How Long to Wait For Interiors?

[CaptainHoliday]

It took years for LucasArts to release JTL and add space and ship interiors. It is a big feat for Cryptic to get out both ground and space gameplay at launch, but the sacrifice is the lack of ship interiors, and starbase interiors, altough it appears we will get DS9 at launch.

EVE Online has promised interiors for stations for years, yet no progress has been made.

I would be willing to wait 5 months of less for an expansion or content update to add ship interiors and station interiors. And I want the ship interiors to be comprehensive, not just the bridge and ready room. I want the decks and corridors and all the rooms.

[mirkrim]

It took about a year for Turbine to add housing to LOTRO; hopefully Cryptic won't take too much longer than that.

[1MGSIX]

Don't matter to me. How long can I wander around my ship before it gets boring? I

[Azurian]

Depends how much they have already done.

But since they said the first expansion is said to be the addition of the Romulan and Dominion factions, I got the feeling that interiors are going to be on the back burner for a while. (2 years?)

[CaptainQuirk]

Well, it would seem that cryptic has had a pretty fast track record in terms of their CoH/CoV content releases. I would expect to see the first wave of interiors to start surfacing within three months of release.

In the first wave, I would figure only critical areas of our ships will be presented. Future waves would give us access to non critical areas.

Eventually, I would expect complete ship layouts, with the ship becoming a hub of activity for our guilds, potentially leading up to player-crewed ships which would be balanced for PCShip vs PCShip combat in special areas of space.

This is a game that has a great deal of potential for growth, eventually offering content to all playstyles... even those who prefer just existing in the gameworld...

But first, I want them to get a solid core game out there that is compelling enough with iconic content that I won't really dwell too much on what hasn't been added yet.

[CinC-UFPForces-Cardassia]

It took years for LucasArts to release JTL and add space and ship interiors. It is a big feat for Cryptic to get out both ground and space gameplay at launch, but the sacrifice is the lack of ship interiors, and starbase interiors, altough it appears we will get DS9 at launch.

EVE Online has promised interiors for stations for years, yet no progress has been made.

I would be willing to wait 5 months of less for an expansion or content update to add ship interiors and station interiors. And I want the ship interiors to be comprehensive, not just the bridge and ready room. I want the decks and corridors and all the rooms.

I'm sure they'll order special calendars.

[Moryan_Sorg]

Interiors would be neat, but I can see why they would put it on the back burner if they are going to have NPC crews. Though, isn't the ship's interior the main thing that the previous developers had worked on? Whatever, i'm still not concerned. I agree that there is huge growth potential though, i mean just think of the things they could do with holodecks, talk about minigames! Guaranteed I'll be the top holodeck tennis player!

[Eagler]

Meh, I'm willing to sit on my money until we hear on something on this. May give me time to get a fancier computer. :D

[osena]

It took years for LucasArts to release JTL and add space and ship interiors. It is a big feat for Cryptic to get out both ground and space gameplay at launch, but the sacrifice is the lack of ship interiors, and starbase interiors, altough it appears we will get DS9 at launch.

EVE Online has promised interiors for stations for years, yet no progress has been made.

I would be willing to wait 5 months of less for an expansion or content update to add ship interiors and station interiors. And I want the ship interiors to be comprehensive, not just the bridge and ready room. I want the decks and corridors and all the rooms.

Um no jump to light speed was released 10 months after the SWG released

[Urantia]

I never cared for interiors either way...so I will wait patiently until they patch them in. Whether Cryptic et al decides on "boxed" expansions like some MMORPGs...or update using pure subscription fees, I would expect interiors to be included standard...I can only imagine the uproar if a player had to purchase an expansion pack to get them. Especially those upset over them (free roam) not being in at launch.

[Urantia]

Um no jump to light speed was released 10 months after the SWG released

Aye...it was not "years." However, years later it was included for free...and did not require a seperate purchase.

[Silverspar]

Depends how much they have already done.

But since they said the first expansion is said to be the addition of the Romulan and Dominion factions, I got the feeling that interiors are going to be on the back burner for a while. (2 years?)

Wow, people take expansion too literally. You know, Cryptic's definition of an expansion is a major content update, and probably will be a major patch not an actual box expansion.

[JMD10222]

Wow, people take expansion too literally. You know, Cryptic's definition of an expansion is a major content update, and probably will be a major patch not an actual box expansion.

Exactly sir:D That's why it does not bother me that It wont be in at launch. ;)

[Urantia]

Wow, people take expansion too literally. You know, Cryptic's definition of an expansion is a major content update, and probably will be a major patch not an actual box expansion.

I sincerely hope so...I hate that tired old model of "boxed" expansions. I prefer the language of patches and updates.

[Rivaris]

i dont mind if they add it 3 years from now.
it will take a long time to design interior for every ship and who knows what else will be added they just dont have the time to make them and all the content needed for a launch and bug fix/ test it all.

i rather play the game with out interiors then to wait till spring 2011so i can walk around in my ship at launch

i for sure wont have time to walk around my ship for more then 5min in the first 6 months of the game.

i got places to explore ,missions to do and people to kill.

ofc when i warp to a system and it will take 10min to get there if you dont use the transwarp then yeah i hope they add the officer poker den so i got something to do for 10min

[jason24]

I don't mind not having places like sick bay and engineering ect.... but what i really hope Cryptic does is at least get an interior for your Bridge up and running which you can custom build. I really want to be able to experience the game from sitting in my captains chair with the option of changing the camera view to the exterior of my ship when i want.
I want to be able to see the crew i have spent time creating actually doing their jobs on the bridge, not just seeing them on away missions ect..

