actually it's your rude behaviour, flaming, and trying to draw people into arguments that will most likely go the longest way toward getting the thread closed. Please move on troll.


How exactly have I done any of those things? Because I choose to counter your useless ranting and rabid flaming with logic? Okay, I suppose I see how you could think that. :rolleyes:

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I keep seeing everyone talk about how they will release info later for PR reasons. That they are holding back on what they talk about for PR reasons. That if they release too much too soon then they will lose people.

So how do you explain ignoring an entire faction. I understand people are saying that we are only 30% to 40% of the player base but as it is right now that is the 30% to 40% that will not be playing the game because there is nothing for them. How do we know that since everything is slanted towards fedrats right now that game balance will not be the same.

When you have a two faction game you need to treat each faction equally. You need to release information equally. You do not want to seem partial to one side like it seems now.

Let's not mention that if Klingon stuff is not finished yet and they are still working on the fedrats that tells me that I should expect a thrown together hodge podge on the Klingon side and probably 20% to 30% more bugs and problems than Feds will. People are explaining this away as they will work things out by working on the starfleet then they will have most of the issues ironed out and make it easier to do Klingon side. But if the two are different from game play up then how can they iron anything out. Everything will be different.

They should not ignore a group that is actually poor PR because again that population will feel slanted against and not want to play. They will feel that there is nothing there and not want to play. They are throwing away a good portion of the population that would be playing this game.

I dont know if I agree with everything you said, but I do agree that the flow of info right now is pretty Fed biased, and even if its true that the Feds will make up the majority of the playerbase, its not right to totaly ignore one half of the factions in the game.

[Hagon]

Plain and simple they dont owe you or anyone else an explanation for why they do what they do. Now man up and get on with your life. :cool:Actually, they do. This belief that they don't is something that is unfortunately gotten pervasive when these games are in development, and has led to arrogance on the part of more than one development house. They get the mindset that no matter what they do, or how they treat their fans, they'll be fine because so many are telling them "It's ok Mr. Dev, do anything you like! Just give us the game to play!"

That attitude, and telling people to shut up and not bother them (whether that comes from a troll, or someone looking for attention to get a beta key, or whatever) isn't constructive at all, and does much more harm than good.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

Actually, they do. This belief that they don't is something that is unfortunately gotten pervasive when these games are in development, and has led to arrogance on the part of more than one development house. They get the mindset that no matter what they do, or how they treat their fans, they'll be fine because so many are telling them "It's ok Mr. Dev, do anything you like! Just give us the game to play!"

That attitude, and telling people to shut up and not bother them (whether that comes from a troll, or someone looking for attention to get a beta key, or whatever) isn't constructive at all, and does much more harm than good.

I agree wtih everything you just said :D

[erriku]

Actually, they do. This belief that they don't is something that is unfortunately gotten pervasive when these games are in development, and has led to arrogance on the part of more than one development house. They get the mindset that no matter what they do, or how they treat their fans, they'll be fine because so many are telling them "It's ok Mr. Dev, do anything you like! Just give us the game to play!"

That attitude, and telling people to shut up and not bother them (whether that comes from a troll, or someone looking for attention to get a beta key, or whatever) isn't constructive at all, and does much more harm than good.

Actually, they don't. If the game does not live up to your expectations, you are free to choose a different game to play. Just because they have not released an equal amount of information for the Klingons yet, does not mean that they wont. I ask you how do you think that making childish demands is anything close to constructive?

[Loekii]

I dont know if I agree with everything you said, but I do agree that the flow of info right now is pretty Fed biased, and even if its true that the Feds will make up the majority of the playerbase, its not right to totally ignore one half of the factions in the game.

We know they did the Federation aspects first, so they have more information to provide obviously.

We also know they only started the Klingon aspects this summer, so they do not have as much information locked down.

We also know that Fed and Klingons systems are different, rather than just being Mirrors of each other.

The unbalance of information is specifically tied to this aspect of the development schedule.

They will release more Klingon information, after it gets hammered out, polished and clears PR. Just because you see a Vorcha in a video, does not mean it is 'finished', nor ready to be publicly discussed. Things are still in flux, so what they could say now, is probably not locked down enough, and may change.

Also, we know they are doing a website facelift down the line. That also is on a schedule, so if it is set to be released in January, it means it is not ready to be released today. You know I want to see the website updated, but its all about their timelines.

As a Klingon only player (no plans on playing feds), I would rather 'wait' and get it done properly, than have them rush out stuff filled with mistakes. We are only talking about a few months. I certainly can wait for a polished version of information.

[Mogfire]

I think that STO should definitely be released in two boxed sets. A collector edition Klingon box with some bonus ship. Stronger Brel maybe? Then a Federation Collector edition with a some bonus Fed ship. Would have to be different than the bonus one in the standard preorder of the game.

