Rewards for PvP

[osena]

We could get Battle field promotions Speacl Parts for our Ships and if we build enof Command points we could get Command of specal Ships geared for PVP with State of the art teck .

I was thinking about this for some time andi think it would be a good Idea

[SirReginaldo]

I don't know, however, I think PvP should be avoided, especially in the Neutral Zone due to the fact that federation vessels would be at a disadvantage especially because those actions would go against a treaty they formed with the Klingon Empire, basically giving them a reason to attack the Federation... And a fact as well would be that once PvP is instigated, the Klingon could easily have more ships cloaked and waiting...

Actually having cloaked ships waiting is a good strategy from a tactical point of view, however, a lot of players would probably get a bad in game experience due to that...

In all cases a FvF sounds more true. The player versus player interactions should be at a higher level then just shoot, run, blow up, re spawn, and go back to repeat:D.
Something that I actually kinda want in this game is a territory system. Maybe if the fighting becomes all out conflict, the 2 factions could fight to control certain areas of space, and controlling those certain areas of space should control the kind of PvE missions or maybe special kinds of PvE missions. I don't know, but I hope cryptic finds a way to fit a reward bases into PvP/RvR/FvF or whatever it is so that most players will feel a sense to participate or achievement.:D

[Manta2015]

I'm sure Cryptic will find a way to keep it fair. They said they're encouraging it because of simply how fun it is.

I'd say that's a reward in itself but yes, specific gear additions to make your PvPing even better would be the smart way to go =)


-Manta-

[spiderdude1]

I don't know, however, I think PvP should be avoided, especially in the Neutral Zone due to the fact that federation vessels would be at a disadvantage especially because those actions would go against a treaty they formed with the Klingon Empire, basically giving them a reason to attack the Federation... And a fact as well would be that once PvP is instigated, the Klingon could easily have more ships cloaked and waiting...

Actually having cloaked ships waiting is a good strategy from a tactical point of view, however, a lot of players would probably get a bad in game experience due to that...

Dont forget, the federation found a way to detect cloaked ships, and currently, the federation are at a *cold war* with the Klingons in STO

[osena]

I don't know, however, I think PvP should be avoided, especially in the Neutral Zone due to the fact that federation vessels would be at a disadvantage especially because those actions would go against a treaty they formed with the Klingon Empire, basically giving them a reason to attack the Federation... And a fact as well would be that once PvP is instigated, the Klingon could easily have more ships cloaked and waiting...

Actually having cloaked ships waiting is a good strategy from a tactical point of view, however, a lot of players would probably get a bad in game experience due to that...

well that Treaty is dead SirReginaldo we are at war with the klingons the last time i checked lol

[SirReginaldo]

Dont forget, the federation found a way to detect cloaked ships, and currently, the federation are at a *cold war* with the Klingons in STO

Probably the device you need to detect cloaked ships takes up a lot of power, or a lot of space:D That would be a good negative for having one aboard a vessel:D

[osena]

Probably the device you need to detect cloaked ships takes up a lot of power, or a lot of space:D That would be a good negative for having one aboard a vessel:D

it could be the size of a Ipod nano lol its 2409 and things get more steam lined as time gos on

[SirReginaldo]

well that Treaty is dead SirReginaldo we are at war with the klingons the last time i checked lol

As far as I have checked the Klingons have been thinking about it from the last log we have read I hope:D. Nothing has said that they are in open conflict. If there was open conflict/war their would be no neutral zone:D.

[SirReginaldo]

it could be the size of a Ipod nano lol its 2409 and things get more steam lined as time gos on

However, they just created that technology basically and as far as I remembered a station was needed to power the one that the Dominion was using to detect Klingon/Romulan ships in the war:D

[osena]

As far as I have checked the Klingons have been thinking about it from the last log we have read I hope:D. Nothing has said that they are in open conflict. If there was open conflict/war their would be no neutral zone:D.

Just a matter of time SirReginaldo the story is gearing up for a Cold war

[osena]

However, they just created that technology basically and as far as I remembered a station was needed to power the one that the Dominion was using to detect Klingon/Romulan ships in the war:D

well that war was form 2373-2375 its 2409 things tind to get smaller:D and as you stated that was the Dominion not Starfleet:D

[SirReginaldo]

Just a matter of time SirReginaldo the story is gearing up for a Cold war

A Cold War means that there is no fighting going on, and basically the 2 powers in a sense are in a Cold War because one is easily stockpiling resources, the Federation, while the other is trying to keep up, the Klingon Empire. Basically that was all it was in human history, a series of small conflicts not involving the main parties in conflict truly against each other, but more of a war of ideals until the tension grew so great that both sides were feeling the pressure to either launch all nukes in a blazing rain of doom or a peaceful resolution between the Communist Ideal and the Democracy of the United States which is a standard now in our world.
I would say the events so far, in STO are building up to a similar series of events, however, maybe they will swing the other way towards a deadly clash:D

[SirReginaldo]

well that war was form 2373-2375 its 2409 things tind to get smaller:D and as you stated that was the Dominion not Starfleet:D

Yes, we didn't even have the technology until after the war, and why would you need this technology produced when a peace has come across the quadrant that hasn't occurred I guess in forever:D I could see them producing it more towards the years in growing tension, however, as many have stated the Federation focused on rebuilding their fleets, I think really gearing them towards exploration again. If they had designed the normal sensors to detect a cloaked vessels emissions, then cloaks are useless thus, they would need a way for this too impact a federation player in a sense. Maybe a group of ships could have one ship with this advanced technology and rely on this one vessel to find the cloaked ship(s), while the others are more geared towards the tactical side of conflict:D

[osena]

Well its bound to happin just one small disagreement can spark a full scale war....:D

[SirReginaldo]

Yes, and that is what I think this ancient threat will do:D I think this game will have a shadow faction, that is basically trying to destabilize the forces and thus leave them weaker opponents for their plans to conquer maybe a Quadrant that was once theirs and/or want, or to spread their influence from where ever they have come from:D

[osena]

Yes, and that is what I think this ancient threat will do:D I think this game will have a shadow faction, that is basically trying to destabilize the forces and thus leave them weaker opponents for their plans to conquer maybe a Quadrant that was once theirs and/or want, or to spread their influence from where ever they have come from:D

I think it might be the Frist Fedaration or the Q

[SirReginaldo]

I think it might be the Frist Fedaration or the Q

Yes, those are good possibilities and to tell you the truth as far as speculation goes, my ability to guess or comment on which faction it could be kinda dies out...
I am not a very good fan of Star Trek, and kinda sit on the edge of Trekkie due to my lack of knowledge/terms that surround the franchise:D

[osena]

Yes, those are good possibilities and to tell you the truth as far as speculation goes, my ability to guess or comment on which faction it could be kinda dies out...
I am not a very good fan of Star Trek, and kinda sit on the edge of Trekkie due to my lack of knowledge/terms that surround the franchise:D

same here but i have been doing some reading i was told about the star trek momorey Alpha so i read it form time too time

[wrussandrews]

I would rather not see material rewards in pvp that can be used in pve.

