Earning while your AFK

[Tribbler]

In several MMO's, there are things that can earn you materials (mining in SWG), they can earn you enhancements (increase in health regeneration bonus in COH), training increases (EVE) overnight, days or weeks of being offline.

For people that work and are away from the game for hours, days and weeks at a time, it is a good method for them to actually achieve something when they can't be online.

In order for STO to be more user friendly and not just scripted as you play, an alternative to earnings should be offered for those less fortunate to stay online all the time.

If STO has enough goods in the player based market system, the players would be able to mine and manufacture items in assembly houses while they are online or offline so that the markeplace would be more dynamic and costs would be lower than if the individual had to take a couple hours to make 1 item.

A player based economy is fun if there are the right types of items that can be made from the resources that are gathered. I have often enjoyed gathering materials while a fight was not taking place and being able to increase the strength of my components through the buy an sell market. When i discover a planet, I would like to mine items from it that are valuable and hard to find. SWG does this and there are large fields where mutiple types of resources spawn and usually disappear after several days, but as long as you have plenty of power, the mining station will continue to extract the raw materials.

If you camp overnight in an area when your away, such as in a hospital, the more time you spend in it, the more knowledgeable you become when dealing with health related items and you earn buffs. Same as a military academy or a science academy. It doesn't necessarily mean you will forever retain these abilities, some may expire in several hours of playing. City of Heroes uses this and it's ok, but the bonuses are meager, but still bonuses.

Then there is training time. It remains constant while you continue playing whether or not your docked, offline or fighting. This is staged in a "que" and you can slot different types of training in the "que" and as the time runs out, the next training session begins after that. EVE Online uses this and is good. The only problem is, if you are offline alot, continue to slot training, you could become pretty strong without firing a shot.

Offline strengthening is being used quite frequently and i wonder what Cryptic has in store for us? What do you think their focus will be on? Economy, Buffs, Training, other?

[Elboulevardo]

of those ideas mentioned, i primarily like the temp buffs gained while offline if you camp out in certain designated areas.

I've never been a fan of the "reward without playing" mechanism that games use...i see how it makes the game more pallatable for certain players...but like you said in the even example...players could skill up to a high level without ever actually doing anything...that seems kinda lame to me

if we're talking strictly about "away from the game" type mechanisms, i think a temp buff is appropriate, at most

[Sorez]

Personally I hope there is no kind of offline "reward" so to speak. Progression should be all about participation

[Evil_Custard91]

Personally I hope there is no kind of offline "reward" so to speak. Progression should be all about participation

i agree. although some people dont have as much time to put into the game it would be a pain in the rear to see lots of AFK ships floating around DS9 when ur trying to complete a mission etc. then it would also give an AFK player an advantage as normal players dont want to be sat around trying to earn buffs. they want to play the game.

i think it would promote a lazy attitude within the game and would actually harm STO in the long run. :(

[Phymon]

I totally agree. Play to profit. "It is the order of things" and would make a lot of Ferengi very proud.

[mach789]

I am for and against this idea at the same time. If implemented properly, I would be for it. Let me explain.

Gathering - Since this is a sci-fi setting and not a fantasy based one, I can imagine it being more palatable to someones taste to be able to "buy" robots or some form of automaton, which will run in the background to perform these various gathering tasks for you; a simulation aspect to a real-time game. This would provide offline benefits to those who play weekends only for example, and it will also benefit those who play daily since they will probably be able to gather resources at a faster rate (having more credits to spend towards automatons). That would balance any buffs that an offline player would receive.

Production - I think EVE online has a good system in place for this. Creating units based on the resources you've gathered and a queue system for production. (Giving offline and online players an even playing field). Depending on the size and quantity of the item being produced, each unit costs a certain amount of time and resources to produce.

NO! - What I am not in favour of are player-created macros and scripts that players would be able to create to do these and any other tasks. Anyone following Darkfall will know how rampant macroing and scripting to skill-up ruined that game.

[tburrfoot]

NO! - What I am not in favour of are player-created macros and scripts that players would be able to create to do these and any other tasks. Anyone following Darkfall will know how rampant macroing and scripting to skill-up ruined that game.

funny. as most people would agree with you on this....there ar players out there that connot play the game in a fair manner.
no game is free of macro and botting to gain on others.

[cipher_nemo]

You can always do macros and your own scripts, regardless of what measures developers/publishers take. I could easily write my own app with screencap comparison and some rudimentary AI, which I've done to have a second PC and character help me, but which I wouldn't do for anything except to enjoy the game. I'm not a gold farmer and am completely against that.

But regardless of that, I could be happy with this topic either way. But macros/scripts have nothing to do with it.

[JTtaylor]

Personally I didn't like the afk earning in SWG at all. infact I hated it and I think the players who did so where very annoying. Like those dancers who keep asking for money every 2 minutes. while they arent even there playing the game. I understand that people have jobs and lives and that some can be very demanding but if you don't have time to play then I feel you just simply don't have time to play a game.