I think that this should be put in the first "expansion" which i would imagine will be released within the first 6 months of the game being released as this is surely something that most people want plus i would think that it would get the interest of new players as well.

[jbarker82]

Well they have a lot of planet surfaces to make yet i'm sure, not to mention all the building interiors for those planets. I'm pretty sure they did say that depending on a mission you would be able to walk around in certain ships with the launch content, but only on certain missions to begin with.

They must have done some work on ship interiors already because there is a picture of a Warp Core in the Images section of this website. I think they may have done more work on this then they let on.

[knightofhyrule730]

Wow, people take expansion too literally. You know, Cryptic's definition of an expansion is a major content update, and probably will be a major patch not an actual box expansion.

a new expansion will be available for free download every 3 months. interiors will go live somewhere in the first 4 content expansions. (3-12 months) Because it's such a hot button item, i am saying 3-6 months.

[Weiss222]

Lack of full interiors doesn't bother me too much.. What I do think is important is being able to access critical locations of ships.. E.g. Bridge, Ready Room, Engineering, Medical Bay maybe personal quarters etc. That way you can do the important things as you need.

[KO_Gilligan]

I would be happy if they wait until the community actually decides on what they want.

This discussion has become old hat for me.
Would anyone care to discuss (a) how these interiors will function and (b) effect the outside ship and space?

There is a great amount of variation of opinion on this - worlds of difference even.

Afterall, just spamming unspecified demands could potentially delay your beloved quest to get back indoors.

[bradley1701]

Cryptic said in an interview that if interiors weren't available at launch, then they would be available shortly thereafter. That to me sounds like less than a year...a year at most.

[Dext]

It took years for LucasArts to release JTL and add space and ship interiors. It is a big feat for Cryptic to get out both ground and space gameplay at launch, but the sacrifice is the lack of ship interiors, and starbase interiors, altough it appears we will get DS9 at launch.

EVE Online has promised interiors for stations for years, yet no progress has been made.

I would be willing to wait 5 months of less for an expansion or content update to add ship interiors and station interiors. And I want the ship interiors to be comprehensive, not just the bridge and ready room. I want the decks and corridors and all the rooms.

They need to take as long as they need I do not wont to have it in the game if it don't work right.

[KO_Gilligan]

They need to take as long as they need I do not wont to have it in the game if it don't work right.

Come again?

[osena]

Aye...it was not "years." However, years later it was included for free...and did not require a seperate purchase.

i pre ordered that sucker and got this thing called a flash speeder only those that be ordered JTL got them

[osena]

i dont mind if they add it 3 years from now.
it will take a long time to design interior for every ship and who knows what else will be added they just dont have the time to make them and all the content needed for a launch and bug fix/ test it all.

i rather play the game with out interiors then to wait till spring 2011so i can walk around in my ship at launch

i for sure wont have time to walk around my ship for more then 5min in the first 6 months of the game.

i got places to explore ,missions to do and people to kill.

ofc when i warp to a system and it will take 10min to get there if you dont use the transwarp then yeah i hope they add the officer poker den so i got something to do for 10min

i agree the captians place is on the bridge of his ship not hideing like a rat in the belly of it

[Voyager24]

I agree with most people three months after release.

[knightofhyrule730]

This discussion has become old hat for me.
Would anyone care to discuss (a) how these interiors will function and (b) effect the outside ship and space?


Cryptic previously said that the interiors would really only be a "hang out" place for friends to chill out, and would not be anything more than an RP assistant. Nothing would happen on the inside. Which is why I really don't care when they come. But yeah, I'd like to hang out in my ship if I was waiting for something, I guess. Just as long as we get starbase interiors. But those are happening at launch.

[KO_Gilligan]

Cryptic previously said that the interiors would really only be a "hang out" place for friends to chill out, and would not be anything more than an RP assistant. Nothing would happen on the inside. Which is why I really don't care when they come. But yeah, I'd like to hang out in my ship if I was waiting for something, I guess. Just as long as we get starbase interiors. But those are happening at launch.

Thanks for that...

Because my perception is that a very large amount of the same people asking for Interiors say they think this ^ is not what they want.


But I'd like it, it wold be easier for Cryptic to provide than an interior that is active in the larger world - as it is mostly client side with instances of sharing your little mini-world with others. Sharing it with others really makes it much more than a client side mini game

[The.Grand.Nagus]

Depends how much they have already done.

But since they said the first expansion is said to be the addition of the Romulan and Dominion factions, I got the feeling that interiors are going to be on the back burner for a while. (2 years?)

Link please. I do not recall them ever officialy announcing what the first expansion would be.

[Sumoben]

Link please. I do not recall them ever officialy announcing what the first expansion would be.

I don't remember that either o_O.

[KO_Gilligan]

Link please. I do not recall them ever officialy announcing what the first expansion would be.

and adding Romulans as a faction soon after release - unlikely

Probably something he read over at MMORPG.com :rolleyes:

[robgomm]

It might be a while, but at least we will eventually get the interiors, even if it only turns out to be a couple of rooms. Personally i'd be happy with the bridge, ready room, my quarters, the mess hall, conference room.