For me, fun in pvp is enough.

[Arsinoe]

I would rather not see material rewards in pvp that can be used in pve.

For me, fun in pvp is enough.

I tend to fully agree with this. :D

[renderpix]

We could get Battle field promotions Speacl Parts for our Ships and if we build enof Command points we could get Command of specal Ships geared for PVP with State of the art teck .

I was thinking about this for some time andi think it would be a good Idea

I fully agree. It would give an incentive for PvP.

Another post stated that they did not like the idea of it being used for PvE, why not? Gains achieved in PvE could most likely be utilized in PvP. It should work both ways.

As for promotions, some players will be more involved with PvP and vise versa with PvE so promotions gained in either perferred game-play would be beneficial.:D

[Loekii]

I'm sure Cryptic will find a way to keep it fair. They said they're encouraging it because of simply how fun it is.

I'd say that's a reward in itself but yes, specific gear additions to make your PvPing even better would be the smart way to go =)


-Manta-

I tend to agree.

I think 'rewards' should be similar to the 'rewards' in PvE.

My biggest concerns with PvP Rewards system, is that unlike PVE, opponents can easily 'throw' a fight, and thus turn what is supposed to be a difficult fight, into a trivial one. It would be like encountering a Raid Boss, that suddenly just lies down and doesn't attack, letting you kill and then loot it.

The last thing I want to see is Klingon Crusiers letting Fed players destroy them and then their base, so the feds can 'Win the PvP reward', and then the teams switch roles so that the Klingons can 'Win the PvP Reward'. :mad:

I think this aspect of PVP mandates a strict monitor system, or lower balance in PvP Rewards system. Unfortunately, its a case of 'one bad apple spoils the bunch'.

[cjfs]

I thought the reward for PvP was crushing your enemies, seeing them driven before you, and hearing the lamentations of their women.

A shiny, new bat'leth would be nice too.

[cjfs]

I think this aspect of PVP mandates a strict monitor system, or lower balance in PvP Rewards system. Unfortunately, its a case of 'one bad apple spoils the bunch'.

The way to avoid this is to have some partial points for putting up a fight and losing. Also requiring far more pvp kills than just downing one raid boss for similar items (500 player kill equivalent, etc). Some active monitoring or reporting mechanism would be needed to deal with afkers too.

All doable and currently done by other games. It shouldn't be a major issue.

[renderpix]

I tend to agree.

I think 'rewards' should be similar to the 'rewards' in PvE.

My biggest concerns with PvP Rewards system, is that unlike PVE, opponents can easily 'throw' a fight, and thus turn what is supposed to be a difficult fight, into a trivial one. It would be like encountering a Raid Boss, that suddenly just lies down and doesn't attack, letting you kill and then loot it.

The last thing I want to see is Klingon Crusiers letting Fed players destroy them and then their base, so the feds can 'Win the PvP reward', and then the teams switch roles so that the Klingons can 'Win the PvP Reward'. :mad:

I think this aspect of PVP mandates a strict monitor system, or lower balance in PvP Rewards system. Unfortunately, its a case of 'one bad apple spoils the bunch'.

I agree, maybe a peneatly of you are caught besides losing the reward.

There's most likely going to be some kind of player bio or captians review showing wins loses as well as some kind of point system. When caught cheating the system fir PvP rewards have a penelaity score also loosing PvP wins that may apply thows promations and bonus as well as reduction in rank.

[Loekii]

The way to avoid this is to have some partial points for putting up a fight and losing. Also requiring far more pvp kills than just downing one raid boss for similar items (500 player kill equivalent, etc). Some active monitoring or reporting mechanism would be needed to deal with afkers too.

All doable and currently done by other games. It shouldn't be a major issue.

I agree, though I do think it will be an issue even with such things.

That said, it is doable. It just takes more work and a little more thought into the system, imo.

I was disappointed and how slow Blizzard was to react to such things in their BGs, as well as Mythic's lack of forthought with regards to Keep Trading.

I think if they give it some focused thought, Crytpic can come out of the gate with a much better system.

[moessner]

We could get Battle field promotions Speacl Parts for our Ships and if we build enof Command points we could get Command of specal Ships geared for PVP with State of the art teck .

I was thinking about this for some time andi think it would be a good Idea

pvp reward i would say there fine but nothing that gives you and edge on combat becouse you pvp, thats unfair. +dev have said alot of the best stuff in game will be MADE buy players.

[osena]

pvp reward i would say there fine but nothing that gives you and edge on combat becouse you pvp, thats unfair. +dev have said alot of the best stuff in game will be MADE buy players.

It was my frist Idea i well admit i am abit spoiled cos i got all my gear and weapons in wow form PVP
I got my ranks when wow hade ranks for pvp and i hade the full marsall set but i Hope STO has a something like that if not that is cool

[osena]

I fully agree. It would give an incentive for PvP.

Another post stated that they did not like the idea of it being used for PvE, why not? Gains achieved in PvE could most likely be utilized in PvP. It should work both ways.

As for promotions, some players will be more involved with PvP and vise versa with PvE so promotions gained in either perferred game-play would be beneficial.:D

Thank you for seeing it my way and gaining promotions in pvp would be fun i think PVP promotions should happin faster then PVE ones cos your out engageing in Battle

[KL0k]

Thank you for seeing it my way and gaining promotions in pvp would be fun i think PVP promotions should happin faster then PVE ones cos your out engageing in Battle


i can understand that you want some kind of reward for your preferred playstyle, and since you mentioned where your idea is coming from, i am not surprised to see this popping up.
but this would lead to an exploit, since it seems its like this in STO: faster promotions = better ships/equipment.
and thats the reason why i kind of disagree with this whole idea.
that would mean we would endup with a lot of ppl going pvp flying around in the flagships, while the pve-group is flying in sabres and stuff. and that wouldnt be fair to the ppl who dont want to pvp but want to get a bigger ship.
... to quote another franchise:"jealousy and greed lead to the dark side of the force"

[Cormoran]

I'd hope there's PvP rewards.

as with all rewards i'd hope all forms of gameplay can net similar rewards. I dislike when one form of gameplay gets all the uber gear and you're forced to either do that gameplay or get left behind, this is usually more an issue with raids in the mmo's i've played though so it should be fine here with PvP.