[cipher_nemo]

infact I hated it and I think the players who did so where very annoying. Like those dancers who keep asking for money every 2 minutes.

Examples of the very bad and very much minority of players. Annoying instances and whiners/beggars will always stick in our mind, but it's not the majority of players.

I'll cite EVE Online as an example of where this worked well. I didn't like EVE at all, but the afk while earning points over time thing worked for that game and its players. I'm not sure how well it would work for STO, but I could foresee either outcome. There's nothing to say for a fact that it will go either way. STO is a very different style game/platform than both EVE and SWG.

[beast0382]

Heres the thing... in EvE you could train up for a dreadnaught without really touching the game eexcept training skills.... but the problem is... how are you going to BUY the ship..... you may beable to fly the ship with maximum skills associated with it at the maximum level.... but how will you get the ship?

I think a slight mix with some offline skills... or some other benefiting thing like log out locations... lets say.... your ship's crew... lets say a defiant class... there are no recreational facilities on that ship... you spend a week in space your crew becomes weary. You dock at a station lets say DS9 for example, you log out and your crew gets 'shore leave' and thier performance goes up, but there should be a cap for that. Another draw back would be... you have to be offline for shore leave to happen and its a set number of hours and minutes based on the morale rating

[wolfing]

you need to make a distinction.
AFK rewards I disagree with. Offline rewards are ok. In fact, leave the boring parts like harvesting/mining to be automatically done offline, and then when I'm online I can do stuff with what was gathered. I definitely don't want to see ghost ships all over the place (afk). No 'extra exp' in any case.

[Zepath]

I can't think of anything except mining (if we build mining platforms) and selling (merchants, auction house, etc) that should be going on while you are off line.

And even with the mining, it should not have a capacity beyond 72 hours before it can't mine anymore (it's storage is full).

Harvesters in SW;G were brilliant.

But they screwed em up with the resource jockeying ever couple of days. Instead of making everyone scramble for the best spots (which meant the person who couldn't be on line first, lost) they should have just had nodes eventually run out, and you had to find a new spot.

I'd like to see them do that here ... find a planet where you can move/build your mining platform, and eventually the resource runs out so you have to move it again .... but over a long period of time ... like days.

[Tribbler]

Heres the thing... in EvE you could train up for a dreadnaught without really touching the game eexcept training skills.... but the problem is... how are you going to BUY the ship..... you may beable to fly the ship with maximum skills associated with it at the maximum level.... but how will you get the ship?

I think a slight mix with some offline skills... or some other benefiting thing like log out locations... lets say.... your ship's crew... lets say a defiant class... there are no recreational facilities on that ship... you spend a week in space your crew becomes weary. You dock at a station lets say DS9 for example, you log out and your crew gets 'shore leave' and thier performance goes up, but there should be a cap for that. Another draw back would be... you have to be offline for shore leave to happen and its a set number of hours and minutes based on the morale rating

Now thats a good idea. Lets say that there is a small fatigue indicator that continues to drain away at at a low percentage of your crewman's health, speed, special ability that makes them a little less effective.

Logging out at a Starbase would bring all the stats up to 100%. That would be a good one.

[Tribbler]

I can't think of anything except mining (if we build mining platforms) and selling (merchants, auction house, etc) that should be going on while you are off line.

And even with the mining, it should not have a capacity beyond 72 hours before it can't mine anymore (it's storage is full).

Harvesters in SW;G were brilliant.

But they screwed em up with the resource jockeying ever couple of days. Instead of making everyone scramble for the best spots (which meant the person who couldn't be on line first, lost) they should have just had nodes eventually run out, and you had to find a new spot.

I'd like to see them do that here ... find a planet where you can move/build your mining platform, and eventually the resource runs out so you have to move it again .... but over a long period of time ... like days.

I enjoyed that too, one of my toons was a shipwright and those rare high end materials really helped on getting crits on engines etc. One of the most enjoyable parts of the game :D

[Tribbler]

you need to make a distinction.AFK rewards I disagree with. Offline rewards are ok. In fact, leave the boring parts like harvesting/mining to be automatically done offline, and then when I'm online I can do stuff with what was gathered. I definitely don't want to see ghost ships all over the place (afk). No 'extra exp' in any case.

Well sometimes they are the same. Without writing a novel, I just simplified it. I am not talking about creature farming by setting a book on the fire button, I am talking about things like manufacturing, and all the other things mentioned in the OP while you were off doing something else. Similar to the Auction House selling your wares while your out of the Auction House. Away from Keyboard (AFK) means just that, logged off or not.

Oooh noooo, no ghost ships that have AFK on them---heavens no.

[Merivon]

Oooh noooo, no ghost ships that have AFK on them---heavens no.



Agreed. That is unless we can hook up a tractor beam and drag their sorry lazy ass' ship in to a decaying orbit around a star...I didn't say that out loud did I. Seriously though automatic playing while AFK destroys any game and I would absolutely hate to see that happen to STO.