I seconded that idea.

[Randall_Flagg]

We know they did the Federation aspects first, so they have more information to provide obviously.

We also know they only started the Klingon aspects this summer, so they do not have as much information locked down.

We also know that Fed and Klingons systems are different, rather than just being Mirrors of each other.

The unbalance of information is specifically tied to this aspect of the development schedule.

They will release more Klingon information, after it gets hammered out, polished and clears PR. Just because you see a Vorcha in a video, does not mean it is 'finished', nor ready to be publicly discussed. Things are still in flux, so what they could say now, is probably not locked down enough, and may change.

Also, we know they are doing a website facelift down the line. That also is on a schedule, so if it is set to be released in January, it means it is not ready to be released today. You know I want to see the website updated, but its all about their timelines.

As a Klingon only player (no plans on playing feds), I would rather 'wait' and get it done properly, than have them rush out stuff filled with mistakes. We are only talking about a few months. I certainly can wait for a polished version of information.

Amen on that.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I ask you how do you think that making childish demands is anything close to constructive?

He wasnt makint any childish demands, simply requesting info on the faction he wants to play. Calling it childish simply because you dont agree with him is actualy childish of you.

[erriku]

He wasnt makint any childish demands, simply requesting info on the faction he wants to play. Calling it childish simply because you dont agree with him is actualy childish of you.

Since you have been following this thread for quite awhile, I am surprised you are saying that. It seems you are intentionally "forgetting" everything that has been said thus far. Gotta say, given your penchant for snarky remarks, I cannot tell if you honestly don't know what has been said in this thread, or if you are just trying to bait me.

[Kaybok]

Since you have been following this thread for quite awhile, I am surprised you are saying that. It seems you are intentionally "forgetting" everything that has been said thus far. Gotta say, given your penchant for snarky remarks, I cannot tell if you honestly don't know what has been said in this thread, or if you are just trying to bait me.

You two should sit down and play a game of Strategema sometime. :rolleyes:

[erriku]

You two should sit down and play a game of Strategema sometime. :rolleyes:

Intentional stalemate for the win!

[Kaybok]

Intentional stalemate for the win!

Hehe... exactly what I was thinking! :p

[Arsmajka]

Perhaps they should have taken a few pointers from St Tor on how thier site is/was set up both factions are equally repersented , which i think was one of the reasons it had an overwhelming response to the annoucement of closed beta. Ofcourse this all my own opinion

[fyreblayd33]

They will release more Klingon information, after it gets hammered out, polished and clears PR. Just because you see a Vorcha in a video, does not mean it is 'finished', nor ready to be publicly discussed. Things are still in flux, so what they could say now, is probably not locked down enough, and may change.

Ummm last time I checked this is an MMO and anything that they put in is subject to change at a moment's notice. So even the info they are giving out on the Fed side can change at any time. So just because they do not have it set in stone does not mean that they should not talk about it because nothing in an MMO is set in stone.

What we are saying is that they are ignoring an entire section of the population of the game. This is not feeling like it will have two factions and at this point I am afraid that the Klingon side is going to suffer because they might not have enough time to get it fully finished before they are forced to put it out to the public by say Atari and they will have a good side and a side so full of bugs that we will be gimped from day one.

We also want to start making plans on what we are going to be doing. If they wait until even two monthes before release what will the worth be to us?

We would like information like they are giving out for starfleet. As it is even on this site the information as well as the site itself is nothing but starfleet. Even right down to the names and reasons for the forums are biased to starfleet. So will the game be balanced for starfleet? Will the game be more complete for starfleet? We are getting upset and we have every right to be. We are being ignored and when you have two factions you need to treat them the same not give all info for one. When you do this you appear to be one sided and biased.

[erriku]

It is not ignoring if they tell us on many occasions that the information is coming.

[CptCody]

THis stinks

[DarkOrion69]

To those feeling entitled to more Klingon information: Your entitlement is in your own perception alone. No one has promised you anything and you are just imagining being ignored here. You are having your gratification delayed and that is making you angry and leading you to egotistical justifications when confronted by people asking you to just relax. If you want to be heard rationally, please ask and wait. Please do not make a list of demands and threaten Cryptic as if you have some form of leverage.

To those taking issue with those feeling entitled to more Klingon information: People are wasting their time arguing rationally and advising emotional, egotistically engaged, and entitled posters on this thread. Likewise, responding emotionally and rudely is of no use in helping the entitled with this issue. They want 'their way or the highway' and feel justified. They are seemingly disinterested in examining the validity of their entitlement on this issue.

