Carrier fighters AI only? Benefit or a liability?

[cocoa-jin]

Im curious to see how fighters will be implemented and utilized. How much control will we have over them, would kind of options will come with commanding them, if we can at all?

What about the fighter AI, will it be too predictable? Will they be too limited in thier utilization?

On a side note, I was happy to see that the new Carrier will have ECM even while cloaked. A perfect set up for implementing a carrier as a strategic asset for long range launching and reception of fighters as a stand off combatant on a star system to even multi-system(star cluster) wide level. Will these features be capable of being utilized effectivly like this or will we be forced to use carriers as tactical assets.

I personally would like to see carriers(at least some variants) have the option and ability to be used as strategic assets with combat playing out in a cat and mouse or hunter/killer type dynamic as carriers utilize cloak and ECM to attempt to remain hidden while delivering and receiving fighters in support of combat actions.

This strategic and stand-off method would seemingly require more intelliegent fighter AI and more flexibility and options in the commanding of these units by the carrier.

[Tamgros]

As an RTS player, I'd love to see a good amount of control over them. I don't mean fly them. I mean position them so I don't just chose the target, chose which shield side, and have some options about positioning my fighters to use cover. Oh and also use any 'abilities' if they have them...

In most MMOs the pets follow simple "attack target", "stop attacking" type moves. It would be great if STO expanded the pet functionality. It sounds like they are for the ground combat NPC Bridge Officers. One can hope...

[Marytha]

As an RTS player, I'd love to see a good amount of control over them. I don't mean fly them. I mean position them so I don't just chose the target, chose which shield side, and have some options about positioning my fighters to use cover. Oh and also use any 'abilities' if they have them...

In most MMOs the pets follow simple "attack target", "stop attacking" type moves. It would be great if STO expanded the pet functionality. It sounds like they are for the ground combat NPC Bridge Officers. One can hope...

Can i have a Bridge Officer who is a Squadron Commander? I'd like that.

Marytha

[JoJimGregory]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and wager we can control them like a pack of pets.

[cocoa-jin]

Can i have a Bridge Officer who is a Squadron Commander? I'd like that.

Marytha

Interesting...I'd assume it would be a Tactial officer speciality. Im trying to remember what special skills/experience is desired for real carrier captains...weither they are more ship guys or flight manager guys. Or does the carrier have a ship guy for captain and a specialized officer for flight management.

[Marytha]

Interesting...I'd assume it would be a Tactial officer speciality. Im trying to remember what special skills/experience is desired for real carrier captains...weither they are more ship guys or flight manager guys. Or does the carrier have a ship guy for captain and a specialized officer for flight management.

I would expect you have a captain , and then a an officer in charge of the flight crews. Squadron leader, or something like that.

Marytha

[Interdictor]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and wager we can control them like a pack of pets.

Either that or they will be some kind of depletable "DoT" (Damage over Time) effect.

[Tamgros]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and wager we can control them like a pack of pets.

Yeah, I think that's most probable, I'd just like it to be a litttle more.

[cocoa-jin]

As an RTS player, I'd love to see a good amount of control over them. I don't mean fly them. I mean position them so I don't just chose the target, chose which shield side, and have some options about positioning my fighters to use cover. Oh and also use any 'abilities' if they have them...

In most MMOs the pets follow simple "attack target", "stop attacking" type moves. It would be great if STO expanded the pet functionality. It sounds like they are for the ground combat NPC Bridge Officers. One can hope...

I'd like to see similar functionality...plus a bit more. I'd like to see them used as scouts, as Close Air Support/defensive cloud, area attack(auto engage of hostile units within an area), area defend(auto engage of hostile units that engage friendly units within an area), target defend/escort(Close Air Support/defensive cloud for a specific unit(s)), survey(for non-combat/exploratory scans of objects within a start system or star cluster if they can be warp capable fighters).

I'd like to be able to choose systems for them to concentrate on, or target side, etc also.

[Griffin]

I'm inclined to think they will act like summoned pets from other MMOs. Perhaps we will have the freedome to choose which target they attack and which subsystems they will be targetting, but actual WASD control over them? probably not.