The only thing I think that should be allowed while AFK is to recover / repair damage taken to a ship during battle assuming there is such a mechanism. Maybe and I mean as long as it is monitored closely it may be ok to allow for a few hours of mining / crafting. When I say few hours I am thinking 12 hours at the most before the storage bins on the mining or factory fill up. This way there is an incentive to at least login for a little while every day. If you choose to take a vacation from the game for a few days / weeks, don't expect to be where everyone else is who has been logged in and playing.

[r3v]

I'm in favor of this kind of thing, since I tend to benefit from it. Heh. I work 80+ hrs a week and have a family. Outside of a couple hours on Sunday, my game time is limited to when I've managed clear myself from work duties, spend some time with the family and then manage to stay awake later than the rest.

Now, put the tiny violins away, this isn't a sob story, I'm just laying out where I'm coming from. :)

I'm not looking for anything that would benefit me more than someone who's putting in the time and effort... I'd feel that was unfair and wouldn't enjoy it. However, temporary buffs, would allow me to experience more of the game in the small amount of time I have to play. (Any temporary buffs should affect PvE gameplay only, of course...)

Eve's model of skill progression was OK too, since it wasn't a bonus over someone logged in. They were still doing better than me, who was sitting at work lamenting my decreasing gametime.... but I still felt like something was happening. heh. It was, however, a sort of odd mechanism.

[tburrfoot]

just curious...why do we need buffs?
why is everyone fixated on the term buffs?
why cant we have a game simply on skil sets and and points, or however they work it, put into them?
if i spend points into a highr grade phaser, then i should benefit from that verses one who does not.

i think the "buffing" system has been overdone and caters to the weak and people who cant seem to play a game as designed. and it is unfortunate that almost all games of MMO genre have this system in place becuase of crybabies and the need to keep higher end play base in the game.

[Malakili]

Heres the thing... in EvE you could train up for a dreadnaught without really touching the game eexcept training skills.... but the problem is... how are you going to BUY the ship..... you may beable to fly the ship with maximum skills associated with it at the maximum level.... but how will you get the ship?


Yeah, i have a feeling most of the people that complain about EVEs skill system never played past the free trial and don't truly understanding the game. Skill points is an important part of your character, but your real influence and power in the game world is based on SO much more than that.

So, I guess my point is that its not actually that getting skills offline or online that is important, what is important is that there are compelling reasons to log in regularly. In EVE there are a TON of reasons why you want to be online instead of offline, even if you are training skills at the same speed either way. As long as STO gives us reasons to be online, it really doesn't matter if you can ALSO improve your character while you are offline.

[Excalibur3401]

i hope there is no afk grinding in this game, it should be outlawed actually if there is someone afk grinding they should be fired upon. LOL

[Malakili]

i hope there is no afk grinding in this game, it should be outlawed actually if there is someone afk grinding they should be fired upon. LOL

You don't understand what this topic is about at all. Its actually about passive skill gain (or passive X gain, where X is some sort of thing related to advancement) as an intended mechanic.

[Nindran]

i Really sad this topic even came up i don't want incourage this kind behave in the game. this kind behave show not just rudeness to those player that want play the game as game. This bahave one reason SWG auction house price are over prices:mad:

[Malakili]

i Really sad this topic even came up i don't want incourage this kind behave in the game. this kind behave show not just rudeness to those player that want play the game as game. This bahave one reason SWG auction house price are over prices:mad:

See my post directly above this and actually read the thread before posting next time, just my opinion.

[Nindran]

I rather not incourage players to just leave they char somewhere over night lag up the server say borg invasion comes. It harder if ever for player tried get into the server if we have player just sit there. They other player that want play game and you are use up they chance to get in by just sit there all night.

[kildar888]

Maybe, am am missing something but having been a MMO player since the days when Empiriana and the Original Neverwinter Nights was on compuserve, I can give a different perspective. I work 60+ hours a week and working 16:00 - 24:00 shift its hard to find people to play with, and had 2 families that I spend time with (Children with X-wife) and having delt with both powergamers and otherplayers like me.
I see nothing wrong since we are going to be able to have multiple characters with pulling into a training facility for a period of time say 36+ Hours of real time before temp bonuses appear; the longer you are off the better bonuses.
This would do a couple of things it would encourage more people to try new things and classes as well as help to eliminate the massive advantages a kid who lives at home and has no bills and has unlimited time to play will get. Lets also not forget you can only improve in one skill at a time and if you are doing these things you arent able to do anything else with that character.
Now things like mining or doing something else to earn money, I have no problem with being done afk using bots. Although they should have to be serviced like every 48 to 72 hours when the bins fill out.