Maybe everyone should just let them huff and puff and let the Devs decide how to answer their demands. If people continue to poke the 'Klingon Info Trolls' we are only probably only going to annoy them and ourselves. No one is going to convince them that they are not entitled to Klingon information. They are not going to convince anyone that they are entitled to more Klingon information. Can't we all just drop this nonsense and wait until we having some Klingon information to bicker over later?

[Drexxus3d]

The fact of the matter is, you little fedrats are spoiled and get everything you want. If not you cryyyy, oh lord you fedrats cry. Cryptic should wise up, and knock it off! end of story

Feds aren't the ones crying.

Just saying.

[erkenbrand001]

let me re post this ... maybe then you can understand

Plain and simple they dont owe you or anyone else an explanation for why they do what they do. Now man up and get on with your life. :cool:

nope they don't , but we also don't have to buy the game either,
We dont have to promote the game
We don't have to give positive reviews

Its a business, they need us to buy the product and promote it
For every dissatisfied customer they tell 5 people about their bad experience
For every satisfied customer they may tell 2 or 3 people about their good experience
Its a uphill battle for a business especially for the entertainment industry

[crobar001]

The fact of the matter is, you little fedrats are spoiled and get everything you want. If not you cryyyy, oh lord you fedrats cry. Cryptic should wise up, and knock it off! end of story

AAAHAHAHAHHA!!!! Sorry that is the best summery of the FEDRATS I have seen yet!

[CptCody]

The fact of the matter is, Cryptic should wise up, and knock it off! Feels like my membership since sept 2008 in this forum is being taken for granted. A little equality over here is all Im asking for. And if not even the Federation can see that there is something wrong, than this just stinks... We have SEEN Pics for the Vor'Cha class and we've seen a bird of prey. NOW, tell me why they were not on the list????? Please explain that we are equal and that they just forgot......THat list was done just for the Federation!!!!!! end of story

[erriku]

The fact of the matter is, Cryptic should wise up, and knock it off! Feels like my membership since sept 2008 in this forum is being taken for granted. A little equality over here is all Im asking for. And if not even the Federation can see that there is something wrong, than this just stinks... We have SEEN Pics for the Vor'Cha class and we've seen a bird of prey. NOW, tell me why they were not on the list????? Please explain that we are equal and that they just forgot......THat list was done just for the Federation!!!!!! end of story

No. You are right. Those devs are just trying to make us /ragequit. They don't want us to play the game. Yeah, that's it. They want all Klingon players to just leave so they can focus on the Federation side. :rolleyes:

[Nador_Ekoor]

Well, I'm upset and I'm Cardassian....Just look at how much has been provided to the Feds and still their fans are whining. The Klingons are feeling descriminated against because it has been over a year with very little. If the Devs aren't gonna show the love, I will.......Go get'em Klingons.

[erriku]

Well, I'm upset and I'm Cardassian....Just look at how much has been provided to the Feds and still their fans are whining. The Klingons are feeling descriminated against because it has been over a year with very little. If the Devs aren't gonna show the love, I will.......Go get'em Klingons.

No. They are not representatives of all Klingon players, only themselves. I plan to be a Klingon player and I hate all their whining.

[erkenbrand001]

Well, I'm upset and I'm Cardassian....Just look at how much has been provided to the Feds and still their fans are whining. The Klingons are feeling descriminated against because it has been over a year with very little. If the Devs aren't gonna show the love, I will.......Go get'em Klingons.

yes !!!! Long live the Cardassians

[Nador_Ekoor]

No. They are not representatives of all Klingon players, only themselves. I plan to be a Klingon player and I hate all their whining.

You may call it whining, but after reading all of the whining from the Federation...this is refreshing...at least for a couple posts. I personally think they have a legitimate complaint, if it were only a few months of all Federation its one thing..but its been over a year and all the Klingons have to show for their loyalty is two ships.

[erriku]

You may call it whining, but after reading all of the whining from the Federation...this is refreshing...at least for a couple posts. I personally think they have a legitimate complaint, if it were only a few months of all Federation its one thing..but its been over a year and all the Klingons have to show for their loyalty is two ships.

I think we have a legitimate concern, not complaint. Also, the way that concern is voiced has been done in an absolutely immature way. Threats, assumption, whining, and flaming. This is not how I want my chosen faction to be represented.

[erkenbrand001]

I think we have a legitimate concern, not complaint. Also, the way that concern is voiced has been done in an absolutely immature way. Threats, assumption, whining, and flaming. This is not how I want my chosen faction to be represented.

ok dude were not whining at all we have posted logical facts on plenty of these posts
The op who started this thread posted in very logical fact driven points ... I don't see any immaturity about it ...
As far as us not representing the Klingons ...uuh what ever you say MR Captain Snuggles of the IKS Jigglypuf from the House of Carebears .....very very Klingon like of you .....