[osena]

i can understand that you want some kind of reward for your preferred playstyle, and since you mentioned where your idea is coming from, i am not surprised to see this popping up.
but this would lead to an exploit, since it seems its like this in STO: faster promotions = better ships/equipment.
and thats the reason why i kind of disagree with this whole idea.
that would mean we would endup with a lot of ppl going pvp flying around in the flagships, while the pve-group is flying in sabres and stuff. and that wouldnt be fair to the ppl who dont want to pvp but want to get a bigger ship.
... to quote another franchise:"jealousy and greed lead to the dark side of the force"

well you do understand with pvp grinding rank it took said amount of points till you got promoted
and you did not get promoted each day there was each week on tuesday was were status were updated and we got promoted

it was not like i beat up 5 players and was promoted to knight it took me weeks to get too marshell and i hade to have points to get keap my rank some times if i did not have enof points i did not get promoted it not that easy as you asumed but i understand were you are comeing form but don't punish those that are welling to pvp unlike the PVE people

[osena]

I'd hope there's PvP rewards.

as with all rewards i'd hope all forms of gameplay can net similar rewards. I dislike when one form of gameplay gets all the uber gear and you're forced to either do that gameplay or get left behind, this is usually more an issue with raids in the mmo's i've played though so it should be fine here with PvP.

i pvped to get gear cos spending 5 hours in raid for a epic pair of pants was insane lol

[KL0k]

well you do understand with pvp grinding rank it took said amount of points till you got promoted
and you did not get promoted each day there was each week on tuesday was were status were updated and we got promoted

it was not like i beat up 5 players and was promoted to knight it took me weeks to get too marshell and i hade to have points to get keap my rank some times if i did not have enof points i did not get promoted it not that easy as you asumed but i understand were you are comeing form but don't punish those that are welling to pvp unlike the PVE people

nah, im not about punishing here, i just wanted to bring up the point "balance", to prevent such a picture i painted in my previous post.
but to be honest, we dont even know how pvp will be handled in this game.
maybe there are pvp-quests in the neutral zone (f.e. escort&raid type of missions or something), or its really openspace fights around key-systems who change in alignment depending on the winning side, or however they plan to do these things.
and i think rewards for these kind of things, should be balanced by and towards the method they plan to inplement here.

[cmhDK]

I think that if there's a reward for PvP it should be something that can't be used in PvE
because if it can be used in PvE then the people who don't like PvP will feel forced to do enough PvP to get the reward
well, not everyone will feel that way, but some will
that's verry bad for the game

so either the reward is that your PvP rating goes up
or it's something that is unusable in PvE

[KL0k]

I think that if there's a reward for PvP it should be something that can't be used in PvE
because if it can be used in PvE then the people who don't like PvP will feel forced to do enough PvP to get the reward
well, not everyone will feel that way, but some will
that's verry bad for the game

so either the reward is that your PvP rating goes up
or it's something that is unusable in PvE

or it could be something that both (pvp and pve player) get after a certain amount of time or effort, and is useful for both. like the example of fights around a system, which could be in pve the diplomatic way, but both then lead to the desired reward for the ship, fleet or faction.

[osena]

I think that if there's a reward for PvP it should be something that can't be used in PvE
because if it can be used in PvE then the people who don't like PvP will feel forced to do enough PvP to get the reward
well, not everyone will feel that way, but some will
that's verry bad for the game

so either the reward is that your PvP rating goes up
or it's something that is unusable in PvE

alot of people never got some items in wow that others hade and it was not bad for the game just depends on how much time you want to spend playing some people well play longer and have gear those that only have 2 hours aday are you going to tell me those players can use the gear the earned in PVE in PVP?

[cmhDK]

alot of people never got some items in wow that others hade and it was not bad for the game just depends on how much time you want to spend playing some people well play longer and have gear those that only have 2 hours aday are you going to tell me those players can use the gear the earned in PVE in PVP?

what I said was bad for the game was that some people would be forced to PvP if they wanted things that would help them in PvE...

[cmhDK]

or it could be something that both (pvp and pve player) get after a certain amount of time or effort, and is useful for both. like the example of fights around a system, which could be in pve the diplomatic way, but both then lead to the desired reward for the ship, fleet or faction.

agreed, but I wouldn't call that a PvP reward since you could get it while PvEing

[KL0k]

agreed, but I wouldn't call that a PvP reward since you could get it while PvEing

well, i would call it reward in general, cause some ppl like pvp more then pve and visa versa, so that would ensure that everyone gets a benefit, no matter how they are playing it.

[Starchild]

PvP is its own reward.

Sorry, I just had to say it.

[VengefulTick]

I would rather not see material rewards in pvp that can be used in pve.

For me, fun in pvp is enough.

I agree. Don't help further the divide between the two that is already being fueled by speculation on these boards.

[Arsinoe]

Thank you for seeing it my way and gaining promotions in pvp would be fun i think PVP promotions should happin faster then PVE ones cos your out engageing in Battle


You want PVP to be faster? So if someone like me hates PVP and enjoys PVE we schould lvl more slow? That would not be fair, if PVP players advance faster there is no balance. :mad:

[Loekii]

You want PVP to be faster? So if someone like me hates PVP and enjoys PVE we schould lvl more slow? That would not be fair, if PVP players advance faster there is no balance. :mad:

I agree, and I am a PvPer.

While PvP can offer more Challenge, it can also offer much less of a challenge (be it sandbagging, Zerging, or simply poor PvP Opponents).

PvP 'rewards' should basically be similar to PvE rewards, minus the fact that it can be easily abused (thrown matches, sandbagging, etc). Imo, if you fight a 'skilled' player and win, that should be the reward.

People should only PVP, because they enjoy PvPing, and not because they are 'getting paid' to do it, imo.

