Gorn: Are they really going to be in game?

[ktanner3]

I know the faq says they will be but I didn't see that option on the last video released which showed character customization. I'm really curious how the Gorn will look as well. Will they look more like they did on TOS or like they did on Enterprise?

[topekaguy1988]

I know the faq says they will be but I didn't see that option on the last video released which showed character customization. I'm really curious how the Gorn will look as well. Will they look more like they did on TOS or like they did on Enterprise?

They haven't shown the Gorn but they will be in. But no one is sure exactly why they are fighting for the Klingons though. I wish they would shed more light on that. :confused:

[The.Grand.Nagus]

Probably like somewhat like the Trandoshans from SWG :o

[Loekii]

Here is the Perpetual Concept Art for Gorns:

http://startrek-games.com/startrekscreenshots/albums/userpics/10006/normal_Gorn.jpg


I think it is a little 'too' overboard, and too 'Dinosaur-ish'. I really liked the Facetted eyes of the TOS. I think I would like something more along the lines of this or the ENT version, provided the Facetted Eyes were added.

To be honest, I am a little troubled by the lack of any further Gorn screenshots and their absence from the Character Creation Video.

[IG_Slayer]

We shall all find out in about a year or two. In the mean time Im going to be playing Halo Wars (just came in the mail) and waiting for Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 to be released this November!!! :D Yeah 360!!! A great way to distact myself till this game is released!!! :D

[Nubadak]

The Dev's will have to change this. Star Trek cannonis clear the Gorn have been the Federations alies and friends from almost the very start.

[OddjobXL]

There are different factions inside Gorn politics, from what little I admittedly know, and some are probably much less inclined to be friendly with The Federation for whatever reason. Maybe they scored a coup and have, for now, the upper hand? Likely with the help of whatever cabal helped a hostile Klingon faction into power in The Empire. The Klingons and The Federation were allies too last I heard.

But this is in the future and nothing sits still for long.

[CherryTerri]

Here is the Perpetual Concept Art for Gorns:

http://startrek-games.com/startrekscreenshots/albums/userpics/10006/normal_Gorn.jpg


I think it is a little 'too' overboard, and too 'Dinosaur-ish'. I really liked the Facetted eyes of the TOS. I think I would like something more along the lines of this or the ENT version, provided the Facetted Eyes were added.

To be honest, I am a little troubled by the lack of any further Gorn screenshots and their absence from the Character Creation Video.

Ugh, like disgusting ape creatures. And no look from SWG either.

Gorn are GORN, just like from ToS. I highly doubt evolution under 200 years would have changed them that drastically.

[No1UKnow]

We shall all find out in about a year or two. In the mean time Im going to be playing Halo Wars (just came in the mail) and waiting for Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 to be released this November!!! :D Yeah 360!!! A great way to distact myself till this game is released!!! :D

I sincerely hope we are playing STO by November. There is nothing out there that is more exciting to me than that.

[Jenshae]

*Looks on the verge of tears.*

... but ... but ... they are both rough edged! There is a sort of race resemblance, you can't just toss that out for some cannon!

*Smiles and winks.*

[OddjobXL]

The most recent images we have of the Gorn are from the series Enterprise and they do, in fact, look much more like realistic dinosaur-men than the guy in the 60's style monster suit with disco balls for eyes:

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Gorn

[Zooguy]

I'm really looking forward to the Gorn and really hope they make them more like the Enterprise version than the rubber suit, I'm sure the only reason the TOS Gorn look like that is the limits of technology at the time.

[IG_Slayer]

Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2 and STO will be my source of entertainment for the next several years!!! :D

[bugen4]

What!?

Does this mean there might be Pahkwa-thanhs!

I'd so go for one of those!!


http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Shenti_Yisec_Eres_Ree

[Loekii]

Ugh, like disgusting ape creatures. And no look from SWG either.

Gorn are GORN, just like from ToS. I highly doubt evolution under 200 years would have changed them that drastically.