[knightofhyrule730]

Thanks for that...

Because my perception is that a very large amount of the same people asking for Interiors say they think this ^ is not what they want.


But I'd like it, it wold be easier for Cryptic to provide than an interior that is active in the larger world - as it is mostly client side with instances of sharing your little mini-world with others. Sharing it with others really makes it much more than a client side mini game

I am sure they can figure something out. Who knows, if they ever decide to allow players to take over for your npc crew, we might get to see some interior interaction (like clicking on the warp core to fix it) or something.

[Sumoben]

we might get to see some interior interaction (like clicking on the warp core to fix it) or something.

That made me Lol. No offense or anything, but lets take a hyperspanner or a wrench and click on the warp core with it to fix it. XD.

[Thibor]

a new expansion will be available for free download every 3 months. interiors will go live somewhere in the first 4 content expansions. (3-12 months) Because it's such a hot button item, i am saying 3-6 months.

You state that as if it's fact. And while it may be, I've yet to see/hear it stated as such for STO, regardless of the model they use for CoH/CoV or the forthcoming Champions. I'd be curious to read where they've stated they intend to follow their studio's previous model or stated what you claimed in your post.

I'm not saying what you suggest is a bad model in anyway or that it is or isn't how Cryptic will operate for STO. But, if all you're basing your statement on is their past history, you might want to include that tidbit to give folks the proper perspective.

[knightofhyrule730]

That made me Lol. No offense or anything, but lets take a hyperspanner or a wrench and click on the warp core with it to fix it. XD.

how else are you going to interact with something in a game?



You state that as if it's fact. And while it may be, I've yet to see/hear it stated as such for STO, regardless of the model they use for CoH/CoV or the forthcoming Champions. I'd be curious to read where they've stated they intend to follow their studio's previous model or stated what you claimed in your post.

I'm not saying what you suggest is a bad model in anyway or that it is or isn't how Cryptic will operate for STO. But, if all you're basing your statement on is their past history, you might want to include that tidbit to give folks the proper perspective.

im pretty sure theyve said it in an interview or two. they plan to update content every 3 or so months.

[Urantia]

i pre ordered that sucker and got this thing called a flash speeder only those that be ordered JTL got them

I never pre-ordered it myself...just bought it in the store the day it came out...because it was later made standard I wish I would never have wasted the money on it. Space was never that interesting to me in that game so I would not have missed it. Having beta tested SWG, then playing non-stop from day one to just after chapter 10 (pokemon trading card game was my last straw)...I did not bother with getting even one of my 8 toons (only ever had 1 account) to ace until a few months before I quit :).

To each there own, but space sucked in that game in my opinion. Even back then (even before JTL) I wished there was a Star Trek MMORPG...had STO come out at the same time as SWG I would never have bothered with SWG. Hell I was not really even a SW fan beyond the norm...it was my brother that signed me up for beta (i got picked first to his dismay)...and I admit from playing that game I got more interested in the mythos...but alas...it was not ST.

[osena]

I never pre-ordered it myself...just bought it in the store the day it came out...because it was later made standard I wish I would never have wasted the money on it. Space was never that interesting to me in that game so I would not have missed it. Having beta tested SWG, then playing non-stop from day one to just after chapter 10 (pokemon trading card game was my last straw)...I did not bother with getting even one of my 8 toons (only ever had 1 account) to ace until a few months before I quit :).

To each there own, but space sucked in that game in my opinion. Even back then (even before JTL) I wished there was a Star Trek MMORPG...had STO come out at the same time as SWG I would never have bothered with SWG. Hell I was not really even a SW fan beyond the norm...it was my brother that signed me up for beta (i got picked first to his dismay)...and I admit from playing that game I got more interested in the mythos...but alas...it was not ST.

i stoped 3 days after NGE cos the insulted me to no end all that hard work i put in unlocking jedi only to have blue million noobs runing around in padawan robe for all that hard work unlocking the here class i got a black bath robe and dark blue crystal kenobis legacey the striped me of my power .... sorry for my rant what pokemon card game?

[captainjohn]

Before actually waiting lets hope it actually is something that will be actually done.At the moment there isn't a
confirmation that interiors will be added eventually.They just said the interiors are one of the things they are planning for the future.This is an outrage as interiors should have been from the launch and also be integral to the gameplay and not just a housing,social meeting place witch is the way they said they see them.

In Star Trek interiors where extremely important as many many episodes where placed on completely on ships.
The people that say interiors are not important i am 200% are simple mmo wow players that want a pew pew with ships ala wow in space.True fans that have watched all the seasons multiple times would not even dare to say that interiors are not important.
But the most ironic thing of all is the devs saying that they don't put interiors because they cannot thing of anything to do there and they thing they are boring...? HUH ??????????
I thought jack had said that everyone has seen all star trek's episodes but i don't believe him now.

Remember how many episodes in the series where completely in ships and starbases interiors ?
remember the mission that picard was tryed to fight some thieves that wanted to steel the enterprise while a ship decontamination was happening?
Remember the episodes where trip was trying to find how the nx enterprice was buing fixed by a romulan repair station?
Remember the many episodes of all the series that took in the holodeck? Those episodes were great to add
a different tone and different ideas to tackle classical events.For example the sherlock holmes vs the moriarty episodes,Or the 1930's holodeck episodes,or the 1930 film noir episodes etc..or the koyabashi maru training on holodeck etc..
Or remember the episodes with the phase in and out while in ship?Or the episode where the time were repeating.
I could go on and on and on but the thing is that there interiors are interconnected with everything star trek is
And i hope the devs realise this and give us interiors from the launch.