[VengefulTick]

I say a phaser is a phaser no matter what you point it at.

With that...a phaser is a phaser no matter who controls the body you found it on.


PvP = PvE for gear.

I believe that the time and effort used in obtaining said gear should be equal.

[moessner]

It was my frist Idea i well admit i am abit spoiled cos i got all my gear and weapons in wow form PVP
I got my ranks when wow hade ranks for pvp and i hade the full marsall set but i Hope STO has a something like that if not that is cool

same here i got alot of pvp equipment in wow doing BG. but the bad thing abought that is the pvp gear you could tromp some one in raid gear. thats where i see it all wrong. just becouse you pvp dose not give you the right to be better in combat. if STO dose anything right, it would be give the same type of gear for pvp and pve. becouse if you like pvp you will get gear in pvp, but someone that pve dose missions and gets gear then goes hey lets try some pvp and goes into pvp and gets his a$$ handed to him becouse you got pvp gear and its better is just WRONG.

[moessner]

well, i would call it reward in general, cause some ppl like pvp more then pve and visa versa, so that would ensure that everyone gets a benefit, no matter how they are playing it.

this would be the best thing...hope cryptic listens, PVP and PVE rewards should be the same. not that one side gets the upperhand.

[Vuk]

same here i got alot of pvp equipment in wow doing BG. but the bad thing abought that is the pvp gear you could tromp some one in raid gear. thats where i see it all wrong. just becouse you pvp dose not give you the right to be better in combat. if STO dose anything right, it would be give the same type of gear for pvp and pve. becouse if you like pvp you will get gear in pvp, but someone that pve dose missions and gets gear then goes hey lets try some pvp and goes into pvp and gets his a$$ handed to him becouse you got pvp gear and its better is just WRONG.

And there's the hitch , because even if the equipment is equal the preception is going to be that there is a difference in looks or abilities , whether it's factual or not and people are going to whine . PvP plays differently from PvE anyone that's played both understands that the spells that may devestate in PvE may have no effect in PvP . The PvE players then tend to feel impotent in the PvP arena , not understanding the mechanics and differences in armor and stragedy

[moessner]

And there's the hitch , because even if the equipment is equal the preception is going to be that there is a difference in looks or abilities , whether it's factual or not and people are going to whine . PvP plays differently from PvE anyone that's played both understands that the spells that may devestate in PvE may have no effect in PvP . The PvE players then tend to feel impotent in the PvP arena , not understanding the mechanics and differences in armor and stragedy

true. thats why they need to not balance the game around PVP. we should be doing the same damage or taking hits from NCP with the same power as we hit them. like some one posted a phaser X is a phaser X, not ohhh look mines a pvp phaser X, so i hit harder. WRONG.
thats why i think wow did the wrong thing of trying to balance a game to pvp, that mess too many things up. balance the game for PVE. PVP gear should be no better than gear we can make or find or by doing missions, then no one gets the edge. alot of pvp players say they allways want a good fight then this would be more of the fair fight and even the playing feild.

[osena]

true. thats why they need to not balance the game around PVP. we should be doing the same damage or taking hits from NCP with the same power as we hit them. like some one posted a phaser X is a phaser X, not ohhh look mines a pvp phaser X, so i hit harder. WRONG.
thats why i think wow did the wrong thing of trying to balance a game to pvp, that mess too many things up. balance the game for PVE. PVP gear should be no better than gear we can make or find or by doing missions, then no one gets the edge. alot of pvp players say they allways want a good fight then this would be more of the fair fight and even the playing feild.

i find something wrong with your statement a "care bears" typ 10 phaser emiter should not have the same DPS and recharge rate a PVPers typ 10 phaser emiter

Star trek is about conflict there are allways battles happing no game is perfect some people well play STO so they can Battle in huge dreadnouts like the Galaxys and Sovereigns and NX-91001's not each person is going to want to PVE all the time

I made this tread to see both sides on this and i belive i have got what i wanted more or less


My logic is those that have a disdain for PVP are mediocre at best and have been camped i can understand your plight

In Closeing too each there own

[Vuk]

true. thats why they need to not balance the game around PVP. we should be doing the same damage or taking hits from NCP with the same power as we hit them. like some one posted a phaser X is a phaser X, not ohhh look mines a pvp phaser X, so i hit harder. WRONG.
thats why i think wow did the wrong thing of trying to balance a game to pvp, that mess too many things up. balance the game for PVE. PVP gear should be no better than gear we can make or find or by doing missions, then no one gets the edge.

My arguement here will be if you don't pay very close attention to PvP , and balance it , the stradegies or so different and counters behave differently that you'll have in effect a system that's so broken in PvP that people won't play . I've seen it happen to a multitude of games at launch . in PvE the opposing avatar has a limited skill set that you face , in PvP that skill set is greatly expanded . Balance is much more difficult in PvP comparatively . In PvE the opposing bot has a pre-arranged scripted attack , unless you're willing to sit down and code a multitude of scripts , PvP is always going to be much more difficult . That incidently is the attraction of PvP . That's also why PvP is almost always out of balance when a game is launched . This is also a good arguement for separate servers . The arguement against is the cost , physical and the time it would take to balance a PvP server and the Bots.

[moessner]

i find something wrong with your statement a "care bears" typ 10 phaser emiter should not have the same DPS and recharge rate a PVPers typ 10 phaser emiter

well you tell me why your ganker phaser X should have a faster fire rate or more DPS.

[moessner]

My arguement here will be if you don't pay very close attention to PvP , and balance it , the stradegies or so different and counters behave differently that you'll have in effect a system that's so broken in PvP that people won't play . I've seen it happen to a multitude of games at launch . in PvE the opposing avatar has a limited skill set that you face , in PvP that skill set is greatly expanded . Balance is much more difficult in PvP comparatively . In PvE the opposing bot has a pre-arranged scripted attack , unless you're willing to sit down and code a multitude of scripts , PvP is always going to be much more difficult . That incidently is the attraction of PvP . That's also why PvP is almost always out of balance when a game is launched . This is also a good arguement for separate servers . The arguement against is the cost , physical and the time it would take to balance a PvP server and the Bots.

very true. but if you think along the lines of if and NCP has a quantom sheild that can take lets say 100 damage. so if you in pvp your sheild still dose the same thing it will take 100 damage before coming down. same goes with weapons if phaser X dose 10-20 damage it should do 10-20 damage in pvp. now if things are not matching up right from pvp to pve then i think that has to do more with the program. then it would come down to cryptic to fix the program. items should be the same and do the same damage or what ever it dose. dont matter if its on a bot(script)NCP or another player you are fighting.
now the thing that might make the item change damage or give more sheilds, would come down to are crew and are skills, but this is still all not been stated buy the devs yet!