[erriku]

ok dude were not whining at all we have posted logical facts on plenty of these posts
The op who started this thread posted in very logical fact driven points ... I don't see any immaturity about it ...
As far as us not representing the Klingons ...uuh what ever you say MR Captain Snuggles of the IKS Jigglypuf from the House of Carebears .....very very Klingon like of you .....


What I choose to name my toon is my business. It in no way means I have less rights to the Klingon faction than you. If you actually read any given dozen or so pages, you will find most of the posts here from Klingon players to have at least some varying degree of flaming, whining, egotistical posts, a false sense of entitlement, or threats.

[erkenbrand001]

What I choose to name my toon is my business. It in no way means I have less rights to the Klingon faction than you. If you actually read any given dozen or so pages, you will find most of the posts here from Klingon players to have at least some varying degree of flaming, whining, egotistical posts, a false sense of entitlement, or threats.

well I have seen your posts , your clearly the poster boy for the non flaming ,non whining posts

[erriku]

well I have seen your posts , your clearly the poster boy for the non flaming ,non whining posts

Pot calling the kettle black. As for the whining, when have I ever whined on this forum?

[Rgoodfel]

I have been one of the people that have been advocating patients for a long time. I am starting to be concerned with lack of Klingon info as well. I am hoping that they are not going to have a very fleshed out Fed side of the game, and then have a half done rushed Klingon side of the game.

I will keep waiting, and really worry when beta starts. Then I will see if my worry is justified or not. I really hope that they are not putting all their efforts into the Fed side, and leaving the Klingon side out to dry.

[erkenbrand001]

Pot calling the kettle black. As for the whining, when have I ever whined on this forum?

I'm waiting for the facts that I have been whining on this forum

Oh btw if your looking for a good fleet to join I hear the house of Duras is looking for new members ..

[jamestpicard55]

Pot calling the kettle black. As for the whining, when have I ever whined on this forum?

your definition of "whining" seems to be someone talking about something you dont agree with, no matter what it is. however, that would mean you are also whining about other people whining, which makes you hypocrite.

[erriku]

I'm waiting for the facts that I have been whining on this forum

Oh btw if your looking for a fleet to join I hear the house of Duras is hiring .. I mean looking for new members ..


I believe your posts go under the egotistical, false entitlement section. Not necessarily the whining section. :o

[jamestpicard55]

I believe your posts go under the egotistical, false entitlement section. Not necessarily the whining section. :o

lol so that would put yours under the 'pompous arrogant god complex' section. glad we have it all settled :rolleyes:

[erkenbrand001]

your definition of "whining" seems to be someone talking about something you dont agree with, no matter what it is. however, that would mean you are also whining about other people whining, which makes you hypocrite.
I like your avator ...good job ..thumbs up .:)

[erriku]

your definition of "whining" seems to be someone talking about something you dont agree with, no matter what it is. however, that would mean you are also whining about other people whining, which makes you hypocrite.

Have you even been reading these posts? I don't even think you know what you are talking about. Try testing the waters before jumping right in. ;)

[slingbladez]

I believe your posts go under the egotistical, false entitlement section. Not necessarily the whining section. :o
This type of character assassination is completely unnecessary. We believe we have legitimate grievances, you don't think we do. Allow us to air our grievances in peace and stop trying to stop us at every turn. If you think we are going about it the wrong way then contact a mod to lock the thread or just let us discuss this between ourselves. Thanks

[erriku]

lol so that would put yours under the 'pompous arrogant god complex' section. glad we have it all settled :rolleyes:

So you have made this observation of me how? Might I say you are an instigator of flaming? A bad one at that.

[jamestpicard55]

This type of character assassination is completely unnecessary. We believe we have legitimate grievances, you don't think we do. Allow us to air our grievances in peace and stop trying to stop us at every turn. If you think we are going about it the wrong way then contact a mod to lock the thread or just let us discuss this between ourselves. Thanks

funny thing is, when you air your grievances, he calls it whining. however, when he airs his grievances about you airing your grievances, he doesnt. gotta love the double standard :rolleyes:

[erriku]

This type of character assassination is completely unnecessary. We believe we have legitimate grievances, you don't think we do. Allow us to air our grievances in peace and stop trying to stop us at every turn. If you think we are going about it the wrong way then contact a mod to lock the thread or just let us discuss this between ourselves. Thanks

Not true at all. I believe the grievances are legitimate. I have said that many times over. I just question the way these grievances are handled.

[jamestpicard55]

So you have made this observation of me how? Might I say you are an instigator of flaming? A bad one at that.

i think you said something a few posts ago that apply pretty well to your statement above: pot meet kettle ;)

[erriku]

funny thing is, when you air your grievances, he calls it whining. however, when he airs his grievances about you airing your grievances, he doesnt. gotta love the double standard :rolleyes:

I lol'd because you don't know what you are talking about. :D

[jamestpicard55]

Not true at all. I believe the grievances are legitimate. I have said that many times over. I just question the way these grievances are handled.

and you think the way you are airing your grievances about the way these other people are doing it, by insulting them, is the correct way to handle it?

