Particles & Gases

[Moment_of_Epiphany]

I can still remember the first time I saw and heard 'that moment'. Y'know, where Voyager flies through the rings and you 'hear' and see the particles colliding against the hull.

I can still remember the first time I saw and heard 'that moment' in Voyager. Y'know, where Voyager eerily glides through that cloud of nebulous gas.

[Edit: I didnt realise these were both from Voyager credits. My bad.]

Does anyone know if these style of sound & vision effects combos will be included in Star Trek Online? Wasn't TNG one of the first to use some form of Dolby surround to get this effect across?

[Osias]

It would be nice to see but i'm not sure STO is going to be the game to provide it for us.

They want the game to be as accessible as possible, that means as many players on as many computers as possible, regardless of what sort of system they're using.

Cryptic is using the same engine for STO that they used for City of Heroes (Released 8 years ago i believe?), Granted it's been upgraded and modified (They used it for CO) it's still that same engine, and i'm not sure it's got what it takes for this level of detail and hyper-realism (i use the term hyper-realism because i'm not sure nebulae and such would behave they do in the scenes you mention)

[Ravas]

So far the only thing that I can surely predict from screens is that its not the sound of particles or nebulas hitting the hull that we are going to hear. Its ASTEROIDS! LOTS OF THEM!

[TruthSeer]

It would be really cool if some of those gases were combustible. Would make combat interesting.

[Ravas]

It would be really cool if some of those gases were combustible. Would make combat interesting.

Gasses dont burn in space/vacuum, you know that, dont you?

[Osias]

Gasses dont burn in space/vacuum, you know that, dont you?


There have been plenty of times in Star Trek that they've ignited a Nebula or Detonated some Leaking Something or rather. In reality? Sure it can't happen.

In Trek?

DEAR LORD THEY'RE GOING TO IGNITE THE HORSE HEAD NEBULA GET A BUCKET!

[TruthSeer]

Gasses dont burn in space/vacuum, you know that, dont you?

They may not burn but Star Trek has show a few examples of nebulas/pockets of gas being ignited by weapons fire. And after all this is a Star Trek game before it's a scientifically accurate game.

[Ravas]

There have been plenty of times in Star Trek that they've ignited a Nebula or Detonated some Leaking Something or rather. In reality? Sure it can't happen.

In Trek?

DEAR LORD THEY'RE GOING TO IGNITE THE HORSE HEAD NEBULA GET A BUCKET!

Lol yeah now i remember those events. Funny though I never considered them actually burning :O It was like more "ignited as in shining" by radiation made by exploded torpedoes or something similar...

[Kaybok]

It would be really cool if some of those gases were combustible. Would make combat interesting.

In one of the dev vids (i think it was with STO exec producer) they said there is a skill to dump warp core plasma and to ignite it. Freakin' bowl of kewlness there. I think (could be wrong) I heard you can also go into nebulae and they will have different effects on your ship, like one that drains your shields. Can't wait to find out more!

[beast0382]

As for igniting gas clouds in space.... possible I say.... there are metals that burn under water and make thier own oxygen to feed the flames, so I do believe its highly possible for some elements to ignite in space. Take a look at stars and our own sun, in all reality.... they are just giant balls of flaming gas at the most basic level

[TruthSeer]

As for igniting gas clouds in space.... possible I say.... there are metals that burn under water and make thier own oxygen to feed the flames, so I do believe its highly possible for some elements to ignite in space. Take a look at stars and our own sun, in all reality.... they are just giant balls of flaming gas at the most basic level

Actually their basically fusion reactors. Which would be really cool in game, a fire fight in a nebula, a dense section is ignited by weapons fire, BOOM!, everyones dead.

[thefreshjedi]

Um...did you guys all happen to forget about the Sun?

Granted it's not "burning", necessarily, but it's more like billions of hydrogen and helium atoms colliding under immense pressure and gravity which causes fusion, so what you're witnessing isn't a "burn" necessarily, but more of a constant explosion.

-avery

[TruthSeer]

Um...did you guys all happen to forget about the Sun?

Granted it's not "burning", necessarily, but it's more like billions of hydrogen and helium atoms colliding under immense pressure and gravity which causes fusion, so what you're witnessing isn't a "burn" necessarily, but more of a constant explosion.

-avery

Nope didn't forget, Aeryn mentioned it and I expanded with my BOOM! everyone's dead scenario.

[thefreshjedi]

Nope didn't forget, Aeryn mentioned it and I expanded with my BOOM! everyone's dead scenario.

kk, missed that post, but I was just sitting there strumming my fingers impatiently on the table waiting for someone to say something...


oh yeah, and technically it's not really and "explosion" either, at least not in the sense that we can understand it. Things actually implode in a vacuum, which in turn creates a reverbration, repeatingly collapsing on itself, and from a 4th Dimensional perspective, after it collapses enough times, it eventually works itself back out again 3-Dimensionally, so in our visual spectrum it looks like it's coming outward...

