Lets talk about Kobayashi Maru Vol. 10

[Grox]

I haven't participated in any of the Kobayashi scenarios since I've been a member of the community. I thought tonight I would take a peek and see what they are about. Randomly I picked number ten

You and your crew have been infected by an alien virus of which there may be only one cure. On a planet deep within Romulan territory there is a rare plant that, according to legend, has fruit which cure any disease when eaten.

And that's where I stopped. I don't want to insult someone's creativity, but is this the kind of stuff I can expect to find in game during missions? It just sounds so LOTR via scholastic children's book. I mean that in the politest way possible.

I want to know what everybody else thinks. Please share your thoughts.

[MagnusTyrel]

missions wont be that bland, there will be many diferent aspects of missions not jsut go to planet A pick up fruit B cuer crewmen C...

Missions will be similar to episodes in the shows or so Cryptic claim...

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I haven't participated in any of the Kobayashi scenarios since I've been a member of the community. I thought tonight I would take a peek and see what they are about. Randomly I picked number ten



And that's where I stopped. I don't want to insult someone's creativity, but is this the kind of stuff I can expect to find in game during missions? It just sounds so LOTR via scholastic children's book. I mean that in the politest way possible.

I want to know what everybody else thinks. Please share your thoughts.

I admit, the mission you quoted does sound particularly ridiculous :o

[dyvimtorm]

Is a bit silly, but then, look at first season TNG :P

[dbass]

I'm sorry you didn't like the scenario, but we're pulling these out of the very scenarios that you all submit. Don't like it? Submit a better one (http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=15122)!

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I'm sorry you didn't like the scenario, but we're pulling these out of the very scenarios that you all submit. Don't like it? Submit a better one (http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=15122)!

I understand what your saying, but selecting a "silly" scenerior also reflects on the person who selected it. So I'm hoping this doesnt mean the people in charge will be creating "magic fruit" quests in the actual game :p

[KL0k]

well. i would like to defend the idea - its still creative - and, i dont think that "aaaall" of the missions we will go through will be "fantasy-like" like that particular one. so jeez.. even TNG had some episodes where i thought "what the hell was the author smoking that day".

PS: just stay calm, and follow the developement. ^^

[Urantia]

I can concur with the OP...and those whom feel the KMs are a tad lame. My biggest complaint (as I stated to Awen in KM 3 if I recall) is that not one of the senarios has been a true no-win-senario. Virtually everyone of them has had a solution. Then they got lazy and started picking from player created senarios...that was where I just stopped looking at them.

Now speaking for myself as honestly as possible...I do not come here to have fun (that is what the game itself will be for), to participate in contests, play trivial, and/or be directed to twitter or other such mediums. This forum is my sole source of data....and while I am excited about STO, I find no reason to express that in my language. We all will be confronted with in-game KMs...situation where we make mistakes etc and die.

Further, I realize that we as the community can submit "better" ideas for KMs, but I am old fashioned...I like the Cryptic staff to create them...as again I am not here to be entertained by non-staff. Now I would be lying if I said I have not been entertained by certain community members...but that was purely a side effect. I am also not one to create a thread to complain either...but I competely agree with the OP here. I realize we are not paying into the system yet....and as such deserve nothing. Honestly I would prefer a more spartan site anyways...but that is me.

I realize that Cryptic et al is in there own sort of KM with the community...in that no matter what you do you cannot please everyone. If people like myself are happy...then another group will cry that the community is boring...and that there is noting to do except discuss topics. And then if you make the other side happy (web 2.0 folks) with cheesy contests and trivia...directing members all over the internet and back people like myself get sickened with all the distractions etc.

Certainly to some more options is better...but to me and my kind less is more.

[Loekii]

I understand what your saying, but selecting a "silly" scenerior also reflects on the person who selected it. So I'm hoping this doesnt mean the people in charge will be creating "magic fruit" quests in the actual game :p

Many pharmaceuticals are plant based, so I am not seeing this as a 'magic fruit', but rather something more inline with the realities of pharmaceuticals. I mean I don't expect to see the crew eating the fruit, but rather seeing the doctor using it to make an antidote - extracting unique chemical properties from the fruit.