Aren't there at least 'two' different types of Gorns, much like there are Remains and Romulans.


I'm really looking forward to the Gorn and really hope they make them more like the Enterprise version than the rubber suit, I'm sure the only reason the TOS Gorn look like that is the limits of technology at the time.


The thing I disliked about the ENT Gorn was it was too 'Jurassic Park' Velocorapter, than Star Trek Gorn.

I really like the Facited Eyes of the TOS version (they are basically 'Iconic' imo for ST Gorns). I dislike the obvious poor quality of the Gorn Suit (limitations of 1960's Tv Costumes), not to mention the 'puggy' physic. I would imagine Gorns would be more lean and muscular.

Perhaps a more of middle ground between the two types (TOS and ENT) would be ideal

[jhem99]

The Gorn: going, going, gorne.

[OddjobXL]

Aren't there at least 'two' different types of Gorns, much like there are Remains and Romulans.





The thing I disliked about the ENT Gorn was it was too 'Jurassic Park' Velocorapter, than Star Trek Gorn.

I really like the Facited Eyes of the TOS version (they are basically 'Iconic' imo for ST Gorns). I dislike the obvious poor quality of the Gorn Suit (limitations of 1960's Tv Costumes).

Perhaps a more of middle ground between the two types (TOS and ENT) would be ideal

Well, I would bet there will be several options for Gorn eyes at least. That's the easy way to make everyone happy. Besides you could make some cool original races with disco eyes o' doom! (especially if you can color them).

[JPJappic]

The Dev's will have to change this. Star Trek cannonis clear the Gorn have been the Federations alies and friends from almost the very start.

They've already started to explain this. In one of the recent timeline updates the Klingons and Gorn were on the verge of going to war with each other.

On Stardate 61829.83, the IKS Quv is attacked by a Gorn ship and 207 Klingons die in the battle. Representatives of King Xrathis of the Gorn claim that the commander of their warship was acting without orders, but refuse to surrender the surviving crew of the Quv to the Klingon Empire. In response, Chancellor Martok expels the Gorn’s diplomats from the empire and orders ships to the Klingons’ border with the Gorn Hegemony.

Chances are that

A: The Klingons will take them over.
B: The Federation won't help the Gorn which will no doubt offend them.
C: The Gorn join the Klingons to take over the Federation and expand their borders.

[THORN74]

The Dev's will have to change this. Star Trek cannonis clear the Gorn have been the Federations alies and friends from almost the very start.

not qutie

According to Orion privateer Harrad-Sar in 2154, the Gorn government, known as the Gorn Hegemony, "brew the finest Meridor in the five star systems". (ENT: "Bound")

This, in combination of the appearance of a Gorn drinking from a glass in TAS, indicates that they consumed liquids.
First contact with the Gorn took place in 2267, when they attacked the Federation colony on Cestus III. The Gorn saw the strike as a preemptive move, since they regarded the Cestus star system as part of their territory. (TOS: "Arena")

While on the USS Enterprise in 2268, Benjamin Sisko admitted to Jadzia Dax that he would like to ask Kirk about the fight with the Gorn captain during this encounter. (DS9: "Trials and Tribble-ations")

A Gorn served on the ruling council of the pocket dimension Elysia, in the late 23rd century. It is unknown how long members of his species had been trapped in that universe. (TAS: "The Time Trap")

In Alan Dean Foster's novelization of "The Time Trap," the species name is misspelled "Gorin."
The FEDERATION SPACE board game, published by Task Force Games, indicated that a Gorn confederation formed when three separate but nearly identical sentient species, each having developed on a different planet (Gdhar I, Gdhar II, and Gdhar III, presumably in the Gdhar system) joined into a single political entity (see also Star Fleet Universe).


thats from memory-alpha's Gorn Page (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Gorn)

[Jenshae]

Funnily enough, Anne McCaffrey's dragons of Pern had faceted eyes.

[Arocks]

I think their will be gorn. they will probably look like the enterprise version.