[Redshirt_40067]

Some unattended "play" should be expected if there is a lengthy crafting process, like in EVE, or factory runs in SWG. Really it's not a reward, you are paying (in SWG) maintenance, using energy, and you have to wait for the run to at least be partially complete before you can pull items out. And you get no xp for using a factory. EVE is somewhat similar, as in you pay fees and use resources you either collect or buy. Never crafted in EVE other than the tutorial, so if i am off the mark by all means correct me.

[Drexxus3d]

Personally I hope there is no kind of offline "reward" so to speak. Progression should be all about participation

Agreed.

You get out what you put in. No one should be compensated for not playing as much as others just as no one should be compensated for not having as much skill or with inferior tactics to others. People should earn what they get.

Everyone in the game should have the same "opportunities" to do and obtain anything any other player can so long as they have enough skill and time. But having the opportunities is all the fairness needed. Giving bonuses or freebies to people who don't play as much is not required. You aren't entitled to progress just as fast or obtain everything in the game just as every other player deos, your monthly fee isn't buying your levels or gear or skills. They are simply paying for your right to access the server, nothing more. Everyone should have to work to earn everything available, not be given bonuses or freebies for certain people.

Every person should take the same amount of time to gain skillpoints or ranks, not have some gain it much faster in game time simply because they don't play often. You aren't required to have maximum points to enjoy the game, why do you feel the need to rush through it? Just level like everyone else and enjoy the ride.

[FerrariF40LM]

SWG had a good mining system. It was kinda like real life...For example If i find oil the most efficiant way to get it is to use like a oil platform or somthing, which takes maintenance and money to do it. It was almost the exact way it was applied in SWG. There is nothing wrong with mining installations if its applies to the game system.

[Loekii]

of those ideas mentioned, i primarily like the temp buffs gained while offline if you camp out in certain designated areas.

I've never been a fan of the "reward without playing" mechanism that games use...i see how it makes the game more pallatable for certain players...but like you said in the even example...players could skill up to a high level without ever actually doing anything...that seems kinda lame to me

if we're talking strictly about "away from the game" type mechanisms, i think a temp buff is appropriate, at most

I agree. If you are not playing, then you really should not be rewarded.

I just accept that when my real life keeps me away from the game for a few weeks, that I will not be making gains during that time.

[Zepath]

With screen scraping, packet-sniffing, XML files, buss keying, macros and scripting ... you cannot stop people from cheating in a game ... some do it as their hobby, some do it for the money ... some do it for the ego.

I had a buddy who 'bot'd' mining in the Burning Crusade of WoW ... including flying back to town when his inventory was full, and mailing the ore he'd collected to an alt for retrieval in the morning ... and starting the process all over. He'd let it run all night long.

Between selling gold to his guildies, and selling gold to the gold-selling companies, he could make between $300 and $1200 a month ... tax free.

What's this got to do with the topic?

Had there been a mining system like SW;G ... where you had to wait real time (off-line) for your resources to be mined ... it wouldn't of been possible for him to do that.

Not to mention that SW;G's mining system was probably the most "casual player" friendly system I've seen to date (with the exception of the mine placement itself ... but that was a different issue).

SW;G didn't fail because of its off-line resource gathering or off-line crafting ... it failed because of incessant nerfs, a poor combat system, and bad Dev decisions.

[Drexxus3d]

With screen scraping, packet-sniffing, XML files, buss keying, macros and scripting ... you cannot stop people from cheating in a game ... some do it as their hobby, some do it for the money ... some do it for the ego.

I had a buddy who 'bot'd' mining in the Burning Crusade of WoW ... including flying back to town when his inventory was full, and mailing the ore he'd collected to an alt for retrieval in the morning ... and starting the process all over. He'd let it run all night long.

Between selling gold to his guildies, and selling gold to the gold-selling companies, he could make between $300 and $1200 a month ... tax free.

What's this got to do with the topic?

Had there been a mining system like SW;G ... where you had to wait real time (off-line) for your resources to be mined ... it wouldn't of been possible for him to do that.

Not to mention that SW;G's mining system was probably the most "casual player" friendly system I've seen to date (with the exception of the mine placement itself ... but that was a different issue).

SW;G didn't fail because of its off-line resource gathering or off-line crafting ... it failed because of incessant nerfs, a poor combat system, and bad Dev decisions.

So your friend broke several laws and got away with it, thus we should change policy to make people more unwilling to break the law instead of actually enforcing it?

Well hell, let's just legalize everything, then no one would break laws anymore! :D A crime-less society, why didn't I think of that!

[Dext]

Some of the Thing you talked about here I could see like have some kind of AI miners for harvesting like in SWG but as for skill training NOOOOOOOO!!!!! I know 15 people that play EvE an all they do is log in check on skills an pick a new skill if there ready to train a new one then log out. This would let to a lot of power leveling site leveling toons for people an people leveling toons on other account just to sell them.

I think what you work for an what you put into something is what you should get out of it. If you work hard at a job should someone that did not do much work get the promotion or that raise over you? NO!. The time you put into a game should work the same way an that way is "The work you put into something is what you should get out of it".