[Silverspar]

So, SAHMEET, when are you going to post the actual information instead of posting your typical hate spewed rhetoric that has no basis in fact? :rolleyes:

[captainjohn]

Who is sameet?
And as for the facts...what are the facts ?
They said that they are planning for interiors and that they see them only as social meeting places or housing where you can show your individual ship.
Is there any new fact i didn't mention ?

From what i know planning is not the same with an actually comfirmed and dated release.Countless of game companies have promised hundreds of thing on various games to millions of gamers but not even a single of this
promises and plans eventually turned real.
At the present moment unless cryptic actually confirms intreriors and give us a date of the expansion or patch that will add them the whole interiors issue is simply vapourware.

I do hope i am proven wrong but i am not the only one that see's interiors as something of great importance.I given a ton of examples to show how important they truly are and how they can be integral to the whole game experience.

Sadly the only real problem i see for their inclution is not a technical or a luck of ideas as i have proved the core of star trek has a strong base on interiors.
The real problem is that they want to release the game earlier than it is actually released to cut production time as save money.The game will still sell like hotcakes in the begining.And even if it turns out mediocre they will still make tons of money as the have cut the production time and cost by 1/3 of the normal game developments time.(As i see it they have are making this game will making another one,champion online).Both are mmo games,both use the same engine(the new coh version if i am not mistaken),both use the same netcode and as both use a cartoony style (where in champions it is perfect fitted it is akwardly out of place in sto) both can use a lot of the same assets(for example same objects for the worlds)

If i am mistaken somewhere please correct me.But correct me with facts and on everything and not only where is suits you fine please.

[Silverspar]

No, you just keep posting infactual information and constantly attacking everything for no basis other than your little world is supposedly shattered, and of course, you keep make believing that there won't be starship interiors or starbase interiors at all (instances missions and social hubs will have those interiors), yet are provabnly wrong now, and you constantly ignore it. So, again I state, when are you going to start posting facts instead of making up the billigerant BS you keep spouting.

[Urantia]

i stoped 3 days after NGE cos the insulted me to no end all that hard work i put in unlocking jedi only to have blue million noobs runing around in padawan robe for all that hard work unlocking the here class i got a black bath robe and dark blue crystal kenobis legacey the striped me of my power .... sorry for my rant what pokemon card game?

I will answer your question in a private message so as to not to go off topic any more than I did already...besides whom here (aside from yourself) could give a rats ass about SWG :).

[LightG1138]

realisticly I wouldn't expect to see them for at least a year. the first priority for the dev team will be to iron out the bugs at launch and i'm sure that will take a few months alone. Then they have to CREATE the interiors, then TEST. So I'm confident they'll get to them, just might take a bit longer.

[_Pax_]

City of Heroes' first content update came 62 days after launch, and raised the level cap by 10 (from 40 to 50). At least I think that's the Issue that brougth levels 41-50 to Heroes.

The next one came 27 days after that (total of 89 days after Launch, just under the three-month mark), and included ...

...

... CAPES. A feature Cryptic had said, much as with Player Interiors, "they couldn't get to work right, in time for launch" ... but promised to add "As soon as we can get it RIGHT". A feature which the entire playerbase felt was undeniably REQUIRED for any Super-Hero MMO.

Eighty-nine days. That doesn't really seem so traumaticly long a time to wait, now, does it? :)

[_Pax_]

[...]
I've had enough of this sort of drivel; begone!

*plonk*

[KirksOtherSon]

... CAPES. A feature Cryptic had said, much as with Player Interiors, "they couldn't get to work right, in time for launch" ... but promised to add "As soon as we can get it RIGHT". A feature which the entire playerbase felt was undeniably REQUIRED for any Super-Hero MMO.

Eighty-nine days. That doesn't really seem so traumaticly long a time to wait, now, does it? :)

I suspect that interiors will take a little longer than 89 days, Pax :D not least because there's so much more to create and to test than with capes -- but your point is well-taken.

I was in Cryptic's City of Heroes from launch day and, yeah, my friends and I all sort of missed capes at first -- but it's worth mentioning that we were having an incredibly good time even without them.

There was so much to see and to do, conversations about "Wouldn't it be great if the game had X?" usually ended with somebody saying "Yeah, sure -- now let's go take out those Vahzilok zombies infesting the sewers. My contact is counting on us!"

My point is, we were happy, immersed, and entertained, even without capes, or bow and arrow power sets, or a super-base, or any of the other cool things Cryptic added later, once they got them polished up and placed in the game.

We wanted these things, but we didn't sit around weeping and growling until they showed. The game at launch was engaging and interesting and fun even without these things.

Star Trek Online will almost certainly be the same way. Cryptic knows their craft, without a doubt.

I suspect a lot of the doomsayers are not seriously thinking about how much can be done with instanced (mission-based) interiors to give a sense of involvement and presence aboard one's own ship, either. What better way to feel "aboard your vessel" than actually engaging in a dramatic mission scenario?