[erriku]

i think you said something a few posts ago that apply pretty well to your statement above: pot meet kettle ;)

I did no such thing. Proof little troll. Proof is needed.

[slingbladez]

Not true at all. I believe the grievances are legitimate. I have said that many times over. I just question the way these grievances are handled.

then i'll repeat the rest of my post.If you think we are going about it the wrong way then contact a mod to lock the thread or just let us discuss this between ourselves. Thanks

Constantly telling us how wrong we are going about things will do nothing but stir up resentment and lead to people attacking each other...i.e what is starting to happen. Just leave us be to discuss this among ourselves.

[jamestpicard55]

I lol'd because you don't know what you are talking about. :D

thats a pretty great summary of every post you have made in this thread, good job :rolleyes:

[decoy26517]

Veglargh, you have a cool avatar.
oooh Veglargh and SlingBlades... is that like a guild avatar or some preset one I can't find?

[erkenbrand001]

Hmmm.... Attempting to start a flame war I see. You prove my point for me. I wonder if you are in the same guild. I can't say I would be surprised to find that all these 135 "other guys" are all in the same guild actually.

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines (http://forums.startrekonline.com/announcement.php?f=24&a=2). Thank you, Dionaea


so much so it has been edited by the mods...

[erriku]

and you think the way you are airing your grievances about the way these other people are doing it, by insulting them, is the correct way to handle it?

If you had actually read this thread instead of just popping in without any knowledge of the back-and-forth going on here, you would have known that I only retaliated to flaming. I never initiated. Why don't you actually read the posts before making ill educated assumptions?

[jamestpicard55]

I did no such thing. Proof little troll. Proof is needed.

proof or your flaming? easy:

"I believe your posts go under the egotistical, false entitlement section. Not necessarily the whining section"

[erriku]

so much so it has been edited by the mods...

Again, a retaliation. I never said I didn't do that. Your quote is moot.

[erriku]

proof or your flaming? easy:

"I believe your posts go under the egotistical, false entitlement section. Not necessarily the whining section"

Lol. Seriously mate, find the proof of what I asked you to find. Initiation of flaming, not retaliation.

[jamestpicard55]

If you had actually read this thread instead of just popping in without any knowledge of the back-and-forth going on here, you would have known that I only retaliated to flaming. I never initiated. Why don't you actually read the posts before making ill educated assumptions?

it makes no difference whether someone else did it first, because no one is making your reply in kind except yourself. just because someone else insulted you doesnt make it any less immature when you insult them back. in fact, the fact that you feel the need to return an insult actualy means you are more immature than the person who first thew it.

[slingbladez]

If someone is "flaming you" you don't need to come here and reply. Just let us stay on topic

[erkenbrand001]

Again, a retaliation. I never said I didn't do that. Your quote is moot.

you asked for Proof ...retaliation or facts ...

[erriku]

then i'll repeat the rest of my post.If you think we are going about it the wrong way then contact a mod to lock the thread or just let us discuss this between ourselves. Thanks

Constantly telling us how wrong we are going about things will do nothing but stir up resentment and lead to people attacking each other...i.e what is starting to happen. Just leave us be to discuss this among ourselves.

Well I suppose that such a request is reasonable and addressed politely. I can assure you that if flaming against me stops, I will not return to this thread.

[decoy26517]

Why are people arguing about this? Getting a Klingon update here and there would be great for everyone.

[erriku]

it makes no difference whether someone else did it first, because no one is making your reply in kind except yourself. just because someone else insulted you doesnt make it any less immature when you insult them back. in fact, the fact that you feel the need to return an insult actualy means you are more immature than the person who first thew it.

Actually no it does not. If anything, it only means I am willing to drop down to their level and mud sling right back.

you asked for Proof ...retaliation or facts ...

I asked for proof that I ever initiated a flame war.

[jamestpicard55]

Actually no it does not. If anything, it only means I am willing to drop down to their level and mud sling right back.

yes, it does, and you just stated the reason: they are already at "that level", yet you are willingly dropping to that same level. therefore, it makes you more immature than them, since you were above it, but actualy decided to go down to it.

[erkenbrand001]

Actually no it does not. If anything, it only means I am willing to drop down to their level and mud sling right back.



I asked for proof that I ever initiated a flame war.


I have no idea if it was or wasn't the mods deemed it necessary to edit it how do i know it wasn't flaming

Captain Erik Cameron ..plz stop posting here ...I want this thread to stay open if you do not agree with what we have to say then ignore it ..PLZ leave..