[Drexxus3d]

Some of the Thing you talked about here I could see like have some kind of AI miners for harvesting like in SWG but as for skill training NOOOOOOOO!!!!! I know 15 people that play EvE an all they do is log in check on skills an pick a new skill if there ready to train a new one then log out. This would let to a lot of power leveling site leveling toons for people an people leveling toons on other account just to sell them.

I think what you work for an what you put into something is what you should get out of it. If you work hard at a job should someone that did not do much work get the promotion or that raise over you? NO!. The time you put into a game should work the same way an that way is "The work you put into something is what you should get out of it".

Actually I play Eve like that 90% of the time, I just skill train, then months later when the skill is actually done, i play for a few days enjoying it then don't play again for a few more months while the next skill trains.

Theres no incentive or motivation to play that game at all.

[Dext]

Heres the thing... in EvE you could train up for a dreadnaught without really touching the game eexcept training skills.... but the problem is... how are you going to BUY the ship..... you may beable to fly the ship with maximum skills associated with it at the maximum level.... but how will you get the ship?

I think a slight mix with some offline skills... or some other benefiting thing like log out locations... lets say.... your ship's crew... lets say a defiant class... there are no recreational facilities on that ship... you spend a week in space your crew becomes weary. You dock at a station lets say DS9 for example, you log out and your crew gets 'shore leave' and thier performance goes up, but there should be a cap for that. Another draw back would be... you have to be offline for shore leave to happen and its a set number of hours and minutes based on the morale rating

Sell eve time cards (AN yes they let them do this you can do it on the Eve site its self)

[Vlherg]

In a high tech Star Trek universe I'd really want to see automated mining of resources and factory production of any crafted goods. Having to manually chip off bits of rock and assemble everything by hand just doesn't fit the setting.

Earning XP or skills while offline though, I'm not a fan.

[Dext]

In a high tech Star Trek universe I'd really want to see automated mining of resources and factory production of any crafted goods. Having to manually chip off bits of rock and assemble everything by hand just doesn't fit the setting.

Earning XP or skills while offline though, I'm not a fan.

Then you do not know all that much about star trek. Even star Fleet uses miners.
Go here for more info
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Mining

[Vlherg]

Then you do not know all that much about star trek. Even star Fleet uses miners.
Go here for more info
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Mining

And do those miners chip off a single piece of ore and then go scurrying off looking for another node or do they actually set up persistent mines?
Typical MMO style is the former, I want to see the latter. Whether it be by mining machines or theoretical NPCs I'm really not bothered.

[Sinclair]

I like EVE's skill system that allows earning while offline. But the downside is that the higher tier skills take a very very long time to train. It becomes a draft after awhile, as I think it might be more fun to earn the higher skills by playing the game instead. I like POTBS's production system that allows things to be manufactured while offline. For both games, these sytems seem to make a lot of sense, given the type and pace of game.

[CherryTerri]

So you are saying we should allow AFK levels in any sense of the term?

No.

I can't be on 24/7 ... but I don't feel it is right for me to sit my Gorn butt down and get stuff I am not actually WORKING for.

Any person doing that crap in EQ2 gets booted out of the game once a GM sees it happening ... which mainly consisted of a pet class setting their pets to defend while the player goes AFK and levels while at work.

[Tribbler]

So you are saying we should allow AFK levels in any sense of the term?

No.

I can't be on 24/7 ... but I don't feel it is right for me to sit my Gorn butt down and get stuff I am not actually WORKING for.

Any person doing that crap in EQ2 gets booted out of the game once a GM sees it happening ... which mainly consisted of a pet class setting their pets to defend while the player goes AFK and levels while at work.

No, the OP is not about you gaining XP by exploiting some fault of the game. It is talking about game designed training, buff enhancements, or even spending money (whatever currency is used in-game) to purchase manufacturing or mining equipment that operates while your not online or away from the manufacturing plant so-to-speak.

[Avenger_Dragon]

I think Eve struck a good balance for their game, yes you can train while away but for one thing.... It takes a LONG time to train the more powerful skills

The balance is the cost to use that skill, either you have friends who are willing to give you the money/resources, or you sit your butt down and earn them yourself. You can't just wait and Poof you have your dreadnought. Eve makes you (or at least someone) work for it.

It was already said that Skills would be the top thing in STO, whoever has the better skills has the better chance for survival or mission completion. It depends on how these skills are obtained. are they exp based or time based?

I'm thinking Exp based since we know very little about the system economy and players would need to log-in and actively work for their skills.

Offline rewards, at the moment i don't think is viable. Sure it would be nice for the people living offline to feel like they're getting a little something out of their subscription. I'm one of those people. But i don't see that working in STO at the moment.

I'm on board with the ban on AFK gaming. offline is one thing, but AFK is just being lazy. From what I heard about SWG having offline working... doesn't work either.