Oh sure, interiors will come -- probably in the form of key "sets", at first -- but those who expect or demand full starship interiors (down to the last Jeffries tube) for every ship class in the game are unlikely to ever have their needs met. It's simply too much design work for too little general player reward.

In any case, I can almost guarantee that we won't be bored while waiting for interiors; when they show, we'll pause briefly to shout huzzah and to do the dance of joy -- and then we'll get right back to having fun in the final frontier.

Cheers, Pax,

KOS

[KO_Gilligan]

I suspect that interiors will take a little longer than 89 days, Pax :D not least because there's so much more to create and to test than with capes -- but your point is well-taken.

I was in Cryptic's City of Heroes from launch day and, yeah, my friends and I all sort of missed capes at first -- but it's worth mentioning that we were having an incredibly good time even without them.

There was so much to see and to do, conversations about "Wouldn't it be great if the game had X?" usually ended with somebody saying "Yeah, sure -- now let's go take out those Vahzilok zombies infesting the sewers. My contact is counting on us!"

My point is, we were happy, immersed, and entertained, even without capes, or bow and arrow power sets, or a super-base, or any of the other cool things Cryptic added later, once they got them polished up and placed in the game.

We wanted these things, but we didn't sit around weeping and growling until they showed. The game at launch was engaging and interesting and fun even without these things.

Star Trek Online will almost certainly be the same way. Cryptic knows their craft, without a doubt.

I suspect a lot of the doomsayers are not seriously thinking about how much can be done with instanced (mission-based) interiors to give a sense of involvement and presence aboard one's own ship, either. What better way to feel "aboard your vessel" than actually engaging in a dramatic mission scenario?

Oh sure, interiors will come -- probably in the form of key "sets", at first -- but those who expect or demand full starship interiors (down to the last Jeffries tube) for every ship class in the game are unlikely to ever have their needs met. It's simply too much design work for too little general player reward.

In any case, I can almost guarantee that we won't be bored while waiting for interiors; when they show, we'll pause briefly to shout huzzah and to do the dance of joy -- and then we'll get right back to having fun in the final frontier.

Cheers, Pax,

KOS

Those people are just flag wavers. If it wasn't for Interiors and Player Crews to argue about, I could probably get them on my crusade for non-bipedal races. An issue that for me, is pretty important.

It's bad enough that the series was conveniently bi-pedal dominated, a fact that really shows how ignorant humans really are... but it is something they addressed, it wasn't ignored completely.

How likely is it that we'll get a new character creator any time soon?

I'm not a doomsdayer though. The game will still be Star Trek regardless of how many of these infractions we want to lay on them.

[Silverspar]

Those people are just flag wavers. If it wasn't for Interiors and Player Crews to argue about, I could probably get them on my crusade for non-bipedal races. An issue that for me, is pretty important.

It's bad enough that the series was conveniently bi-pedal dominated, a fact that really shows how ignorant humans really are... but it is something they addressed, it wasn't ignored completely.

How likely is it that we'll get a new character creator any time soon?

I'm not a doomsdayer though. The game will still be Star Trek regardless of how many of these infractions we want to lay on them.

That wasn't because of ignorance but more due to budget.

However, that being said, Gene Roddenberry did believe that species from other worlds would probably look humanoid, for the most part. Of course tehre are always exceptions.

[Draighwulf]

Remember how many episodes in the series where completely in ships and starbases interiors ?
remember the mission that picard was tryed to fight some thieves that wanted to steel the enterprise while a ship decontamination was happening?
Remember the episodes where trip was trying to find how the nx enterprice was buing fixed by a romulan repair station?
Remember the many episodes of all the series that took in the holodeck? Those episodes were great to add
a different tone and different ideas to tackle classical events.For example the sherlock holmes vs the moriarty episodes,Or the 1930's holodeck episodes,or the 1930 film noir episodes etc..or the koyabashi maru training on holodeck etc..
Or remember the episodes with the phase in and out while in ship?Or the episode where the time were repeating.
I could go on and on and on but the thing is that there interiors are interconnected with everything star trek is
And i hope the devs realise this and give us interiors from the launch.

Those interiors were all part of the mission's

If we're getting interiors when they are needed as part of a mission.. well you're getting what you seem to be asking for

It's just free roaming of the ships outside of missions that we're not getting at launch

[KO_Gilligan]

That wasn't because of ignorance but more due to budget.

However, that being said, Gene Roddenberry did believe that species from other worlds would probably look humanoid, for the most part. Of course tehre are always exceptions.

Actually, exceptional differences would likely be the rule, and remember, earlier beliefs about Aliens assumed that a planet would need a very similar environment to support life (a theory that has been increasingly criticized, and in and of itself does not conclude Bipeds or that they would be shaped like humans at all)

From: The introduction of "How Aliens Work"

by Craig Freudenrich, Ph.D.


Greetings, Carbon-based Bipeds!

Most of us picture alien life the way it's portrayed in movies, where aliens are commonly depicted as human-like forms because they use actors either to play the roles directly in make-up or to be models for computer-generated animation. Also, audiences relate to human-like aliens better than to more exotic, monster-like creatures. However, the human body plan -- bilateral symmetry with one head, two legs and two arms -- stems from when early amphibians and reptiles colonized the Earth's land masses, and it seems unlikely that such a shape would evolve on an alien world.