-avery

[kelddel]

All chemical explosives that work on Earth will work in space. They supply their own oxidizing agent, so that they can burn fast enough without the need of oxygen.

[soas]

Well think of phaser fire in a scientific way.

Phaser fire is a plasma that is expelled as Nadion particles.

Now a few things about plasma. Its mostly superheated particles. Thus when placed in contact was a gas sitting out in space at almost zero kelvin, there is going to be a HUGE difference in temperature.

The ignition of a gas nebula might result in a few factors.

1. Heat.
With the bombardment of these particles, they can, in theory, pass along thermo energy. If the heat of formation of the gas is overcome, it may reduce the gas to a simpler molecular arrangements, or combine molecules to a more complex state. More then likely, the later. If the reaction is exergonic (gives off energy.) then this could be then transfers to surrounding gases. With enough energy pumped into the gas, and given enough gas molecules react, you could start a chain reaction resulting in heat, light, radiation and kinetic energy.

2. Collision
Almost like the first one, but kinetic energy is imparted. Kinetic energy is easily turned into thermo energy and thus the cycle can start as above.

3. Charge. Since most plasmas are a highly charged particle and give off light (photons that can convert to electrons), unlike a full atom, they can impart this charge into the gas monocle sending extra energy into the ionic bonds and/or covalent bonds that hold the molecule together. With enough energy, these bonds snap and quite possible also release this energy back into the environment. More importantly, this frees up the atoms to interact with others, and possible the combination with result in heat.

4.breakdown. If enough energy is pushed into the molecules they can then break apart. Now this i9s not fission, but a chemical reaction. If these molecules are not stable when they are split, it could cause a chain reaction of them shedding energy and simply breaking down further.

Now all of the above are examples of molecules breaking down or combining. If the gas has single atoms in there , enough energy given to them can make them bind into molecules. Most types of simpler combination are exergonic, or give out energy, more so then what was given.

Any way you slice it, its with in the bounds of science to excite a gas nebulae to the tipping point, were it mush flush the energy out and possible combine or break apart into a more stable state and shed energy. Much like if you were to seed a cloud with dust, or extra water. Sooner or later, its going to rain.

Lastly, we think of not being able to cause a fire in space. But a fire is really, just light and heat and chemical reactions. free oxygen is combined with carbon and releases energy. This energy is spewing into the air with light, heat, and radiation. Air is just gas, much like a nebulae. The heat in a fire is passed from atom to atom in the air making the surrounds warm. Too much, and even the simple air we breath can be lit a blaze. Its why most plasma experiments on Earth real world are done in vacuums or inert gases.

Imagine purposely pumping a plasma weapon into a cloud of gas.

[Flatfingers]

If we're talking explosions in space, let's not forget that there are all kinds of things in space that, if not "exploding," are spitting out vast quantities of all kinds of stuff.

Our Sun, for example, not only emits enough material to heat the Earth, as well as (like other stars) enough photons to be seen from thousands of light-years away, it spits out enough stuff to cause a form of positive "pressure" out to a point beyond the orbit of Pluto (the "heliopause").

Odder things like pulsars and quasars eject harsher forms of radiation like X-rays, so much so in the case of quasars ("quasi-stellar radio sources") that they are among the most distant/oldest objects our various kinds of telescopes can detect.

Then there are supernovae. These babies do explode in the vacuum of space, expanding for billions of miles and millions of years... and a good thing for us, too, since they are the source of the heavier metals like iron (created in the stellar fusion process) that allow life as we know it to exist.

Finally, of course, there was the biggest 'splosion of them all: the Big Bang, before which space and time did not exist. Personally I believe this event was just a special effect by Michael Bay for one of his movies, but so far the proof of this has eluded me....

Sure would be something if this kind of stuff was considered to have value by someone making a science fiction MMORPG, wouldn't it?

--Flatfingers

[BaakCha]

Gasses dont burn in space/vacuum, you know that, dont you?

Stars are in space, and they burn....

[KaptinJRN]

first off, if you are in a gaseous nebula, you are not in a vacuum. duhh.

if oxygen or even chlorine is present and something that is combustible then it will burn.

A perfect vacuum would contain no atoms or molecules, but this is unobtainable as all the materials that surround such a space have a finite vapour pressure.

in a nebulae you would be way higher than this, approaching In a soft (or low) vacuum the pressure is reduced to about 10−2 pascal,


it is all a matter(not the noun) ratios of combustible materials to fuel for the combustion which is the oxygen or chlorine

plz let us pull off the riker maneuver.

i believe that you guys are mixing burning and sounds, there is no sound of explosions in most space, becausee there is not enough particules to cause you to hear the effect. so no, for the most part, there is no sound in space, this is not like an explosion. or burning,

i do admit, that it would be hard to get a constant burning in a nebula, but an explosion shouldn't be that hard to do.