medicine

[andrewprofit]

I think it would be nice if it would be possible to have players make medicines better or find better medicines etc. So instead of allways having +20health medpack or some simple modification of that. Medical treatments could be specialized to wound types melee, phasor, disruptor, etc.

[Mozcol]

I think it would be nice if it would be possible to have players make medicines better or find better medicines etc. So instead of allways having +20health medpack or some simple modification of that. Medical treatments could be specialized to wound types melee, phasor, disruptor, etc.

Crafting.....I love crafting, even if its for personal use and not something to get rich on at the AH. /vote A HUGE YES

[andrewprofit]

Crafting.....I love crafting, even if its for personal use and not something to get rich on at the AH. /vote A HUGE YES

I agree crafting for personnal use is a great idea and I believe a great minigame. When wow introduced items that only the master crafter could use that were comparable to drops I think they finally hit on the proper balance of wasting time leveling crafting skills for something that the player could actually benefit from.

Crafting for other players is a mini game that is normally is so complex an involved it should be left for future expansions instead of trying to have it ready for game launch.

[Alfie-Fandango]

I think it would be nice if it would be possible to have players make medicines better or find better medicines etc. So instead of allways having +20health medpack or some simple modification of that. Medical treatments could be specialized to wound types melee, phasor, disruptor, etc.

That's awesome.

Now head on down to Cryptic and get it done.

[loyaltrekie]

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[ExpendableCrewman]

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Alright well now that thats out of the way I agree with "minigames" if thats what you want to call them,
such as the auction house, or a crafting skill, I beleive that a medicine craft would actually be kinda cool and pretty canon to the whole doctor in star trek thing. I would actually like to see this implemented, even if it might be a little hard on the devs part, maybe we could see this as a later expansion?

This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines (http://forums.champions-online.com/announcement.php?f=5&a=6) ~Stormshade

[loyaltrekie]

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[ExpendableCrewman]

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[andrewprofit]

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Well there are many levels of crafting from simple powerups to complex blueprints reverse engineering, labs, crafting machines, resource extractors, de, components, etc. I have seen a number of different implementations of crafting systems. To create a system as complex as SWG I think the devs should wait for a future expansion. For simpler crafting such as giving the ability of a medical officer to enhance the effectiveness of medical packs its more like crafting a powerup for a weapon. In this caase a powerup for a medicine.

SWG crafting system took up so much of the content of the game that without the crafting system it would have been very similar to Tabula Rasa.

I think every class, ability or, skill should have minor powerups that the player can use to justify the time spent gaining those skills and abilities.

[loyaltrekie]

To create a system as complex as SWG I think the devs should wait for a future expansion.

My question is why do you think this? If its a complicated system it should be given the most development time, no, and that would be pre-release. Aside from that one of the biggest draws of MMO's is player-type economies; a key factor of that being crafted materials from players. I don't see how you could have a player based economy without any crafting of the sort.

[Alfie-Fandango]

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[loyaltrekie]

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[Alfie-Fandango]

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[Alfie-Fandango]

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[loyaltrekie]

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[Zepath]

Hey, come on guys ... people have their opinion. If you don't agree, offer a counter post ... but stop attacking each other. Its non-productive, and annoying for the rest of us trying to read through the thread.

[andrewprofit]

Cage match. Begin battle thralls.

[loyaltrekie]

Cage match. Begin battle thralls.

Regardless before the derail can you respond to the last post on the previous page; as to why you think crafting is something that should be left for expansion content and not core content?

[scholarman]

I was just about to say its kinda ironic you just got done saying crafting is nothing more then a "mini game" and shouldn't be included at launch; then you make this topic.

Edit: and your still trying to push that point, lol. Calling crafting a mini game is wrong on so many levels; and saying it shouldn't be included in launch seems like a step in the wrong direction development wise.

The key to good crafting, IMO, is relevant crafting. WoW's crafting is downright addictive, because once you've finished the steps to make something you have lots of potential uses for it -- gear, costuming, selling, materials creation for more advanced crafting, in some cases even mounts or other high end perks.

I would dearly love to see the synthesis of medicines -- with perhaps gathering/material securing as an episode/mission you need to accomplish in advance of creating it -- as a relevant and useful crafting objective. By the same token, I'd love to be able to take various materials and craft them into engineering components to improve my ship in some way (hey, there must be some way to get our inner Scotty on), or for a science specialist to undertake extended research that ultimately leads to some discovery.

I think this is one of those opportunities to make Crafting an integral part of the game, rather than a bolted on aftereffect. If that can be accomplished, then Crafting's going to deeply enrich STO.

(Sadly, this will mean making it better than Champs Online's crafting. Maybe in three or four free content updates CO's crafting will approach some kind of maturity, but we're not there yet.)

[scholarman]

Oh, as for the question of 'crafting at launch' vs. 'crafting at expansion?' Crafting at launch -- definitely. Crafting -- regardless of its name -- is an integral part of developing habits and actions outside of the run/kill/loot mentality. In a game like STO, where there really needs something more than combat emphasis to be true to the source material, crafting can give us the potential for any number of activities that we might not otherwise perform.

Diversity is a vital component of MMOs -- the more there is to do, the more ways there are to have fun in the game, the broader a customer base you end up getting.

[Zepath]

Oh, as for the question of 'crafting at launch' vs. 'crafting at expansion?' Crafting at launch -- definitely. Crafting -- regardless of its name -- is an integral part of developing habits and actions outside of the run/kill/loot mentality. In a game like STO, where there really needs something more than combat emphasis to be true to the source material, crafting can give us the potential for any number of activities that we might not otherwise perform.

Diversity is a vital component of MMOs -- the more there is to do, the more ways there are to have fun in the game, the broader a customer base you end up getting.