We may not even have that much control over them, perhaps ships will be 'slotted' and will come with a variety of purposes. iworking more like 'Dots' and 'HoTs'.

Fighter 'A' = +25% shield damage
Fighter 'B' = +25% hull damage
Troop Transport = +50% crew damage
Shuttles = 'Heal' 2500 shield strength over 10 secs


etc

[cocoa-jin]

I'm inclined to think they will act like summoned pets from other MMOs. Perhaps we will have the freedome to choose which target they attack and which subsystems they will be targetting, but actual WASD control over them? probably not.

We may not even have that much control over them, perhaps ships will be 'slotted' and will come with a variety of purposes. iworking more like 'Dots' and 'HoTs'.

Fighter 'A' = +25% shield damage
Fighter 'B' = +25% hull damage
Troop Transport = +50% crew damage
Shuttles = 'Heal' 2500 shield strength over 10 secs


etc

Im not suggesting direct control, just a bit more than attack, stop attack, dock and undock...then expecting them to respond in varied tactical and strategic ways once released.

[ngille]

I would imagine it would be close to the eve drone system but with a few extra options for different missions (subsystem targeting, scout missions, etc)

[Nalah]

Basic commands like were available in the Starfleet Command series for fleet ships/shuttles/fighters would be nice, along with some additional commands such as ordering them to target sub-sytems, fire to disable, etc.

[lvjayman]

Well its sounds like the ship itself can perform as a frontline attacker, so they may need to keep the options for the fighters very streamlined so you can also manage your carrier, otherwise you might get distracted ordering your squadrons around and lose your carrier :eek:

[lvjayman]

Well its sounds like the ship itself can perform as a frontline attacker, so they may need to keep the options for the fighters very streamlined so you can also manage your carrier, otherwise you might get distracted ordering your squadrons around and lose your carrier :eek:

[mcintyre72]

Im curious to see how fighters will be implemented and utilized. How much control will we have over them, would kind of options will come with commanding them, if we can at all?

What about the fighter AI, will it be too predictable? Will they be too limited in thier utilization?
.

How I believe they are gonna implement the Fighters are lpet classes similiar to WoW's hunters, AoC's Necros, WAR's White Lions, ETC... (Where you can select pet specific abilities for them to preform and which enemy to target). However taking specific command of the pet might be accesed through an ability similar to WoW's Eyes of the beast spell. I good preview of the pet mechanics will probably come from CO's pet classes (if they have them)

[marscentral]

Well its sounds like the ship itself can perform as a frontline attacker, so they may need to keep the options for the fighters very streamlined so you can also manage your carrier, otherwise you might get distracted ordering your squadrons around and lose your carrier :eek:

I think there is the potential for that. The Vo'Quv is a major combat force in it's own right, so the last thing you'll want to do is hang back so that you can focus on your fighters. Any class that is pet oriented is by nature more complex to control though, if you want it simple, stick with your Bird of Prey. I think the right balance is perhaps setting their stance somewhere between "fight to the death" or "come back if a bit damaged" followed by orders like "defend me", "defend fleet", "defend target", "attack target", "attack hostiles" and "patrol area".

[Phunix]

My first thought was that it could be used as a support ship, until I read the rest of the article...
Still, with the modular design, within a fleet, I can certainly see it being altered to where it would function as a backdrop support ship, with decreased attack capabilities but increased support ability. (more hangar space and such maybe as one removes weaponry and such?)

[Draconianknight]

I would imagine it would be close to the eve drone system but with a few extra options for different missions (subsystem targeting, scout missions, etc)

I agree, this is the first thought that ran through my mind, EVE uses carrier classes but I also would like to see more options in the AI command. Attack targets engines, or weapons, some defend commands would be nice as well. Especially if the carrier finds itself in a fight with out escorts.

[DanSeale]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and wager we can control them like a pack of pets.

That's kinda what I'm thinking. Seems like Cryptic might have suggested that some where along the way (but can note remember exactly where).

I'm guessing here .. BUT commands like: launch, attack, protect ship (or target), return to ship should be amoung the primary commands (or at least something similar).