[SenshiBat]

Sameet - 1 definition - One who is wise, thoughtful and damn good looking.
You Go Ko

[captainjohn]

City of Heroes' first content update came 62 days after launch, and raised the level cap by 10 (from 40 to 50). At least I think that's the Issue that brougth levels 41-50 to Heroes.

The next one came 27 days after that (total of 89 days after Launch, just under the three-month mark), and included ...

...

... CAPES. A feature Cryptic had said, much as with Player Interiors, "they couldn't get to work right, in time for launch" ... but promised to add "As soon as we can get it RIGHT". A feature which the entire playerbase felt was undeniably REQUIRED for any Super-Hero MMO.

Eighty-nine days. That doesn't really seem so traumaticly long a time to wait, now, does it? :)

For the love of god....Have you smoked my man?Are capes the same with full explorable interiors?
They needed three months!!!!!!!!!!!! for a ****** 3#$$T^$# cape and you are proud to mention it??

Great interiors need a lot of work.Thats why they were removed from the game cause they didn't want to need more time or get more artists and designers.They have to at least fully model the most popural ships like the enterprise d,1701 and nx ,the voyager class,the defiant class,the akira class,the constitution class,ofcourse a klingon bird of pray and a klingon capital ship as well as a romulan bird of prey.Also they have to model the interiors of deep space space stations and ofcourse the earths shipyards.All the above are the absolute minimum.Its not difficult from a technical side and they could enrich the game thousands of times if they did them.
In any case i Repeat: If cryptic needed 3 months to add something as simple as a ghfgth5j cape!!!!!!!! how long they would need for fully explorable interiors??
Are you afraid to ask yourself this question pax or silverspar or whoever you are?
because you know the answear and its ugly

[Draighwulf]

it may have taken em 3 months to do, but I think it was well worth the time

the capes in CoH are very well done, there's occasional clipping into the characters but they're a lot more mobile, light and flowing than say the ones in WoW

Wheras WoW's are pretty static, CoH's show a very good sense of detail and actually behave as you'd expect them do

[starbuck1771]

Don't matter to me. How long can I wander around my ship before it gets boring? I

Only an idiot would think they have to constantly wander around their ship. anyways I love the fact that Cryptic is getting blasted all over the internet for dumb choices like no pc ships and no interiors at launch. The fact that STO is clearly not going to be an MMO but rather a away team clone with some starfleet command tossed in will do more damage to unit sales then good. This is supposed to be an mmorpg not some halfassed singleplayer game.

the devs and Jack Emmert need to understand that doing a terrible job will not earn them any praises.

[Sumoben]

Only an idiot would think they have to constantly wander around their ship. anyways I love the fact that Cryptic is getting blasted all over the internet for dumb choices like no pc ships and no interiors at launch. The fact that STO is clearly not going to be an MMO but rather a away team clone with some starfleet command tossed in will do more damage to unit sales then good. This is supposed to be an mmorpg not some halfassed singleplayer game.

the devs and Jack Emmert need to understand that doing a terrible job will not earn them any praises.

Doing a terrible job in YOUR opinion. Although everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I rather that people not bash Cryptic on the STO forums. If they wish to do it elsewhere, fine.

Also, MMO means Massively Multiplayer Online. STO is exactly that.

[SelorKiith]

MMO does not mean "Having millions and trillions of useless places" my dear starbuck... and obviously you do not understand certain things... or rather don't like to understand...

[_Pax_]

For the love of god....Have you smoked my man?Are capes the same with full explorable interiors?
They needed three months!!!!!!!!!!!! for a ****** 3#$$T^$# cape and you are proud to mention it??
Yes.

They needed eighty-nine days to get something RIGHT - and they did precisely that, got it right. CoH/V capes flex, move, and flow - Clothsim, something most other MMOs don't even really have, certainly not dynamically calculated and rendered.

Eighty-nine days to do that, and add entire new powersets, and increase the level range (and content quantity) of the game by 25%, and add a very very LOOOONG list of other features, and do the typical post-Launch balance patching.

Are you afraid to ask yourself this question pax or silverspar or whoever you are?
because you know the answear and its ugly
Silver and I are not the same person - I don't even particularly like Silver. Didn't like him much over on the CoH boards, either - so unless you think I spent the last FOUR YEARS creating a sock-puppet identity for a forum that didn't exist, and noone could have known WOULD exist ... stop making a fool of yourself.

Presuming your capable of that, which I begin to doubt.

[Hagon]

Only an idiot would think they have to constantly wander around their ship. anyways I love the fact that Cryptic is getting blasted all over the internet for dumb choices like no pc ships and no interiors at launch. The fact that STO is clearly not going to be an MMO but rather a away team clone with some starfleet command tossed in will do more damage to unit sales then good. This is supposed to be an mmorpg not some halfassed singleplayer game.

the devs and Jack Emmert need to understand that doing a terrible job will not earn them any praises.It's not getting blasted all over the internet at all. Please keep within the realm of reality. It's the same very small number of malcontents, you being one of them, spamming the same tired old shtick over and over at a couple of sites.

[1MGSIX]

Only an idiot would think they have to constantly wander around their ship. anyways I love the fact that Cryptic is getting blasted all over the internet for dumb choices like no pc ships and no interiors at launch. The fact that STO is clearly not going to be an MMO but rather a away team clone with some starfleet command tossed in will do more damage to unit sales then good. This is supposed to be an mmorpg not some halfassed singleplayer game.

the devs and Jack Emmert need to understand that doing a terrible job will not earn them any praises.