[Lendosan]

Well the Eve system works, but in a sense penalises online gamers by increasing the amount of time it takes to train skills. Some of them skills later on take a stupidly long time, and the benefit can usually be gained by having a piece of equipment.

Lotro has a good offline system, which is Exp gain boost. So the longer your offline the longer your Exp boost, double Exp for someone who has been offline for about a month or two is an amazing thing to come back too, and also really encourages people to play through with it.

Im all for some sort of benefit for offline people, as I work 40+ hours a week, but love me some gaming. Whenever I get into an MMO, I find myself falling out of it again because my online buddies leap ahead of me because they have more time. Its off putting and I think of Cryptic did something for the hard working offline guy, it would be awesome.

Before people start saying things like they don't deserve it, well think about how balanced it is. If someone is online 40+ hours a week gaming you get the levels quicker, the drops and you get advanced further along, you also have more time to explore do find things the offline dude cannot. If Im offline 40+ hours a week and I get minimal time on, with double Exp I MAY catch up to you, but not with 40+ hours gaming you have. The drops I get will be the same, but due to the lack of time gaming, I won't get as much as you.

Id like something similar to Lotro, but the Eve system is good, but has its flaws.

[jeandeaux]

I'm not a supporter of AFK activities at all, but I do favor having "tools" that allow me to spend more time playing and less time crafting. I do know, however, no matter what system you develop someone is going to find a way to do it afk for some type of gain. Putting in a bunch of "speedbumps" to avert this type of player detracts more from my game play than the afk player does. A good example is now what entertainers have to do in SWG where you now have to count random symbols on a screen in order to give a buff, that's just insipid.

Now I do like the harvestors in that game as it allows me to spend time playing instead of digging. It was fun mining in EVE as well, although you couldn't really do it afk. A good mining op took several people in a variety of ships and was fun to participate in when the split was fair. But I believe STO stated resources are obtained through diplomacy so I don't think harvestors or collection of resources will be anything of the like.

I would admit it would be kinda neat to be able to have some offline abilities, such as launching probes for space explorations or science missions and collecting data to report back once online again. But can't say I'd be interested in a whole lot more. If you want gain, you should be playing.

[cipher_nemo]

On a related side note:

There's a reason that an AFK-only flash game is ranked 4/5, has 266,000 plays, and is on the second page of all of the top adventure and RPG flash games on Kongregate. Here's the game:

http://www.kongregate.com/games/ayumilove/ayumilove-hackerstory-v1

Plenty of people like this AFK stuff. I'm not really interested in it, but I know it's not going away. Ever.

[jeandeaux]

On a related side note:

There's a reason that an AFK-only flash game is ranked 4/5, has 266,000 plays, and is on the second page of all of the top adventure and RPG flash games on Kongregate. Here's the game:

http://www.kongregate.com/games/ayumilove/ayumilove-hackerstory-v1

Plenty of people like this AFK stuff. I'm not really interested in it, but I know it's not going away. Ever.

That would be a Turn based game, post your move, moves are processed a specified time, results returned at a later time. Not quite the same genre of game. But yes, turn based games used to be all the rage, Planets was the bomb in it's day when BBS's where the norm.

[cipher_nemo]

That would be a Turn based game, post your move, moves are processed a specified time, results returned at a later time. Not quite the same genre of game. But yes, turn based games used to be all the rage, Planets was the bomb in it's day when BBS's where the norm.

Yup, different type of game for sure. I'm talking only about the concept. That game isn't turn based, though. It's a let-it-run-and-forget-it game. Sure, you can go there and switch things now and then, but your character just attacks, earns xp, earns dropped items, etc., without doing anything.

[Replica]

If the game is fun to play at all levels, then there is no need to "help out" those who don't play often. If the game is only fun after finishing the grind to Admiral, then the game needs rebalanceing. One of the classic problems with MMOs is the VAST difference in power between the mid and high levels. The gains should be smaller and smaller the closer you get to the level cap, do that and the game stops being about the grind and starts being about fun.

[CaptainBurst]

I think ground mining will be done by the guilds or fleets in STO by placing colonies and mines on discovered colony planets (not the main populated planets like Earth). The resource should be shown as a resource map (as in Star Trek New Worlds) rather than by precentage (like in SWG). Each resource color would represent the resource with the highest precentage resource in the ore, but all resources could still be mined in the same spot. The planet can be made up of one resource or many resources, and may change precentage of the resources based off of the amount of those resources mined. Very similar to the Star Trek New Worlds system.

[Lendosan]

I hope that fleets/guilds can set up mining colonies etc, as that would be awesome. I just hope the game is on a scope so large it allows for stuff like that.

[Avenger_Dragon]

I think ground mining will be done by the guilds or fleets in STO by placing colonies and mines on discovered colony planets (not the main populated planets like Earth). The resource should be shown as a resource map (as in Star Trek New Worlds) rather than by precentage (like in SWG). Each resource color would represent the resource with the highest precentage resource in the ore, but all resources could still be mined in the same spot. The planet can be made up of one resource or many resources, and may change precentage of the resources based off of the amount of those resources mined. Very similar to the Star Trek New Worlds system.