I can certainly see how someone would think it was silly, but I could also see someone thinking that 'magic mold' would be silly as well (penicillin).

As for the basic structure, I think it is a decent example of a plot line -- I think we have seen bits and pieces of it in episodes of Star trek, if not other shows.

[Grox]

I'm sorry you didn't like the scenario, but we're pulling these out of the very scenarios that you all submit. Don't like it? Submit a better one (http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=15122)!

Oops. I thought cryptic created these. Oh well, I stand by my original opinion.

I understand what your saying, but selecting a "silly" scenario also reflects on the person who selected it.

Agreed. I'm sure if I wanted to go through those scenarios, I could find some more realistic ones worthy of being selected.

I can certainly see how someone would think it was silly, but I could also see someone thinking that 'magic mold' would be silly as well (penicillin)

I understand the parallels you are trying to make, but penicillin is not capable of curing everything on the planet. Let alone the galaxy. Also, penicillin as an antibiotic is becoming useless against some of the bacteria we ingest it for. Penicillin is not a 'magical mold'.

Also, I could understand the only known cure for the alien disease being from a fruit. But a fruit that cures all is a little silly.

[xlcr]

I haven't participated in any of the Kobayashi scenarios since I've been a member of the community. I thought tonight I would take a peek and see what they are about. Randomly I picked number ten



And that's where I stopped. I don't want to insult someone's creativity, but is this the kind of stuff I can expect to find in game during missions? It just sounds so LOTR via scholastic children's book. I mean that in the politest way possible.

I want to know what everybody else thinks. Please share your thoughts.

I may be remembering this one incorrectly, but I THINK the most important part was the part you omitted from this quote. This isn't a mission instruction (which is how it looks in your quote). It's a scenario about a moral decision. If you read on, you'd see that basically this person was creating a scenario in which either decision you (as captain) makes will have potentially negative consequences.

Leaving off the second part completely changes the point of the scenario. The person was saying you have to decide whether or not to save your crew by risking peace with the Romulans and risking the very lives of the people that live on the planet on which this fruit grows..

[Grox]

I may be remembering this one incorrectly, but I THINK the most important part was the part you omitted from this quote. This isn't a mission instruction (which is how it looks in your quote). It's a scenario about a moral decision. If you read on, you'd see that basically this person was creating a scenario in which either decision you (as captain) makes will have potentially negative consequences.

Leaving off the second part completely changes the point of the scenario. The person was saying you have to decide whether or not to save your crew by risking peace with the Romulans and risking the very lives of the people that live on the planet on which this fruit grows..

That's definitely not the case. I clearly understand it was a scenario.

I haven't participated in any of the Kobayashi scenarios since I've been a member of the community. I thought tonight I would take a peek and see what they are about. Randomly I picked number ten

See how I called it a scenario? What I did misunderstand is that cryptic was not responsible for creating it. Which is why at the time I asked the following about the game:

And that's where I stopped. I don't want to insult someone's creativity, but is this the kind of stuff I can expect to find in game during missions? It just sounds so LOTR via scholastic children's book. I mean that in the politest way possible.

[xlcr]

That's definitely not the case. I clearly understand it was a scenario.



See how I called it a scenario? What I did misunderstand is that cryptic was not responsible for creating it. Which is why at the time I asked the following about the game:

I understand, but here's the rest of the scenario:

"This fruit, though is the only food for the long-lived indigenous sentient beings. Any attempt to replicate the fruit results in a tasty treat, but it lacks the vital nutrients that gives it both the sustenance for the local beings, but also the fruit's legendary disease fighting capabilities.

Thing is, you have to find the planet, and so far even the Romulans don't know where the planet is located. Chances are, the Romulans won't appreciate interlopers, and what if you end up leading them to the planet while you are engaged in your search?"