Crafting at launch is important because a good crafting system has tailor its beginning items to lower end items, while the lower level player can use them.

No one is going to interested in a crafting system where they have to go back to level 1 content when they are a Captain ... not to mention it makes 90% of the crafting system useless at that point.

[Harmony-Jade]

Wow reading this thread is like looking at a UK MP's expense report - everything is edited out :p

Back on topic, I would love to see some form of crafting system. There are times when playing MMO's I cba to quest/pvp/raid. So it would be nice to be able to focus my time on other in-game activities, even if it would just be for personal use.

During my 3 years of playing WoW I must have clocked up hours upon hours just crafting and visiting the AH.

[shadowsafer]

I think it would be nice if it would be possible to have players make medicines better or find better medicines etc. So instead of allways having +20health medpack or some simple modification of that. Medical treatments could be specialized to wound types melee, phasor, disruptor, etc.

Hmm.. are we ready to re-introduce drug dealers in STO as well then? ;)

I bet I can mix up some mind bending stimulants with my science skills.:D

[andrewprofit]

Regardless before the derail can you respond to the last post on the previous page; as to why you think crafting is something that should be left for expansion content and not core content?

It depends on how robust complicated and how much of a real life sim they want to make the crafting system. SWG went overboard with its crafting system. Half the crafting content didnt work at game release. If SWG had waited to implement its crafting system till after release it probable would have been more successful. If anything SWG should have implemented space travel at release instead of a broken crafting system. SWG's grand crafting scheme required various resource extractors, manufacturing centers, buildings to sell product from. The crafting system effectively dominated the landscape of SWG.

Wow on the other hand a succesful mmorpg by most peoples standards requires the players spend about the same amount of time as SWG to obtain mastery of a crafting profession but almost everything in wow's crafting system is weaker than easily accessible dropped items with the exception of a few items only the crafter can use and which the crafter cannot sell. By centrializing item sales in the ah and simplifing resource extraction to a manual process a mining pick or loots wow minimized the foot print of the crafting system on the landscape of WOW.

I think that last part which is the most recent example of current crafting models in mmorpgs is the way of the future. Players can craft items that are exceptional but only they can use them. In this way players are rewarded for leveling up crafting skills and developing their characters without effecting and complicating the games economy.

I think every class, ability or, skill should have minor powerups that the player can use to justify the time spent gaining those skills and abilities

[ExpendableCrewman]

Crafting is sometimes an entire element unto itself, I for one wholly endorse crafting as I beleive it adds a whole new side to any game. <It is also something else to do when you get sick of or need a break from current gameplay.>

[andrewprofit]

Crafting at launch is important because a good crafting system has tailor its beginning items to lower end items, while the lower level player can use them.

No one is going to interested in a crafting system where they have to go back to level 1 content when they are a Captain ... not to mention it makes 90% of the crafting system useless at that point.

Exactly my point 90% of the crafting system is useless at a certain point so why waste valuable development time on it. If they can make a good game without crafting then they can add crafting later and it would be an enhancement.

I think there are several groups of people with different goals for the crafting system. Group A are the people who would like crafting to be the game for them that is what they do that is all the game is to them being the best crafters. Group B wishes they could be group A but the reality is 300,000 people cannot be succesful crafting the same 20 items. Group C doesnt want to be involved in crafting at all. Iam going to generalize and say 10% group a 50% group b and 40% group c.

I would rather crafting be an extension of the player and include all 100% of the players. With this IP I would think this could be done. Take the Weapons smith skill tree from SWG now instead of creating specific items at each level you can improve your weapons within a certain range or in a more complicated system create weapons with components within a certain range.

This system would be similar to enchanting in wow.

Anyway I think wow proved that a major mmorpg could exist without a huge crafting system that could make good items.

[scholarman]

Anyway I think wow proved that a major mmorpg could exist without a huge crafting system that could make good items.

Do you really mean WoW here? Because it seems to be the gold standard for elaborate (and well designed) Crafting systems, building off of the Everquest model and improving on it.

[andrewprofit]

Do you really mean WoW here? Because it seems to be the gold standard for elaborate (and well designed) Crafting systems, building off of the Everquest model and improving on it.

Yes I was comparing wow and swg as opposite extremes. Spend 300 hours leveling a system to make something useless in wow or spend 300 hours leveling to make something useless in swg but at least with all the complexities of swg your useless crafted item had the potential to be better than everyone elses in quality so some few actually made a handful of useful items in swg. Wow counterd imo by making somethings like the trinkets which were actually better than drop or rewards but only usable by the crafter.

[scholarman]

Yes I was comparing wow and swg as opposite extremes.

Okay - coolness. ;)

[Azurian]

Well I thought SWG's crafting was good. A crafting system with lots of options and variations is a nice way to go. Crafting shouldn't be increasing levels until everyone is using the best, that gets tiring and monotonus once you are maxed out.


But with Medicines in STO, it should be unique. After all we will be exploring new worlds, which will introduce new diseases and poisons along the way.

And what's to say that you might come across diseases and poisions that you thought you already encountered, but are different enough to require more experimenting until you get it correct.

That way, by the time you are at the far High End, you won't be bored making the same cures, over and over again. Everything is still fresh and fun.



If done right, STO's Science and Medicine specialties would be far superior to other MMOs.

[andrewprofit]

Crafting shouldn't be increasing levels until everyone is using the best, that gets tiring and monotonus once you are maxed out.


Are you suggesting that crafting should be end of game content?

I think that is a brilliant idea and has some pretty interesting implications. Nobody has done a crafting system based around end of game content that I know of. It actually might make things work much better. In practice a player would be encouraged to enjoy the content of the game, develope their charcter and at somepoint near end of content start develop their characters crafting skills.