Problem, what would those resources be used for? so far there hasn't been any mention of a crafting process, which would be perfect for mining.

IF we could get a glimpse at how we acquire components and new ships, and if we can trade between each other. That would go a lot farther with the mining aspect.

Until then the Mining idea may just be a dead-end

[Blademaven]

We're all talking about farming mats for crafting like that would work in this game. What happened to replicators? Mining colonies shouldn't be necessary. Maybe have ships on the lookout for unreplicatorable mats. But a full colony?

[gargamehl]

off-line-bonus....yes, why not....BUT PLEASE, NO AFK-BONUS like atlantica online and fishing, autocraft.....it´s a waste of performance to push the player to let the computer run day and night without any need. Make a (just a idea) mining - offline-for (max) 8 hours in a secure area, yes....but pls no "activate miningsystem and go to bed, in the morning your ship is full (or not, depends on your time of offline)"

[Tribbler]

just curious...why do we need buffs?
why is everyone fixated on the term buffs?
why cant we have a game simply on skil sets and and points, or however they work it, put into them?
if i spend points into a highr grade phaser, then i should benefit from that verses one who does not.

i think the "buffing" system has been overdone and caters to the weak and people who cant seem to play a game as designed. and it is unfortunate that almost all games of MMO genre have this system in place becuase of crybabies and the need to keep higher end play base in the game.

Let me try to answer that Cy:

In order to get a buff, you usually have to go through something extra and adds more to the game. Some people would like to add more to their defense build, and some may want to add to their stealth build. Buffs just allow you to take it a few % points higher than the next guy in order for more player diversity.

[Tribbler]

Problem, what would those resources be used for? so far there hasn't been any mention of a crafting process, which would be perfect for mining.

IF we could get a glimpse at how we acquire components and new ships, and if we can trade between each other. That would go a lot farther with the mining aspect.

Until then the Mining idea may just be a dead-end

One of the reasons that I started this Op was because rekhan had said in one of his posts that they were looking into the crafting and auction system,sooooo this would be a good time to bring all this up, so they could get some ideas how we felt.

[tburrfoot]

Let me try to answer that Cy:

In order to get a buff, you usually have to go through something extra and adds more to the game. Some people would like to add more to their defense build, and some may want to add to their stealth build. Buffs just allow you to take it a few % points higher than the next guy in order for more player diversity.

i understand the desire for diversity, but as i said, the buff system is overdone....
why cant one just play the game? in the series you did not see the crew or the ship getting bonuses or buffs...
why cant we just play the game as designed, and work with our skill sets and ship design, and ll the points we put into them?
seems easy enough.

as far as afk/offline earning....im not against it as long as it is limited to one thing at a time...
i.e. - mining a asteroid for a certain ore, that depletes as you mine. once depleted, if offline, that is where your actions stop. if afk, your actions would cease, but during and after your crew and ship are subject to attack. so if your afk and a foriegn species decides to attack you cause that was there mine/asteroid, then oh well.

i think it should be allowed, but limited.

[Tribbler]

i understand the desire for diversity, but as i said, the buff system is overdone....
why cant one just play the game? in the series you did not see the crew or the ship getting bonuses or buffs...
why cant we just play the game as designed, and work with our skill sets and ship design, and ll the points we put into them?
seems easy enough.
as far as afk/offline earning....im not against it as long as it is limited to one thing at a time...
i.e. - mining a asteroid for a certain ore, that depletes as you mine. once depleted, if offline, that is where your actions stop. if afk, your actions would cease, but during and after your crew and ship are subject to attack. so if your afk and a foriegn species decides to attack you cause that was there mine/asteroid, then oh well.

i think it should be allowed, but limited.

On the first part,

There is inherent abilities that are not seen in each of us. Each race has it's own "basic" quality that gives us something that makes us different. So it goes with the different aliens.

Well "what if" I spent 8 years in college to be a doctor, not from just one source, but several sources (3 different colleges from around the world), where another doctor would be just one source and only spent 6 years. I would be more qualified to deal with various illnesses & disease compared to the local type that one doctor may be familiar with.

Then there are electronic methods such as having a "google" device to look up things, where another alien may not have that "device" only earned by me visiting Earth. That "device" gives me a buff in the medical profession.

Then there could be a drug enhancement that gives me superhuman strength, only found in the caves of Bajor. That strength would be a buff.

Buffs, inherent or from enhancement, come in different forms and they do distinguish us apart.

On the second part

Yes, resources you mine get exhausted, quickly if you use alot of machinery, or slowly if you use only one machine.

[Archangelwoghd]

I don't know if mining planets we discover is exactly legit..."



Spock: "The object is a previously unknown class M planet"

Sulu (awed): "...a new discovery."