[Cualtemuac]

What were those things on voyager that decended from the dinosaurs of earth. Someone who's better than me at looking this stuff up, can you find that on memory alpha or startrek.com

[JPJappic]

What were those things on voyager that decended from the dinosaurs of earth. Someone who's better than me at looking this stuff up, can you find that on memory alpha or startrek.com

You're talking about the Voth.

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Distant_Origin_(episode)

[Cualtemuac]

You're talking about the Voth.

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Distant_Origin_(episode)

Good call.

[BreachAndClear]

Relationships are always subject to change, just because the Gorn were on friendly terms with the Federation (I'm going by hearsay here, I know very little about the Gorn) that doesn't mean they won't jump sides, either willingly or by having their territory become a Klingon protectorate.

As for the Gorn's presence in STO. I'm not worried about it in the least. They weren't shown in the character creator, but neither were the Bajorans, Orions, Ferengi, or Tellarites.

[JMD10222]

The most recent images we have of the Gorn are from the series Enterprise and they do, in fact, look much more like realistic dinosaur-men than the guy in the 60's style monster suit with disco balls for eyes:

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Gorn


I like those alot better.

[Loekii]

I like those alot better.

While I like them better, I dislike the fact that they are basically a cross between a JurasicPark and a Human.

I think the Gorn need to look 'alien' and less 'Earth Dinasour'. Perhaps a cross between the TOS and ENT models could accomplish that. Imo, I would like it to be mostly ENT based, but with the Facited Eyes of the TOS.

[JMD10222]

While I like them better, I dislike the fact that they are basically a cross between a JurasicPark and a Human.

I think the Gorn need to look 'alien' and less 'Earth Dinasour'. Perhaps a cross between the TOS and ENT models could accomplish that. Imo, I would like it to be mostly ENT based, but with the Facited Eyes of the TOS.


I can agree with that.;)

[Commodore_Rook]

Ugh i hated the ENT version of the Gorn. Looked like a reject from Jurrasic park. I want the TOS Gorn, period! At the very least, I hope we can customize him to look either way, TOS like or for the ENT fans.

And since the Gorn are made up of three worlds, it is possible there are different versions of them.

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Gorn

[BreachAndClear]

Well, unless Cryptic decides to come up with some explanation as to why the ENT and TOS Gorn look different (e.g. different subspecies, etc.) then one would expect to see ENT style Gorn in STO over TOS Gorn, since the prior was created with greater technology available and wasn't limited by materials used in making a clunky suit.

I.E. The ENT Gorn probably ended up looking the way they were envisioned (or at least closer to it), than the TOS Gorn which probably didn't match the vision as well.

[Commodore_Rook]

Well, unless Cryptic decides to come up with some explanation as to why the ENT and TOS Gorn look different (e.g. different subspecies, etc.) then one would expect to see ENT style Gorn in STO over TOS Gorn, since the prior was created with greater technology available and wasn't limited by materials used in making a clunky suit.

I.E. The ENT Gorn probably ended up looking the way they were envisioned (or at least closer to it), than the TOS Gorn which probably didn't match the vision as well.

And why would we expect to see ENT versions over the established of 40+ years of the TOS Gorn??? No I say there are simply two different species of Gorn. Also of note, the one we saw in ENT WAS from the Mirror Universe.... They could be a completly different species period than the regular universe Gorn.

[BreachAndClear]

And why would we expect to see ENT versions over the established of 40+ years of the TOS Gorn???.

The same reason that ridged forehead Klingons ended up trumping the smooth headed kingons of TOS, because technological advances allowed a newer designs that more closely matched the vision of the director. ENT went back and explained away why the Klingons looked different, but before that explanation we were left to think that the ridged headed Klingons were the way the Klingons were always meant to look. In the absence of STO explaining why the Gorn have two looks, I would be inclined to think that the later design trumps the old design because the old design was restricted by technology, the newer design was not.

[CherryTerri]

The most recent images we have of the Gorn are from the series Enterprise and they do, in fact, look much more like realistic dinosaur-men than the guy in the 60's style monster suit with disco balls for eyes:

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Gorn

*cracks knuckles*

Okay .. let the Gorn lady in.