Searching for the fruit is really inconsequential to the scenario. It's saying that finding the fruit could harm the local population by taking their main source of sustenance and by leading the Romulans (who aren't the most respectful folks) straight to them. It's very similar to Insurrection in principle.

By leaving that last part out, it just looks like he's saying, "Go here and get this item." He's not. He's saying, "Do you risk the life of a local planet for the greater good of your ship and the Federation."

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I understand, but here's the rest of the scenario:

"This fruit, though is the only food for the long-lived indigenous sentient beings. Any attempt to replicate the fruit results in a tasty treat, but it lacks the vital nutrients that gives it both the sustenance for the local beings, but also the fruit's legendary disease fighting capabilities.

Thing is, you have to find the planet, and so far even the Romulans don't know where the planet is located. Chances are, the Romulans won't appreciate interlopers, and what if you end up leading them to the planet while you are engaged in your search?"

Searching for the fruit is really inconsequential to the scenario. It's saying that finding the fruit could harm the local population by taking their main source of sustenance and by leading the Romulans (who aren't the most respectful folks) straight to them. It's very similar to Insurrection in principle.

By leaving that last part out, it just looks like he's saying, "Go here and get this item." He's not. He's saying, "Do you risk the life of a local planet for the greater good of your ship and the Federation."

Obviously it is too late to solve that particular scenerio, but it seems that a pretty obvious peice of info is missing: how MUCH of the fruit a person is required to ingest to "heal" themselves. Because the person who wrote it makes it sound like you would have to take the ENTIRE supply of fruit from the ENTIRE planet just to heal your crew. Of course, if that is what he meant, it just makes it all the more ridiculous :o

[Captain_Intrepid]

Considering how late it was when I posted the senario....

Anyways, you didn't see the full post, and I pretty much rambled in my haste to post it before I had to leave. I'm sorry it didn't involve engaging enough conundrums for you to puzzle over.

In Star Trek, they writters have good sense to not have readily found cures for strange and unusual diseases and ailments. If every medical problem could be beat by sitting around the Sick Bay, then the episode would end in a boring fashion.

Part of Star Trek is exploration, discovering lifeforms and civilizations never encountered before or even lost for unknown millennia.

I gave you that and a race against time, as the Romulans would be most curious as to why your ship would enter their territory. Whether or not they knew why you trespassed, is besides the point (Romulans are reknown for their guile anyways), they won't give you a free pass.

[Captain_Intrepid]

Obviously it is too late to solve that particular scenerio, but it seems that a pretty obvious peice of info is missing: how MUCH of the fruit a person is required to ingest to "heal" themselves. Because the person who wrote it makes it sound like you would have to take the ENTIRE supply of fruit from the ENTIRE planet just to heal your crew. Of course, if that is what he meant, it just makes it all the more ridiculous :o

How much is needed by the crew? Does it take just one fruit to cure what ails the crew? Or does it take dozens, hundreds or thousands of fruit to process enough of the cure? Remember, part of what is known of the fruit was passed by word of mouth or stories for ages, enough for it to be legend. It won't be until your medical officers investigate until you find out the truth behind the legend.

How much is needed by the populace? How many of the local inhabitants are alive? Is this the last remaining post of their kind, did most of them leave the planet only to die without their main source of substanance?

There's more to it, without the need to point out every single detail.

[Captain_Intrepid]

Oops. I thought cryptic created these. Oh well, I stand by my original opinion.



Agreed. I'm sure if I wanted to go through those scenarios, I could find some more realistic ones worthy of being selected.



I understand the parallels you are trying to make, but penicillin is not capable of curing everything on the planet. Let alone the galaxy. Also, penicillin as an antibiotic is becoming useless against some of the bacteria we ingest it for. Penicillin is not a 'magical mold'.

Also, I could understand the only known cure for the alien disease being from a fruit. But a fruit that cures all is a little silly.

but also the fruit's legendary disease fighting capabilities.

Please understand what legendary means.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legendary

[Grox]

So then point blank the scenario is should I invade Romulan space for "legendary fruit" or not? Like I said earlier, it sounds like it's straight from Lord of the Rings.