[erriku]

yes, it does, and you just stated the reason: they are already at "that level", yet you are willingly dropping to that same level. therefore, it makes you more immature than them, since you were above it, but actualy decided to go down to it.

Lol. Listen to yourself mate. You even said, "willing to go to their level" not below. And since you have been participating in this little back-and-forth with me when I have already stated that I would be happy to depart should the flaming against me stops, I can only assume that either you want to keep me here, or you are a last word freak.

[slingbladez]

Lets get back to the topic at hand. They have shown us glimpses of a decent amount of content. Instead of giving us more of this they just show the same couple of federation ships a ton of times.

[jamestpicard55]

Lol. Listen to yourself mate. You even said, "willing to go to their level" not below. And since you have been participating in this little back-and-forth with me when I have already stated that I would be happy to depart should the flaming against me stops, I can only assume that either you want to keep me here, or you are a last word freak.

actualy, i dont care what you do, i just find it humorous to see you calling other people immature as you insult them and demonstrate your own immaturity. by all means, keep it up. your only making yourself look more foolish with every post, and i'm always up for a good laugh :o

[erriku]

I have no idea if it was or wasn't the mods deemed it necessary to edit it how do i know it wasn't flaming

Captain Erik Cameron ..plz stop posting here ...I want this thread to stay open if you do not agree with what we have to say then ignore it ..PLZ leave..



Stop quoting me then. I have already agreed to leave at the request of one of the users should the flaming against me ceases. All you have to do is button it up.

[erkenbrand001]

14. Respect is the name of the game. You must respect your fellow members and refrain from inflammatory comments as well as flaming, taunting, and general disrespect. Do not simply put down the opinion or advice given by others. If you don't agree with it, say why - respectfully. Don't just tell them they're wrong. Do not make uninvited remarks about typos, duplicate posts, posting styles, etc.
# Creation of undue discontent on the forums.
# Creation of disturbances in forum threads, such as picking fights, making off topic posts that derail the thread, insulting other posters, etc.
# Posting non-constructive comments.

[erriku]

actualy, i dont care what you do, i just find it humorous to see you calling other people immature as you insult them and demonstrate your own immaturity. by all means, keep it up. your only making yourself look more foolish with every post, and i'm always up for a good laugh :o

What do you think that it makes you look like by intentionally keeping me here through flaming?

[jamestpicard55]

What do you think that it makes you look like by intentionally keeping me here through flaming?

you have free will, and you can go whenever you like regardless of what other people say to or about you. no one is keeping you here but yourself.

[fyreblayd33]

Here is an idea the only person causing the troubles here and that everyone is argueing with is the good old Captain of the Jigglypuff.

Since this is the case just ignore what he says and we will not get this thread locked for not staying on topic. Please everyone stop feeding him and get on with the topic this is not going to help us air our concerns.

Also keep in mind not that I know this person but it can be the tactic of some to start an argument in a thread they do not like then report that same thread to get it locked. I am not saying that this is what he or she is trying to do but do keep this in mind. Do not feed the flames or trolls just stay on the topic.

[erriku]

you have free will, and you can go whenever you like regardless of what other people say to or about you. no one is keeping you here but yourself.

Nagus is that you? I actually never wanted to leave. I just agreed to do so at another users request. So again, your choices are that you are a last word freak, or you want to flame. What is it?

[erriku]

Here is an idea the only person causing the troubles here and that everyone is argueing with is the good old Captain of the Jigglypuff.

Since this is the case just ignore what he says and we will not get this thread locked for not staying on topic. Please everyone stop feeding him and get on with the topic this is not going to help us air our concerns.

Just because everyone here is arguing with me, does not mean that I am the one causing trouble. In fact, my opinion still stands. Whining, flaming, threatening, and egotistical posts will not influence when the Devs release information. Insinuating that I am a troll when I have not been trolling makes you a troll.

[jamestpicard55]

So again, your choices are that you are a last word freak, or you want to flame. What is it?

those same two choice apply to you as much as they do anyone else. however, i think the best answer for you would be "both"

[erriku]

those same two choice apply to you as much as they do anyone else. however, i think the best answer for you would be "both"

I think you are projecting mate.

[Kaybok]

Woohoo! INB4LOCK! :D

[erriku]

Woohoo! INB4LOCK! :D

Lol. It appears you are right.

[erkenbrand001]

Ignore FTW

[erkenbrand001]

So to reiterate my original point how about some more Klingon equality ....

[slingbladez]

Veglargh does have legitamate grievances that have nothing to do with Klingon content and how far they are with it.