What you show in your link above is a digital make of what the Gorn look like, even though they never changed even through the Animated series (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Image:GornTAS.jpg) and books/graphic novels (http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Image:Gorn_Crisis_cover.jpg). Good lord they make them 3 fingered T-Rex's.

All because of updated graphics. You wanna see what another company wanted Gorn to look like when Arena was redone? Here (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v366/CherryTerri/?action=view&current=untitled2.jpg) ...

Can you honestly tell me, the above renditions of Gorn are better than the Original?


Aren't there at least 'two' different types of Gorns, much like there are Remains and Romulans.

There are two versions of how Gorn came to be.

One is that they all came from one planet, while another is that they came from 3 different planets (having different looks yet similar) and when they became space-faring, saw this.

The thing I disliked about the ENT Gorn was it was too 'Jurassic Park' Velocorapter, than Star Trek Gorn.

I really like the Facited Eyes of the TOS version (they are basically 'Iconic' imo for ST Gorns). I dislike the obvious poor quality of the Gorn Suit (limitations of 1960's Tv Costumes), not to mention the 'puggy' physic. I would imagine Gorns would be more lean and muscular.

Perhaps a more of middle ground between the two types (TOS and ENT) would be ideal

Well of course it was because of the time! Heck they went through the garbage of other sets to get their pieces.

There really is nothing wrong witht he look of the Gorn from Arena, which artists cannot fix from the "rubber suit" look.

About the comment that Gorn and Federation were allies ... that is correct.

A brief lull in Federation/Gorn rivalry in 2269 enabled Gorn cadet Telosirizharcrede of Cestus Eliar to enter Starfleet Academy. (TOS novel: Dreadnought!)

And they did involve themselves with political events in the Federation

By 2379, the Gorn Hegemony had established normal diplomatic relations with the Federation, and even maintained a diplomatic mission on Earth. The Gorn Ambassador to the United Federation of Planets that year was Zogozin, whom Federation President Min Zife of Bolarus found very intimidating. (TNG novel: A Time to Heal)

But you have to remember, much of what the Gorn are are non-cannon material, unlike Cardassian, Klingon, or much of Federation.

Well, unless Cryptic decides to come up with some explanation as to why the ENT and TOS Gorn look different (e.g. different subspecies, etc.) then one would expect to see ENT style Gorn in STO over TOS Gorn, since the prior was created with greater technology available and wasn't limited by materials used in making a clunky suit.

I.E. The ENT Gorn probably ended up looking the way they were envisioned (or at least closer to it), than the TOS Gorn which probably didn't match the vision as well.

The only way they could do this is throw a "Klingon call" about it, as they did with ridges/no ridges. But .. look at the DIFFERENCE the two are.

Unless they take into consideration the non-cannon fact of three different planets, each being of Gorn DNA yet extremely different, BUT also give the choice of the two versions ... not sure how else to explain that.

As for how they were envisioned, hard to say ... unless someone can find the script that describes them.

I'm watching closely what comes out, and will see what happens.

[Commodore_Rook]

And you guys are missing my observation, that the Gorn we saw on ENT was from the Mirror Universe. Those could be radically different than our universes.

[topekaguy1988]

In my opinion the original is the best. :D

Or at least, that is the kind of Gorn that I would want to play. Maybe do a mix of the two?

[Lence]

I don't think Steve Gorn is gonna be in the game :p

Why would you to play some guy who plays a bamboo flute anyway? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Gorn)

[topekaguy1988]

I don't think Steve Gorn is gonna be in the game :p

Why would you to play some guy who plays a bamboo flute anyway? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Gorn)

LOL, nice one :D

[Swizy]

I know the faq says they will be but I didn't see that option on the last video released which showed character customization. I'm really curious how the Gorn will look as well. Will they look more like they did on TOS or like they did on Enterprise?