[osena]

well you tell me why your ganker phaser X should have a faster fire rate or more DPS.

Ok a typ 10 gank phaser emiiter gained by PVP could be a one time use skim so it only the player that did the pvp could use it so that skim would would take harder too get iteams to make then standerd "Care bear typ 10" SO logic dictates any thing that is harder to make is better in a MMORPG

[moessner]

i find something wrong with your statement a "care bears" typ 10 phaser emiter should not have the same DPS and recharge rate a PVPers typ 10 phaser emiter

Star trek is about conflict there are allways battles happing no game is perfect some people well play STO so they can Battle in huge dreadnouts like the Galaxys and Sovereigns and NX-91001's not each person is going to want to PVE all the time

I made this tread to see both sides on this and i belive i have got what i wanted more or less


My logic is those that have a disdain for PVP are mediocre at best and have been camped i can understand your plight

In Closeing too each there own

wow calling players that dont like pvp are(mediocre), man what a nice person. ive met alot of great players and friends on both sides. me ill be doing both just like i did in other games.

[moessner]

Ok a typ 10 gank phaser emiiter gained by PVP could be a one time use skim so it only the player that did the pvp could use it so that skim would would take harder too get iteams to make then standerd "Care bear typ 10"SO logic dictates any thing that is harder to make is better in a MMORPG

(SO logic dictates any thing that is harder to make is better in a MMORPG). WOW what logic is that? is this just yours, fine then logic must dictate the players that have to spend all the time mining and building there crafting skills up will have the best stuff in the game. becouse in mmo that takes alot of time.

[osena]

wow calling players that dont like pvp are(mediocre), man what a nice person. ive met alot of great players and friends on both sides. me ill be doing both just like i did in other games.

It happins and so have i was (Mediocre) when i frist started PVPing i wanted nothing to do with it at frist
But the PVE got OLD and i could not find groups that was help me get PVE Gear so i started PVPing all the time

[osena]

(SO logic dictates any thing that is harder to make is better in a MMORPG). WOW what logic is that? is this just yours, fine then logic must dictate the players that have to spend all the time mining and building there crafting skills up will have the best stuff in the game. becouse in mmo that takes alot of time.

Well to a small degree i would say you are right but this Game is not set up for solo play Vorcain it well take team work to make things and that is why i choice the Engineering path cos i like crafthing as much as i do PVP

[moessner]

Well to a small degree i would say you are right but this Game is not set up for solo play Vorcain it well take team work to make things and that is why i choice the Engineering path cos i like crafthing as much as i do PVP


same here. ive done crafting in all MMO ive been on. and yes MMO are still solo play. not everyone wants to be grouped up with someone all the time so there is solo play. you must be thinking i dont like pvp ,i do like to pvp but i dont live for it. i hope cryptic dose a good job. my thing is there should be a balance. i dont think just becouse i like to pvp i should be able to rip non pvp players apart. they should have a fighting chance. thats why i say all items should be even. items from pvp should be no better than some one that dose not like to pvp all the time.

[osena]

same here. ive done crafting in all MMO ive been on. and yes MMO are still solo play. not everyone wants to be grouped up with someone all the time so there is solo play. you must be thinking i dont like pvp ,i do like to pvp but i dont live for it. i hope cryptic dose a good job. my thing is there should be a balance. i dont think just becouse i like to pvp i should be able to rip non pvp players apart. they should have a fighting chance. thats why i say all items should be even. items from pvp should be no better than some one that dose not like to pvp all the time.

Well if each person is match it limted a persons abiltys to truely make the Ship his own IN SWG i made a range of parts

reverse engineered parts that made them stronger i would take parts i got in space reverse engineer them in too one uber part i hade a jedi star fighter

i got in quest with a full load of level 6 reverse engineeried parts and she was beast she was one of a kind too me and it made her specal she was built to my specifaction

SO even if i can't get PVP part i can make things uber with what i got on hand its never going to blanced

[moessner]

Well if each person is match it limted a persons abiltys to truely make the Ship his own IN SWG i made a range of parts

reverse engineered parts that made them stronger i would take parts i got in space reverse engineer them in too one uber part i hade a jedi star fighter

i got in quest with a full load of level 6 reverse engineeried parts and she was beast she was one of a kind too me and it made her specal she was built to my specifaction

SO even if i can't get PVP part i can make things uber with what i got on hand its never going to blanced

but you just balanced it. you did the enginering. you built the items you you you you did this. items in pvp are set and are set to the normal of better than all.

so if you can do this this means all can do this, it takes time money crdits ore what ever it is, but you did it. it dose not say hey if you want this uber weapon armor sheild what ever you have to pvp or tuff luck.

from other post i stated your skill are what will change items make them better faster stronger :) not ohh look ive killed X amount of players now i get this uber item.

PVP will be it own reward with what the devs have said we will be fighting over controll of diffrent things what this is and what is it still dont know(shrugs)

[osena]

but you just balanced it. you did the enginering. you built the items you you you you did this. items in pvp are set and are set to the normal of better than all.

so if you can do this this means all can do this, it takes time money crdits ore what ever it is, but you did it. it dose not say hey if you want this uber weapon armor sheild what ever you have to pvp or tuff luck.

from other post i stated your skill are what will change items make them better faster stronger :) not ohh look ive killed X amount of players now i get this uber item.