Checkov: "Orders Keptin?"

Kirk: "Spock scan it for valuable mineral deposits. Scotty, prepare the mining equipment. We're gonna strip this planet dry boys!"


(Bridge Crew Laughs Wickedly)

[tburrfoot]

i understand as i said. and even by your reasoning, your skill set would be what makes you different then the other doctor.
why should "buffs" even be considered then?
maybe you and i are not understanding the use or term buff each is using,

so let me try to claer my idea up:

NO BUFFS! i see no need for them. ALL actions should be determined on skill sets, ship configuration, and how the player puts them to use. any advantage you have or i have can and only should come from how we have chosen to place our skill sets. if i chose more of tactical (photon), then that is my advantage, if you chose tactical (phasers), then that is yours....no need to get a buff to tip the scales or even them just becuase one is difficient in that catagory.

[Tribbler]

I don't know if mining planets we discover is exactly legit..."



Spock: "The object is a previously unknown class M planet"

Sulu (awed): "...a new discovery."

Checkov: "Orders Keptin?"

Kirk: "Spock scan it for valuable mineral deposits. Scotty, prepare the mining equipment. We're gonna strip this planet dry boys!"


(Bridge Crew Laughs Wickedly)

Chapter 8 The Delphi Expanse

The crew of the Enterprise valiantly speed off to find the Xindi who have just wiped Florida off the face of the Earth. They enter the expanse and find that the Enterprise cannot withstand the anomolies that are running rampant in this type of space. They discover sources of Trillium D that negates the cause of the anomoly and they are on their way again.

As they venture further in the void, they come across a USS Woghd once piloted by Captain Archangel. It was twisted and deformed. It was dead in space.

(T'pol)
I did not know there were other ships on this mission

(Archer)
"sighs" They were scouting for us and we lost transmission before we left Earth.

(T'pol)
Why didn't they get any Trellium D like we did?

(Archer)
"sighs again" He didn't believe in mining equipment.

(T'pol)
"sigh"

(Hoshi)
"sigh"

(Tucker)
"sigh"

(Malcolm)
"whispers to Tucker" I bet he was playing that non-mining Cryptic game. :D

Chapter 9

Enterprise wins!

[Tribbler]

i understand as i said. and even by your reasoning, your skill set would be what makes you different then the other doctor.
why should "buffs" even be considered then?
maybe you and i are not understanding the use or term buff each is using,

so let me try to claer my idea up:

NO BUFFS! i see no need for them. ALL actions should be determined on skill sets, ship configuration, and how the player puts them to use. any advantage you have or i have can and only should come from how we have chosen to place our skill sets. if i chose more of tactical (photon), then that is my advantage, if you chose tactical (phasers), then that is yours....no need to get a buff to tip the scales or even them just becuase one is difficient in that catagory.

Well a buff is an enhancement of sorts, whether it is skilled base or not. I am just saying it is a gift or an increase in your base stats deriving from some source. Call it what you may, but there needs to be something to create diversity, and the more diverse, the more players will not be equal and all going on the same adventures at the same time. Spread it out, and the big incentive is to increase your stats.

I understand where your coming from, but i want the game to be dynamic with alternate means of bonuses whether temporary or permanent.

[tburrfoot]

Well a buff is an enhancement of sorts, whether it is skilled base or not. I am just saying it is a gift or an increase in your base stats deriving from some source. Call it what you may, but there needs to be something to create diversity, and the more diverse, the more players will not be equal and all going on the same adventures at the same time. Spread it out, and the big incentive is to increase your stats.

I understand where your coming from, but i want the game to be dynamic with alternate means of bonuses whether temporary or permanent.

if you refer to say locating a mineral that enhances your phasers efficiency by say 2% (example only), then by all means i agree, since you used the skill sets earned and placed them in a tree to be able to locate said mineral.
what i dont want to see is another ship coming by, zapping you with a +20% mining bonus for 30 mins.

so i think we are on the same path, maybe just looking at it diferently.

[Tribbler]

if you refer to say locating a mineral that enhances your phasers efficiency by say 2% (example only), then by all means i agree, since you used the skill sets earned and placed them in a tree to be able to locate said mineral.
what i dont want to see is another ship coming by, zapping you with a +20% mining bonus for 30 mins.

so i think we are on the same path, maybe just looking at it diferently.

Yes you are looking at PVP. Balance is going to be somewhat of an issue, and what if the minerals in the Klingon sector are less abundant, but they have more abundant defensive minerals that increase their shield strength by 2% which would help the balance.

In deep space, you may find a better mineral that will help you defeat a sector boss. Some giant planetkiller possibly?

In the end, PVP along the same grades should be equalized, just as long as my little device that i spent hours or days to get, gives me an advantage. The player i am against should have had the same oppurtunity, but decided he would rather watch the girlz of Riza.

[cipher_nemo]

I don't know if mining planets we discover is exactly legit..."

And you think the Klingons care about that? :)