Seriously though, let me apologize. Had I known cryptic was turning to community members for these I wouldn't have brought it up.

And to Captain Nicholson, you're right. It was kinda silly of me to be like "Lets talk about this" and only post half of the scenario.

[Captain_Intrepid]

Does it really matter to you so much that it was a fruit? Or that there are legends even in Star Trek lore? Paradise planets that turn out to be a place of beauty, and danger. Sha Ka Ree, or what was believed to be the ancient Vulcan's heaven?

Sometimes legends are true too, such as Troy. People believed it was just a story until it was unearthed. But what they found wasn't just one city, but many built over the ruins of the predecessor.

If it was a device that gave those exposed to it's power healing and substanance which was what the civilization depended on and not a fruit? Would you be less upset?

It doesn't matter if the scenario was written by a member of the staff or the community, it was something you could post about in the thread itself, whether it's a solution or a comment on it.

Instead you had to lambast it because it didn't measure up to your sci-fi expectations.

And yeah, the Aloe Vera was a plant that was dismissed by the modern world, until it was shown that the succulent leaves has liquid that helps speed healing, let alone other properties. Before there was Neosporin, there was aloe. People who lived where the aloe was native long knew what it could do.

And if someone was to hear about it, they might either dismiss it outright, or actually investigate.

Would you take the risk to save your crew? Or would you just let your crew die as you dismiss what could be a cure, let alone discover something that may help other worlds?

[Loekii]

I understand the parallels you are trying to make, but penicillin is not capable of curing everything on the planet. Let alone the galaxy. Also, penicillin as an antibiotic is becoming useless against some of the bacteria we ingest it for. Penicillin is not a 'magical mold'.

Also, I could understand the only known cure for the alien disease being from a fruit. But a fruit that cures all is a little silly.

I agree, a 'cure all' fruit is silly.

Perhaps it would have been better to say there was a jungle planet, covered with many medicinal plants.

[Grox]

Does it really matter to you so much that it was a fruit?

Sorta! You said the fruit cures everything. That's where it went all LOTR. Sorry I failed to point that out in my last post. That was really the only issue I had.

I agree, a 'cure all' fruit is silly.

Perhaps it would have been better to say there was a jungle planet, covered with many medicinal plants.

Or another alien race in the Romulan space who experienced a cured the same disease. Then the question would be, Would you risk war to find these species if only to save your crew?

[The.Grand.Nagus]

How many of the local inhabitants are alive?

Are you serious? ALL of the local inhabitants are ALIVE, or else they wouldnt BE local inhabitants :o

[ethanADAMS]

I dont believe it would start a war when they learn of your situation and reasons for crossing the Neutral Zone...We are on good terns for now....

Hey the cartoon thing...to much trouble for me...im not going to do it....hey If the Kobaoshi Maru isn't possible or to far fetched, speaking for myself I won't do it. Hey it's a test, no wrong or right...it's a game...have fun, I am.
eA

[CrazyVulcan]

Captain Butters

Enough on ones that have you in your ship here is one for honing your people skills

Your are assigned to travel to the planet Higden II for the final peace negations and tie up the loose ends. The Higderians have been divided for nearly a decade in a bitter civil war, shortly after the discovering of warp drive a faction of isolationist called the Ingres Movement broke off and launched a campaign to terrorist attacks, the main faction called the royal court of Higden want to enter the federation and are willing to relinquish some power to a federation counsel so long as the royal hair has a permanent seat. And the Ingrest want complete independence and help establishing a colony on Higden III and to be left alone. Upon arrival you and your Sr staff are greeted in a vary lavish ball the main bulk of both sides are there but as you sit down there is a explosion and a message that a third faction that is anti monarchy demand that the king be killed for supposed acts of infamy and in one hour the capital of the Higderians would be wiped out in a nuclear explosion. The Higderians are convinced that the Ingresist are behind it and the Ingres say they have know idea but think this a Hiderian stunt for the Federation

there is mine, its deep, intriguing and leaves a lot up to the whighter, no more say i of your in ship go here sovle simple yes or no quest so what do you think if you like it campain for me to the devs :)