No you siad a typ ten phaser should do the same amount of damnage no matter how it is gained

i refuse too belive that if i want something to be better i should be abel to outfit my ship any way i see fit PVP gear PVE or what i CAN make

and money crdits this is star trek we have set such things aside

[moessner]

No you siad a typ ten phaser should do the same amount of damnage no matter how it is gained

i refuse too belive that if i want something to be better i should be abel to outfit my ship any way i see fit PVP gear PVE or what i CAN make

on a flat base......phaserX or pvpPhaserX should do same damage. now if you can take that item and make it better that you, the player now making it better with you skills. this makes for a more balance fight. i dont know abought you but when i pvp if i kill some one with 2 or 3 swings and fight is over(not to fun) just abought as bad as doing grinding. a fight that make more use of can i get the drop on you. did you see me coming up from behind. useing tactics with the fight allways seems to make the fight fun, and more of a thrill


and back to the top phaserX and pvpphaserX should be on par with how its gained. if lets say it takes 50 kills to get the PVPphaserX the normal phaserX has to be built with X parts that take time to get. or a difficult mission to get it.

i do see why pvp players want to get the best items and gear. but that dose leave alot out of pvp. i would rather see the pvp fun and thrilling and not 1 shot kills. then maby more players would go hey this is fun and im not going to get dusted right off the bat

[osena]

on a flat base......phaserX or pvpPhaserX should do same damage. now if you can take that item and make it better that you, the player now making it better with you skills. this makes for a more balance fight. i dont know abought you but when i pvp if i kill some one with 2 or 3 swings and fight is over(not to fun) just abought as bad as doing grinding. a fight that make more use of can i get the drop on you. did you see me coming up from behind. useing tactics with the fight allways seems to make the fight fun, and more of a thrill


and back to the top phaserX and pvpphaserX should be on par with how its gained. if lets say it takes 50 kills to get the PVPphaserX the normal phaserX has to be built with X parts that take time to get. or a difficult mission to get it.

50 kills for a typ 10 phaser bank is pretty much on your ships of the line like your Galaxy nebula class we won't be seeing !0 phaser emiteers till were like LT-commmander rank and up that would make sense too me

AND i don't think any thing is going to one shot kill Vorcain lol unless its one of those borg killer tropedos

[moessner]

50 kills for a typ 10 phaser bank is pretty much on your ships of the line like your Galaxy nebula class we won't be seeing !0 phaser emiteers till were like LT-commmander rank and up that would make sense too me

i used as and exsample......we dont know what items are in the game so was just useing names.


and yes i hope there is no 1 shot kill like there are in alot of MMO. u hit this combo player dead withing 3 sec. lol happend in BG many times.

[osena]

i used as and exsample......we dont know what items are in the game so was just useing names.


and yes i hope there is no 1 shot kill like there are in alot of MMO. u hit this combo player dead withing 3 sec. lol happend in BG many times.

a combo is not a one shot kill it would be like 3 hits then boom but in star trek we have something called shileds and i plan on haveing regenative shileding on my ship just in case such a thing happins too me

[moessner]

a combo is not a one shot kill it would be like 3 hits then boom but in star trek we have something called shileds and i plan on haveing regenative shileding on my ship just in case such a thing happins too me

a combo 1 shot kill same thing....its something you cant stop and charcter is dead before you can do something...i realy hope the dev i hurd in a chat state that there will be none of this, and i hope so.

[Loekii]

same here i got alot of pvp equipment in wow doing BG. but the bad thing abought that is the pvp gear you could tromp some one in raid gear. thats where i see it all wrong. just becouse you pvp dose not give you the right to be better in combat. if STO dose anything right, it would be give the same type of gear for pvp and pve. becouse if you like pvp you will get gear in pvp, but someone that pve dose missions and gets gear then goes hey lets try some pvp and goes into pvp and gets his a$$ handed to him becouse you got pvp gear and its better is just WRONG.

I am not sure I agree with this position. I disagree with the notion that a PvEr should be just as 'effective' as a career PvPer, in PVP. In a sense, its like saying a Science Captain should be just as good in Tactial Combat, as a Tactical Captain.

If someone is solely PvPing, they should not get pummeled by someone that has only PVE'd but is outfitted in Raid Gear.

PvP Gear should give a boost to PVP, but be weaker in PVE, just as PVE gear should boots PVE, but be weaker in PVP.

Now, hopefully STO will not be nearly as gear centric as WoW.

[moessner]

I am not sure I agree with this position. I disagree with the notion that a PvEr should be just as 'effective' as a career PvPer, in PVP. In a sense, its like saying a Science Captain should be just as good in Tactial Combat, as a Tactical Captain.

If someone is solely PvPing, they should not get pummeled by someone that has only PVE'd but is outfitted in Raid Gear.

PvP Gear should give a boost to PVP, but be weaker in PVE, just as PVE gear should boots PVE, but be weaker in PVP.

Now, hopefully STO will not be nearly as gear centric as WoW.

i hope its not like wow,i hated having to work with 2 -3 sets of gear. see thats where i differ from pvp. i like to pvp but dont think us pvp should have the upper hand over some one that dose not like to pvp but every once in awile. what states ohhh i pvp so im better than you and should have better gear to kill players in. like some one posted before a phaser is a phaser. we dont need the WoW BS in this game with ohhh wait i need to fly to star base and refit....becouse switching weapons in space, hmmmmm dont think that will happen and very non star trek.

[Loekii]

Again, its like a Science Specced Captain expecting to be just as good at Engineering as an Engineering specced Captain. If you are not specced PVP, then you should not perform as well as someone that is specced PvP, just as if you are not Engineering Spec, you are not as good at Engineering as someone that is Engineering specced.

Craig has explained that you can never engage PVP in the game, so I disagree greatly with the notion that a 'Non-PvPer' should be able to jump into a PVP area and Pwnz PVP players with their PVE End Game Ship.

Gear should not be the deciding factor, but if you hardly ever PvP, you should get destroyed in PVP, because you are playing against:

People that have been perfecting their PvP gameplay
Have been focusing their ship build on PVP specs.


As for the 'phaser is a phaser' comment, that is like saying a 'Bullet is a Bullet'. There are huge differences in bullets, just as there is likely to be large differences in Phasers in STO.

[VengefulTick]

I say a phaser is a phaser no matter what you point it at.

With that...a phaser is a phaser no matter who controls the body you found it on.


PvP = PvE for gear.

I believe that the time and effort used in obtaining said gear should be equal.

Just wanted to quote myself...someone took me out of context. Please see the last sentence. Equal time for the same rewards in PvP and PvE.

Like I said, and I stand by this. If I point my phaser at an Akira that is piloted by an NPC, and then I turn and point my phaser on an Akira that is piloted by a person...that phaser will damage both the same. So...with that...what is the need for specialized PvP or PvE weapons?!

What I didn't like in WoW is that, for my DPS warrior...there was no better gear at 70 than the PvP gear, with crafted weapons. Something like this shouldn't happen.