Ummm you were expecting a Gorn in the character generator trailer?

[BreachAndClear]

The only way they could do this is throw a "Klingon call" about it, as they did with ridges/no ridges. But .. look at the DIFFERENCE the two are.

Unless they take into consideration the non-cannon fact of three different planets, each being of Gorn DNA yet extremely different, BUT also give the choice of the two versions ... not sure how else to explain that.

As for how they were envisioned, hard to say ... unless someone can find the script that describes them.

I'm watching closely what comes out, and will see what happens.

My point was that they could create some sort of back story as to why the two look different. Maybe the "faceted eye" is a lens that they wear to enhance their vision, perhaps they are different subspecies from different planets as you've mentioned (maybe), genetic alteration (maybe), phenotypic plasticity (unlikely), etc.

Or they could simply not acknowledge that the ENT Gorn and TOS Gorn look any different. There was a long period of time after the design of the Klingons changed in which it was really never even acknowledged that they looked different. As makeup techniques got better and less time consuming, they could add ridged foreheads to the klingons. It wouldn't be unreasonable to suspect that if that technology existed in the 60s that the Klingons may have looked that way from the beginning. Kirk had experience with the smooth headed klingons as well as the ridged headed ones in the films, and to my knowledge he never acknowledged anything out of the ordinary.

At the time it seemed as though the biology of the Klingons was simply retconned, such that fans would just have to take it for granted that they always looked like that. However, in DS9 with time travel storylines, and with Enterprise taking place before TOS, it was finally acknowledged that there were two Klingon morphs and it explained why they were different.

The same thing probably holds true for the Gorn. It is my guess that the faceted eyes are merely a way around the fact that painting a reptilian iris and pupil onto a bulging spherical eyes of the TOS Gorn costume would have looked horrible, CG wasn't around, and animatronic technology wasn't good enough to make reptilian eyes like those of Jurassic Park animatronics. CGI allowed the reptilian eyes to be feasible, and the creators decided to go with reptilian eyes over the faceted ones. As with the Klingons pre-DS9, it might simply be a retcon of design, implying - if that were the case - that officially the Gorn always looked as they did in ENT.

[Vicelance]

I like the original series Gorn best though I hope they make them move differently.

This has to be one of the worst fight scenes in television history.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1eFdUSnaQM&feature=related

I wouldn't mind it if we could have both choices.

[BreachAndClear]

I like the original series Gorn best though I hope they make them move differently.

This has to be one of the worst fight scenes in television history.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1eFdUSnaQM&feature=related

I wouldn't mind it if we could have both choices.

To be fair, all the fight scenes in TOS were completely ridiculous.

[Jenshae]

To be fair, all the fight scenes in TOS were completely ridiculous.

Oh how young you are, Grasshopper.
At the time, those were good. All TV and movies from the 21st centuary start looking silly the older they get and more sophisticated the stunt work, choreography, graphical effects and size of the bugets get over time.

[Loekii]

[COLOR="Green"]Well of course it was because of the time! Heck they went through the garbage of other sets to get their pieces.

There really is nothing wrong witht he look of the Gorn from Arena, which artists cannot fix from the "rubber suit" look.




I would be interested in seeing what the TOS model could look like if it were tweaked with 2009 CG.

[ktanner3]

I would be interested in seeing what the TOS model could look like if it were tweaked with 2009 CG.

That's what I hope they do for this game. The Enterprise look was too sleek.

[wootage]

The most recent images we have of the Gorn are from the series Enterprise and they do, in fact, look much more like realistic dinosaur-men than the guy in the 60's style monster suit with disco balls for eyes:

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Gorn

Nooo! I want the faceted insectoid eyes! Lizardguys are everywhere, but nobody's got the Gorn discoballs but them.

[wootage]

Oh how young you are, Grasshopper.
At the time, those were good. All TV and movies from the 21st centuary start looking silly the older they get and more sophisticated the stunt work, choreography, graphical effects and size of the bugets get over time.

No, no. That was pretty bad, even for the times lol.