Reminds me of one of my kids temper tantrums. Don't feed the trolls.

[theexplorer1]

Instead of demanding interiors you are settle with unspecified hopes and promises and supposed plans that they will be brought in the game?

Interiors are something extremely important and the removal of them is a huge blow for sto as they are of key nature in the series.Many anazing episodes took place altogether in the interiors of these starships or star bases.

[Sumoben]

Instead of demanding interiors you are settle with unspecified hopes and promises and supposed plans that they will be brought in the game?

Interiors are something extremely important and the removal of them is a huge blow for sto as they are of key nature in the series.Many anazing episodes took place altogether in the interiors of these starships or star bases.

They were not Removed, they are being delayed. Ship interiors aren't going to dramatically change the way the game will play in the long run.

[Hagon]

Instead of demanding interiors you are settle with unspecified hopes and promises and supposed plans that they will be brought in the game?

Interiors are something extremely important and the removal of them is a huge blow for sto as they are of key nature in the series.Many anazing episodes took place altogether in the interiors of these starships or star bases.Interiors will be there as part of episodes where it's relevant to see them, so in other words, Cryptic is giving you exactly what you want.

So there you go. You have no issue. Now you can enjoy the anticipation of this game's release.

[sharpe6]

The Klingon old guard awaits the release

[KO_Gilligan]

Instead of demanding interiors you are settle with unspecified hopes and promises and supposed plans that they will be brought in the game?

Interiors are something extremely important and the removal of them is a huge blow for sto as they are of key nature in the series.Many anazing episodes took place altogether in the interiors of these starships or star bases.

Your claim that they removed them is not true.

It is misinformation.

This is not Perpetual and they never had them.

[Silverspar]

Your claim that they removed them is not true.

It is misinformation.

This is not Perpetual and they never had them.

We've been stating that fact to him and throwing the proof in his face now for weeks. He still won't accept the truth however, so we just correct his misinformation for when he tries to pass his misinformation off as fact for people who are new to the forum or didn't bother to research.

[KO_Gilligan]

They were not Removed, they are being delayed. Ship interiors aren't going to dramatically change the way the game will play in the long run.

This is not true either.

They are being considered for adding later - a notable difference from your claim.


We've been stating that fact to him and throwing the proof in his face now for weeks. He still won't accept the truth however, so we just correct his misinformation for when he tries to pass his misinformation off as fact for people who are new to the forum or didn't bother to research.

and apparently it's working :rolleyes:

The OP is actually a bit of shameless copy and paste misinformation from MMORPG.com and indicates no space station interiors - when in fact we have known all along that there will be space station interiors.

[jbarker82]

I would have thought the the pictures of certain interiors in the screenshot part of this very website (Notably a Warp Core and a few other interior images) would go to show certain people that work does seem to be being done on the interiors of ship and starbases .... let alone creating colonies on hundreds of planets throughout the Galaxy.

I can't get behind people who are registered on these forums criticizing every little detail that doesn't fit with their 'Perfect' Star Trek Online experience. The game will cater for the many, not the few. Get over it.

I am satisfied that Cryptic will stick to their word about adding ship interiors and all these other things that people want in the future after the core game has been released. I see it as adding and improving on what is shaping up to be possibly the best MMO since WoW. Quite a claim I know but one i'm willing to make.

Back on topic ....

As some work has already been done on interiors (for missions only or otherwise), I would say that perhaps Cryptic will release them within perhaps 6months of initial release? I have no evidence to back that up it's just my opinion from looking at the screenies :)

[KO_Gilligan]

I'd like to see what evidence there is that we will ever get any ship interiors besides missions.

I keep seeing words like "promise" and "how long" and wonder where people get this stuff.

I'd like to see what evidence there is that we will ever get any ship interiors besides missions.

[theexplorer1]

They were not Removed, they are being delayed. Ship interiors aren't going to dramatically change the way the game will play in the long run.

No they are removed for the moment my friend.Also not only ship interiors were removed but also star bases interiors.Many people refer that there will be instanced ship interiors for the missions but they make it sound like there will be star bases interiors for everything.That is not true.Star bases interiors will also be only for instanced missions.
Full scale interiors are one of the things on the planning list but it is not confirmed or written in stone and also there is no any confirmed date for their addition.

But the most important thing is that interiors are very important for the actual gameplay.
If you remember the series the ship and bases interiors were the most important part of the episodes and many episodes were made around them.You can have defend or capture submissions were you defend or try to capture key parts of a ship.You can have submissions were you are trying to find a saboteur or a spy among the ships or base personell.You can talk with your crewmates and various nps on your ship and bases for the events that took around sto's world.As you progress in the game and the situation changes the conversations and news of the crew and nps's will change to reflect that change in the world.
You can have the classical find and fetch submissions to help someone or try to fix something.You can have submissions on the holodeck were you are going to go with various crew members.For example depending who your crew personell are and who you talk more you could go try virtual submissions with them.You can have a huge continuasly updated trek libraly that could be assesed from withing the ships computer for example.And depending when you go to places like the 10 forward you could meet and make additional crew personel or passengers you could talk and again eventually do submissions in the holodeck or with other crew personell.For example go play a few rounds of poker and simiral subgames...