[Draconianknight]

I have been stomping around the forums tring to get up to speed on the STO thing.
Considering all the suggestions, ideas etc. including the addition of fighters, I sure hope the got one whopper of a server and that it doesnt go poof when they hit the switch :eek:

[Telinous]

In any ship based game fighter/bomber control has always been hit or miss, they either excell greatly at control or they bogged it down or failed to implement needed actions. The problem is with those of us who like our Carrier class ships is that in the back of our minds we always want that freedom of a real carrier, where anything you think of you can command your craft to perform, as such we will be disappointed in craft commands in STO regardless. I am more concerned with the prospect of stocking craft, having to restock them if destoryed (which is far more realistic) weapons configuration of craft and their effective damage to ships of the line. Traditionaly in gaming craft have always been either to weak to few, or to over powering to balance out with the remainder of the game.

[Lepton]

I think we need someone with some substantial Eve Online experience to chime in here and that is not I. However, drones in Eve Online seem nothing like pets. My assumption is that there will be some very simple commands. Attack Close, Snipe, Launch, Dock. More like a disposal weapons systems rather than something to be micromanaged.

[Telinous]

I think we need someone with some substantial Eve Online experience to chime in here and that is not I. However, drones in Eve Online seem nothing like pets. My assumption is that there will be some very simple commands. Attack Close, Snipe, Launch, Dock. More like a disposal weapons systems rather than something to be micromanaged.

I was a drone ship pilot in Eve ;3, The system is amazing and disapointing at the same time, of course each drone had its damage characteristics, infact it had all the characteristics that made it its own ship really, each one was commanded seperately, could be grouped into user defined groups or commanded as a whole, you could send them to guard another ship of your fleet, yourself, attack a target or just orbit around something (great for staging for combat while negotiating with the offending vessel) However with the addition of subsystems targeting would become more complicated/detailed in STO.

[cocoa-jin]

I would imagine it would be close to the eve drone system but with a few extra options for different missions (subsystem targeting, scout missions, etc)

I really hated EVE's drone system. I really dont want to see an healing fighters, zooming around boosting shields and armor...its a bit cliche and gamey.

One thing about EVE's drone set up was it was too limiting. As a Carrier, I'd like to be able to set some fighters up as defense/interceptors, some as attackers. So if I run into another carrier I can have some fighters available to attack him, but also my defenders set up not to blindly aggro the carrier, nor have to wait for its fighters to open fire on me, but instead set my defensive fighters up as interceptors to proactivly engage enemy fighters on detection at range...before they can get in close enough to open fire on me.

I'd like to be able to send my attackers out with escort fighters to engage enemy interceptors who has his interceptors engaging my attackers at range.

[cocoa-jin]

Well its sounds like the ship itself can perform as a frontline attacker, so they may need to keep the options for the fighters very streamlined so you can also manage your carrier, otherwise you might get distracted ordering your squadrons around and lose your carrier :eek:

I assume there will be more than one carrier hull/type...if so, I'd like to see a variant that is much more stand-off and much less battle-cruiser/battleship.

[Telinous]

I really hated EVE's drone system. I really dont want to see an healing fighters, zooming around boosting shields and armor...its a bit cliche and gamey.

One thing about EVE's drone set up was it was too limiting. As a Carrier, I'd like to be able to set some fighters up as defense/interceptors, some as attackers. So if I run into another carrier I can have some fighters available to attack him, but also my defenders set up not to blindly aggro the carrier, nor have to wait for its fighters to open fire on me, but instead set my defensive fighters up as interceptors to proactivly engage enemy fighters on detection at range...before they can get in close enough to open fire on me.

I'd like to be able to send my attackers out with escort fighters to engage enemy interceptors who has his interceptors engaging my attackers at range.

Yes having to lock down enemy drones and order attacks was tedious at best. Not to mention the guard order engages the first item to fire upon the guard target.

[TruthSeer]

I'm hoping that the carrier/fight system will be something similar to (but much improved over) the Master Mind system in City of Villains. Where you had could give orders to your pets: attack, defend, passive, etc and it also had a pretty decent set up for keeping it organized. I can see STO using squadron groups.