If I get shot at by a player, or an NPC ...both of their phasers should do damage the same...

However...with Loekii's point. A tactical officer is (and should) have better option in a firefight (no distinction between PvP and PvE).

I just don't understand why, in some people's minds, there has to be a divide in such a way. There is no real need for it. I believe that WoW did this as a time sink...as they are notorious for...

If you were like me, and simply competitive, you would go out and try to get a PvP set, and a PvE set. WHY?! I mean...honestly...I think I got more joy out of the PvP itself than the gear. But it took me time to get the honor and the arena points to buy what I had and to craft the axes....then it took me time, through raiding to get together a couple of tanking sets....all time sank into getting two separate pieces of gear because of later-added stats.

There is simply no need.

[moessner]

Again, its like a Science Specced Captain expecting to be just as good at Engineering as an Engineering specced Captain. If you are not specced PVP, then you should not perform as well as someone that is specced PvP, just as if you are not Engineering Spec, you are not as good at Engineering as someone that is Engineering specced.

Craig has explained that you can never engage PVP in the game, so I disagree greatly with the notion that a 'Non-PvPer' should be able to jump into a PVP area and Pwnz PVP players with their PVE End Game Ship.

Gear should not be the deciding factor, but if you hardly ever PvP, you should get destroyed in PVP, because you are playing against:

People that have been perfecting their PvP gameplay
Have been focusing their ship build on PVP specs.


As for the 'phaser is a phaser' comment, that is like saying a 'Bullet is a Bullet'. There are huge differences in bullets, just as there is likely to be large differences in Phasers in STO.

well then your one of those pvp players that think hes better than the pve, and that wrong. just becouse we pvp dose not give us the right to own players. you pvp players want a fair fight then even the playing feild and quit asking for gear specificaly for pvp. us pvp players are not special and cryptic should not catter to us. and we dont neew WOW base crap in this game. just like last poster we dont need 2-3 sets of gear or items in this game. i dont WOW in space.

and you players need to look close when players are useing items to tell what there thinking....a 22 bullet is the same as another 22 bullet so yes phaser is a phaser good god!

[Loekii]

well then your one of those pvp players that think hes better than the pve, and that wrong. just becouse we pvp dose not give us the right to own players. you pvp players want a fair fight then even the playing feild and quit asking for gear specificaly for pvp. us pvp players are not special and cryptic should not catter to us. and we dont neew WOW base crap in this game. just like last poster we dont need 2-3 sets of gear or items in this game. i dont WOW in space.

and you players need to look close when players are useing items to tell what there thinking....a 22 bullet is the same as another 22 bullet so yes phaser is a phaser good god!

If you have spent your time playing tennis on a clay court, and I have spent my time playing on a clay court, I am going to have an advantage when we play on a clay court.

I can see where you are coming from, but your argument doesn't really make sense.

You are trying to say the playing against Computer AI controlled Opponents is the exact same as playing against a Living player opponent, and that just is not the case.

Players play differently than computer Controlled AI, thus why PVPers have the advantage -- because they are used to playing against other players (which is normally present a greater challenge and greater variety, than most AI controlled opponents).

A PVE Raid group in WoW, would get destroyed if all the Boss and Trash Mobs were Player controlled, rather than AI controlled.

[Arsinoe]

i find something wrong with your statement a "care bears" typ 10 phaser emiter should not have the same DPS and recharge rate a PVPers typ 10 phaser emiter

Star trek is about conflict there are allways battles happing no game is perfect some people well play STO so they can Battle in huge dreadnouts like the Galaxys and Sovereigns and NX-91001's not each person is going to want to PVE all the time

I made this tread to see both sides on this and i belive i have got what i wanted more or less


My logic is those that have a disdain for PVP are mediocre at best and have been camped i can understand your plight

In Closeing too each there own

Excuse me? Mediocre, i won't even dignify that with a reply. :(

As for the whole gear issue, let PVP and PVE have equal rewards, someone playing PVE with a tactical spec who wants to feel more safe schould be able to get the same kind of gear as a PVP player, and yes ofc a PVP player will prob. win cause he has better techniques and i accept that, but when it comes down to gear things schould be balanced out.

Endgame PVE gear schould be just as tough as the top PVP players.

[VengefulTick]

If you have spent your time playing tennis on a clay court, and I have spent my time playing on a clay court, I am going to have an advantage when we play on a clay court.

I can see where you are coming from, but your argument doesn't really make sense.

You are trying to say the playing against Computer AI controlled Opponents is the exact same as playing against a Living player opponent, and that just is not the case.

Players play differently than computer Controlled AI, thus why PVPers have the advantage -- because they are used to playing against other players (which is normally present a greater challenge and greater variety, than most AI controlled opponents).

A PVE Raid group in WoW, would get destroyed if all the Boss and Trash Mobs were Player controlled, rather than AI controlled.


I believe the differences should not be in the gear, but rather the person's RL skills and the selection of "talent points" for the lack of a better term. I'll restate what I said before as a quote below.

Like I said, and I stand by this. If I point my phaser at an Akira that is piloted by an NPC, and then I turn and point my phaser on an Akira that is piloted by a person...that phaser will damage both the same. So...with that...what is the need for specialized PvP or PvE weapons?!

What I didn't like in WoW is that, for my DPS warrior...there was no better gear at 70 than the PvP gear, with crafted weapons. Something like this shouldn't happen.

If I get shot at by a player, or an NPC ...both of their phasers should do damage the same...

However...with Loekii's point. A tactical officer is (and should) have better option in a firefight (no distinction between PvP and PvE).

I just don't understand why, in some people's minds, there has to be a divide in such a way. There is no real need for it. I believe that WoW did this as a time sink...as they are notorious for...

If you were like me, and simply competitive, you would go out and try to get a PvP set, and a PvE set. WHY?! I mean...honestly...I think I got more joy out of the PvP itself than the gear. But it took me time to get the honor and the arena points to buy what I had and to craft the axes....then it took me time, through raiding to get together a couple of tanking sets....all time sank into getting two separate pieces of gear because of later-added stats.

There is simply no need.