-More pics of ships that Cryptic has already shown (such as the Vo'cha, BOP, Vo'Quv, Raptor, Neghvar) instead of countless shots of Akiras and Mirandas

-More pics of Klingon Buildings that Cryptic has already shown in the videos and even on previous screenshot

-A less Fed style website (a neutral looking site) or a Klingon Skin looking website (it is possible they have done in CO which is the same site "engine/design"

-More community activities oriented to Klingons- Out of 28 Kobayashi Morus only 2 are Klingon oriented

- the Fleet Forum Registration Description from the current "Putting together the finest crew in Starfleet? Organize, advertise and recruit for your Star Trek Online Fleets here!" to "finest crew in Starfleet and KDF" or just take out "putting together the fines crew in Starfleet".


All of those except for the Website adjustments could be remedied relatively easily and i hope Cryptic considers it.

[fyreblayd33]

Oh and for anyone wondering to put someone on the ignore list you click the persons name. View profile of the person. Then in there will be the option to add them to the ignore list. When this happens and since it is just like CO when the game goes live the ignore list here will also have the person ignored in game..

[erkenbrand001]

Oh and for anyone wondering to put someone on the ignore list you click the persons name. View profile of the person. Then in there will be the option to add them to the ignore list. When this happens and since it is just like CO when the game goes live the ignore list here will also have the person ignored in game..

oh that's a cool feature didn't know it worked in the game as well ...cool

[Nador_Ekoor]

We can squash this now.

Captain Snuggles from the House of Carebears: agrees that there are legitimate points made. Points that should be addressed to the Devs.

In return: Klingons acknowledge that Captain Snuggles has a point, maybe we should contact the Devs and bring these points into the open and express our concerns.

Case dismissed....no more flaming needed, no more outside interuptions, and no more character assassinations needed.



Then again, when was the last time a Klingon player's question was answered?

Case dismissed anyway.

[Kaybok]

I support increased marketing efforts for the Klingon faction. I played a villain in the "City of" games for years when I noticed most of the marketing was for the mainstream hero side. I can witness to the fact that poor/unequal marketing for one faction will lead to a feeling of disparity among players. Over time in City of Villains the player base has declined. Many have left the villain side or CoX altogether because of lack of players. I switched to the hero side myself and I hear a lot of "Bah villains, why would you want to play there - there's no one around" from hero players.

Now that we are back on topic... Cryptic please do a better job than NCSoft did with factional marketing. It really will hurt the game if the mainstream side receives most of the attention. Please forgive some of the fighting in this thread but you see the beginnings of something that could become much worse.

Hope this helps us all. Live free and die well. Qapla'!!

[JoJimGregory]

I'm glad they're focusing mostly on the Federation, and hope earnestly that they withhold information about the Klingons as long as possible.

So, anyway, I was reading this article about reverse psychology today and ...

[erkenbrand001]

hahaha ...

[Draconianknight]

I cant help but think that somewhere in a dark boardroom in Los Gatos California. The Cryptic devs are laughing thier butts off at the various back and forth shots in these forums. Quit frankily the recently released ship list was either a absolute blunder or done intentially. Since devs arent stupid, it goes that it was done intentially. Since it would have been no trouble at all to list ship classes such as the Negvar and Vorcha as examples. And since they really are probably not going to intentially hurt their future sales. It was done to get a reaction out of us that are loud mouthed and obnoxious enough to choose to play the Klingon faction. Hence my belief that they are all laughing their butts off.
Now that I have use Vulcan like logic and explained the situation, perhaps the Fed and Klingon factions will be able to convince the devs of the error of thier ways and post a multi faction ship list.
Or we can just go back to arguing, makes no difference to me:cool:

[Loekii]

It is not ignoring if they tell us on many occasions that the information is coming.

Exactly.

Just because information is not coming on YOUR timeline, does not mean they are 'ignoring' an aspect of the game.

As a Klingon player AND an active vet poster on these forums, Cryptic's comments that the information is coming LATER, makes sense and is acceptable.

Now that might not be soon enough for you, but that is not the measure of when the informaiton should pe presented.

[Loekii]

Bottom line is that they are not going to lose vast amounts of customers because they don't have Klingon content in Oct, but rather post the Klingon content in Jan/Feb.

The few dozen that write off the game because they don't have enough Klingon content soon enough on their pre-release website, is probably an acceptable loss.

Imo, as a Klingon player, I really will not miss those that would leave the game because they are too impatiant to wait for pending website revamps or website additions.

As a proponent of revamping the website, I am satisfied with the fact that they have said changes are in the works and that more Klingon content is coming as it is approved.

[Sunborn]

Bottom line is that they are not going to lose vast amounts of customers because they don't have Klingon content in Oct, but in January or Feb.

The few dozen that write off the game because they don't have enough Klingon content soon enough on their pre-release website, is probably an acceptable loss.