[Urantia]

Captain Butters

Enough on ones that have you in your ship here is one for honing your people skills

Your are assigned to travel to the planet Higden II for the final peace negations and tie up the loose ends. The Higderians have been divided for nearly a decade in a bitter civil war, shortly after the discovering of warp drive a faction of isolationist called the Ingres Movement broke off and launched a campaign to terrorist attacks, the main faction called the royal court of Higden want to enter the federation and are willing to relinquish some power to a federation counsel so long as the royal hair has a permanent seat. And the Ingrest want complete independence and help establishing a colony on Higden III and to be left alone. Upon arrival you and your Sr staff are greeted in a vary lavish ball the main bulk of both sides are there but as you sit down there is a explosion and a message that a third faction that is anti monarchy demand that the king be killed for supposed acts of infamy and in one hour the capital of the Higderians would be wiped out in a nuclear explosion. The Higderians are convinced that the Ingresist are behind it and the Ingres say they have know idea but think this a Hiderian stunt for the Federation

there is mine, its deep, intriguing and leaves a lot up to the whighter, no more say i of your in ship go here sovle simple yes or no quest so what do you think if you like it campain for me to the devs :)

With all due respect I did not think it was deep and/or intriguing in the slightest. In fact, there are too few details...perhaps if you fleshed it out a bit more. Moreover, it is far from a no-win-senario...but do not feel bad my friend I have yet to see a real KM on this site.

[CrazyVulcan]

thank you for the advice, i thought the lack of details made it mor fun, why would you want someone to hold your hand and out line what you must do

[Grox]

Are you serious? ALL of the local inhabitants are ALIVE, or else they wouldnt BE local inhabitants :o

Zombies!!!!

[SenshiBat]

Well , That means the fruit is only proven not to work on them..

Plan "B" I need a Volunteer thank you Nagus.. Rubbing this on a Ferengi
only proves it can
or cannot cure a . Ferengi Nagus ? By epidermal contact.. Now bite it is it posionious to Ferengi or everyone or a cure?
Do not trust a tricorder for everything..

Some crew members will not be cured some many be Happy we came.. It is a simple Utopian last act of desperation..

Think of all the new Charting you could do on the way.. that no one will see because you would have to have a deadmans switch to destroy your craft or the Romulans would gain sencitive materials..

If you go to save everyone ; you prove you can go the extra full measure of devotion in the attempt.

It is a test in the degree you place Self over ship or Empire.. As many Admirals are as politicaly selected
as by Command merit.. Are you a loyal team player or a glory hound?

[Grox]

Well , That means the fruit is only proven not to work on them..

Plan "B" I need a Volunteer thank you Nagus.. Rubbing this on a Ferengi
only proves it can
or cannot cure a . Ferengi Nagus ? By epidermal contact.. Now bite it is it posionious to Ferengi or everyone or a cure?
Do not trust a tricorder for everything..

Some crew members will not be cured some many be Happy we came.. It is a simple Utopian last act of desperation..

Think of all the new Charting you could do on the way.. that no one will see because you would have to have a deadmans switch to destroy your craft or the Romulans would gain sencitive materials..

If you go to save everyone ; you prove you can go the extra full measure of devotion in the attempt.

It is a test in the degree you place Self over ship or Empire.. As many Admirals are as politicaly selected
as by Command merit.. Are you a loyal team player or a glory hound?

Huh? Do you know what you are saying. Cause I don't.

[Trekkie]

Although this was not one of my favorite Kobayashi Maru scenarios either, I do think it is nice that all of the ones that have been officially posted so far have been really varied and the solutions are always very different. Indeed, I am hoping that the diversity in missions will be the same in-game, so obviously I will not mind it if I encounter a few that may not be my favorites or anything like that. Who knows, perhaps some of these scenarios (or something similar) may end up as actually missions in the game some day!