[moessner]

I believe the differences should not be in the gear, but rather the person's RL skills and the selection of "talent points" for the lack of a better term. I'll restate what I said before as a quote below.

this is what ive been saying over and over. and alot of the pvp players dont see it.im looking to pvp in STO just like i did in WOW,AA,EVE,EQ,UO. i just see where all the pve players are coming from. alot of pvp players are at the base a PVE player too. so there is no reason a die hard PVP player should get gear thats better than what a PVE player can get. i hear alot of PVP players say they want a good fight, well time to call them on this and give and even playing feild to all. then it comes down to skill,witch all the die hard PVP players say they have. well lets see. and yes your skills should make you better at things but if you say some one with tactics should do more dam, Hmm some one that and enginer could make a weapon do alot more damage than what a tac person can. i see tactics as you can hit better you wont miss, but then again you computer is what dose the targeting. not like we are in planes and doing dog fights. so what tactics dose we will not know till cryptics lets us know(shrugs)

so to Vengefultick if your playing a klingy :) i hope to see you on the oppisit side and look to some good fights with you :)

[VengefulTick]

...so to Vengefultick if your playing a klingy :) i hope to see you on the oppisit side and look to some good fights with you :)

You'll have to look awful hard, I'll be cloaked for the first shot. :p

[moessner]

You'll have to look awful hard, I'll be cloaked for the first shot. :p

LOL....ok let go a burst of tachyon particles, scan for cloaked ships :)

[Loekii]

I believe the differences should not be in the gear, but rather the person's RL skills and the selection of "talent points" for the lack of a better term. I'll restate what I said before as a quote below.


Sure it would be great if the game is 'all skill', but its unrealistic. There is a skill ceiling in games, especially MMORPGs, so gear will still have impact -- just hopefully not as much as WoW.

It is not the the gear is 'better' than PVE, it is just better IN PVP than PvE Raid Gear is in PVP.

A PvP player is not going to have the same opportunity to gain gear as a PvE raider, so a PvE Raider, who has never PvPed, should not be able to flag PVP and come in 'at an advantage' to the player that has been PVPing the entire game.

So where the PVE might have target sensors with a + against NPC Klingons, a PVP would have targeting sensors that are + against Player Klingons.

Basically, what needs to be avoided is that Players can 'gear up' against the lower challenge PVE area, and then come in with that gear at an advantage against PVP players.

[moessner]

Sure it would be great if the game is 'all skill', but its unrealistic. There is a skill ceiling in games, especially MMORPGs, so gear will still have impact -- just hopefully not as much as WoW.

It is not the the gear is 'better' than PVE, it is just better IN PVP than PvE Raid Gear is in PVP.

A PvP player is not going to have the same opportunity to gain gear as a PvE raider, so a PvE Raider, who has never PvPed, should not be able to flag PVP and come in 'at an advantage' to the player that has been PVPing the entire game.

So where the PVE might have target sensors with a + against NPC Klingons, a PVP would have targeting sensors that are + against Player Klingons.

Basically, what needs to be avoided is that Players can 'gear up' against the lower challenge PVE area, and then come in with that gear at an advantage against PVP players.


its not saying pve gear should be better, but if lets say a pvp gear piece takes you lets say X hours to get, well the same type of pve gear should take X time to build or X missions to compleat to get. it all comes to balance. this is what me and tick have been saying. we think no one side should have a big edge over the other. and the oh this is pvp gear and is used in pvp but not in pve, sorry but this is a junk and cheap way around it. dont want to see WOW in space. and in WOW ther are alot of diffrent items that are pvp and are used in PVE raids. just look at some of the dps they dont have a full set of pve dps gear. there is a combo of both.
but enogh of wow.....tired of that game this is STO.

[Loekii]

its not saying pve gear should be better, but if lets say a pvp gear piece takes you lets say X hours to get, well the same type of pve gear should take X time to build or X missions to compleat to get. it all comes to balance. this is what me and tick have been saying. we think no one side should have a big edge over the other. and the oh this is pvp gear and is used in pvp but not in pve, sorry but this is a junk and cheap way around it. dont want to see WOW in space. and in WOW ther are alot of diffrent items that are pvp and are used in PVE raids. just look at some of the dps they dont have a full set of pve dps gear. there is a combo of both.
but enogh of wow.....tired of that game this is STO.

When you are PVEing you are fighting against NPC targets, so your gear gives you bonuses in PVE.

When you are PVPing, you are fighting PC targets, so gear should give you bonuses in PVP.

Again, just because you have spent 2 months camping some Boss Raid mob, does not mean you should be able to come crashing into the PVP zones and own a PvPer simply because you spent a bunch of time camping "PVE" Opponents.

Basically, a PVE geared player should /= a same level PVP Player in PVP Gear IN PVP, just as the PVPer would not be as effective in PVE with his PVP gear.

In otherwords, you should not be able to 'twink' yourself in PVE gear, to gain an advantage in PVP. A begining Tier 4 PVE Equipped ship should not be equal to a begining Tier 4 PVP equipped ship when it comes to PVP. They are geared for DIFFERENT combat/Opponents.

If a PVEr wants to get into PVP, then they should have to earn their ranks, just like the previous PVPers did. We should not see board PVE Raiders, dominating PVP because they have 'Elite' gear from raiding.

[moessner]

When you are PVEing you are fighting against NPC targets, so your gear gives you bonuses in PVE.

When you are PVPing, you are fighting PC targets, so gear should give you bonuses in PVP.

Again, just because you have spent 2 months camping some Boss Raid mob, does not mean you should be able to come crashing into the PVP zones and own a PvPer simply because you spent a bunch of time camping "PVE" Opponents.

Basically, a PVE geared player should /= a same level PVP Player in PVP Gear IN PVP, just as the PVPer would not be as effective in PVE with his PVP gear.

In otherwords, you should not be able to 'twink' yourself in PVE gear, to gain an advantage in PVP. A begining Tier 4 PVE Equipped ship should not be equal to a begining Tier 4 PVP equipped ship. They are geared for DIFFERENT combat/Opponents.


it comes down to we dont need this BS gear crap...its not wow in space. pvp should be skill and skills your charecters have. yes gear should move up and down a little bit, but not this BS....oh wait i have to fly to starbase and re equip my ship for pvp.
we dont need to see a gear base game with oh look i have pvp gear so i will mop the floor with you, it should be skill on skill and tactics, witch im so glade the devs stated in last IRC chat. tactics will make and brake a fight. and im glade it has a higher learning curve in ship combat.

i think there will be some great pvp fights going on when we all learn the game....cant wait for this, brings back fond mem of E and B :0