Exactly, thank you for that insigfht. In other words showing the federation will bring in more players than showing Klingons. The gain of players will diginficatly outweight the loss of klingon players. Those lost players would probably come back when they finnaly do drop their buckets of info on the ridge heads.

[WikiUltimate]

Honestly, they will be doing more for the Klingons with this one game then anything else in Star Trek, even including Klingon Academy. I am sure that are a LOT of things that Cryptic has to create themselves, which means they need to get approved from the licenses holders on everything they create for the Klingons. Approval takes time.

I doubt it. KA atleast gave a background to the Klingon Civil war and included atleast 10 Different Klingon ships as well as giving a background to officer training in the KDF. No other game has given this much life to the Klingons, and as of now, nither dose STO.

Having 2 team of 10 people each working Klingon and Starfleet (like 2 games at the same time) that somehow have to come together

VS.

Paying 1 team of 20 people to focus mostly on completing Starfleet first, then having the same team go primarily to work on Klingon.

No brainer. It'd be more difficult to have two teams working on completely different stuff then having to somehow collaborate to make sure both teams were coming up with equivalent level stuff, than it would be to have one team finish one side, know how that's setup, then make a comparable counterpart using all the things learned the first time.

Really, the Starfleet side is like the prototype and the Klingon side will benefit from all the experience and realizations that took place making the Starfleet portion. So, in essence, Klingons will probably have more solid gameplay and more thought-out ships.

Fixed ;)

Wow... if this is not the most flawed logic i have read to date in these forums.

By your own logic, Crypic shoud not have been making 3 games at once, CO, STO, and the unknown MMO in development. Nor should anyone ever multi tast ever.

Working and keeping up on the forums, well by your logic you shouldn't. Driving and listening to the radio for the news or weather, well you shouldn't. I can go on forever...

/sigh


Cryptic has to stretch info over a 6 month period. They have to partition it out so that it stretches all the way to release....and gives good information all the way. They need to build and foster hype. It's what makes them business.

They have said, this is the Fed PR cycle. The Klingon PR cycle is going to come once the Fed PR cycle is done. Then you'll have soo much Klingon info you'll be sick of it.

Just because they aren't show casing it doesn't mean it isn't being developed and worked on in their offices. I'm SURE that there is just as much Klingon stuff done as there is Fed.

Be a bit patient.

1st: it's an MMO, there should never be a lack of info, if there is then there is a lack of content.

2nd:You have a point. It has been said that the Klingon Content is to come in time... but so is christmas, and my graduation... and so is my being the CEO of a comapany that i don't even work for...

3rd: again, you have a point, and i want to make it clear i am not arguing with you. Lacking of evidance is not evidance of lacking. For all we know, the game could be compleat right now, we just don't have the info.

4th: My main problem is, i've been following STO since it was first anounced. I have not been on the forums that long, but i have been listening and reading. The thing is i know more about SW:TOR then STO, and SW is more then a year from release and STO is supposed to be about 6 months from release.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This...

To the OP, and the others in BoK... at least you get to play your desired Faction upon launch... *Some* of us won't be able to do that unless/until there is an expansion released...

As has already been said.. they will release the information when they have the information to release. Posting these b*tch threads about the lack of updates/information accomplishes nothing but making the BoK look like a bunch of whingers...

All that being said, and despite what has been implied here in the thread, 'well, you're FEDERATION, you don't care that their isn't Klingon content' is both rather unfair and inaccurate. I myself will be playing Federation until the Romulans are allowed their own expansion... but I have stated before in other threads like this, here.. and on other forums on the net that I sympathize with the Klingon fans on the lack of info... but the fact remains... they will release the information when they have the information to release.

Saith

I'm quoting you just becasue you quoted majicebe's flawed logic.

Plain and simple they dont owe you or anyone else an explanation for why they do what they do. Now man up and get on with your life.

Nor do we own them anything, including our respect, time, money, paciants... name it, we don't owe it.


SO, in conclusion, STO dose need more Klingon content, and for that matter they need to advertise STO more in general. Otherwise, STO will just turn into another failed game. NOT because of lacking of content, but lacking of advertising.

If when telling people about STO they reply: "that game is not being made", "it was canceled over a year ago" or "That's just vaporware"... you have to wonder if crypic want's the game to succeed or not.

[Loekii]

Exactly, thank you for that insight. In other words showing the federation will bring in more players than showing Klingons. The gain of players will definitely outweigh the loss of Klingon players. Those lost players would probably come back when they finally do drop their buckets of info on the ridge heads.

Simply put, the 'dearth of klingon content' is really only affecting a small group of potential costumers.

At release and post release, it will be forgotten by almost the entire player base - provided that the final changes really provide a balance of both factions (and subsequent changes)