All in all there are countless of things you could do with interiors if they were added

[knightofhyrule730]

starbase interiors are still in the game...it was talked about in one of the NYCC interviews. they want us to be able to hang out somewhere, and places like ds9 are going to be that place.

[Loekii]

I'd like to see what evidence there is that we will ever get any ship interiors besides missions.

I keep seeing words like "promise" and "how long" wonder where people get this stuff.

I'd like to see what evidence there is that we will ever get any ship interiors besides missions.

What sort of evidence are you looking for? I think the dev statements are indicative of their intent. Granted that is not a guarantee, but neither is STO being launched either.

[KO_Gilligan]

What sort of evidence are you looking for? I think the dev statements are indicative of their intent. Granted that is not a guarantee, but neither is STO being launched either.

Link please

[KO_Gilligan]

No they are removed for the moment my friend.Also not only ship interiors were removed but also star bases interiors.Many people refer that there will be instanced ship interiors for the missions but they make it sound like there will be star bases interiors for everything.That is not true.Star bases interiors will also be only for instanced missions.
Full scale interiors are one of the things on the planning list but it is not confirmed or written in stone and also there is no any confirmed date for their addition.

But the most important thing is that interiors are very important for the actual gameplay.
If you remember the series the ship and bases interiors were the most important part of the episodes and many episodes were made around them.You can have defend or capture submissions were you defend or try to capture key parts of a ship.You can have submissions were you are trying to find a saboteur or a spy among the ships or base personell.You can talk with your crewmates and various nps on your ship and bases for the events that took around sto's world.As you progress in the game and the situation changes the conversations and news of the crew and nps's will change to reflect that change in the world.
You can have the classical find and fetch submissions to help someone or try to fix something.You can have submissions on the holodeck were you are going to go with various crew members.For example depending who your crew personell are and who you talk more you could go try virtual submissions with them.You can have a huge continuasly updated trek libraly that could be assesed from withing the ships computer for example.And depending when you go to places like the 10 forward you could meet and make additional crew personel or passengers you could talk and again eventually do submissions in the holodeck or with other crew personell.For example go play a few rounds of poker and simiral subgames...

All in all there are countless of things you could do with interiors if they were added

Have you played any? No, Really.

Because MP Role Play has been available in the many maps of EF and EFII. I know of only a handful of people who do it. They are the ones who actually recognize the failure of your idea because of how difficult it is to organize. I have played RP missions on board game ships, even with more task stations it's a bit too pretendish to keep members active.

Additionally, we have TCW to look forward to, and they can't get help on their project. It has enormous Role Play potential but how often has it even been mentioned on our boards? Your idea of RPG is overrated and not popular. Cryptics idea of RPG has form and function, and will have the dynamics for continued play.
Besides being plagued by the details of what Interiors will actually do to the gameplay dynamic, it has historically not been very popular.

Cryptic made the right choice by letting us individually fly around the galaxy and walk around on planets as the primary play elements. They will have to add your mini-games map later. Anything else would be wrought with problems.

[OddjobXL]

I love my PoB in SWG. My crew loves my PoB in SWG. My guild loves my crew which loves my PoB in SWG. They work, they're fun. If only there were anything, anything at all, to do with them. STO seems to have a great universe but no PoBs (yet). Can someone do a Reese's please? I'd like my SWG PoB in STO's universe! Hey, it's not like a YT-1300 never made a guest appearance before.*

The key here really is to try and be reasonable. I realize that ship, if you'll pardon the pun, may have sailed already on rational discussion but I'm going to give it a whirl.

All we really need, all the vasty wide public really remembers, of Star Trek combat is the crazy antics on the bridge. We need Red Alert! We need crewmembers reacting to orders or bouncing around when something hits! We need panels blowing out! We need medics patching up the wounded on the floor!

That old cliche image is what distinguishes Star Trek's space combat from Star Wars or anything else. It's a punchline in SNL and Living Color and Second City comedy skits. Everyone knows this.

We need the bridge and the bridge crew. Whether it's player or nonplayer, at first, this is one of those iconic elements you can't lose. Make it optional, make it so people don't have to worry about it, but it had better be in there for people looking for something they recognize. Recognition is a key element in satisfying expectations when working with a franchise and this, baby, is one of those things that makes Star Trek, Star Trek.

Now I know some people would like to see the entirety of a ship rendered or at least relevant chunks of it. To those people I say, don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Focus on what's practical. Focus on what's essential to the experience.

One day, in a perfect world, we may have some parts of some ships rendered out fully. The best way it's going to happen in a manner that's both acceptable to the fans and practical for Cryptic is to seriously, seriously, consider mod friendly art. Perhaps have oversight, if there are restrictions from Paramount, but allow players to submit interior skins and art. You know they can do it. You know they'd love doing it. And with oversight and standards they'd do it well.

This wouldn't be novel. Pirates of the Burning Sea has a community of players that spend more time building ships and designing flags than they do actually playing the game. Why not tap into this? Star Trek singleplayer games have armies of modders out there. Let them help shape this experience, an experience that we'll all still be a part of ten or twenty years from now.

But for right now let's be reasonable people. On one hand, players need to solo and not have an overly complex time of it with the interface. On the other hand, the people who will stick with a Star Trek product because it is a Star Trek product are a safer bet to make this game a cash cow than people coming for any other reason. I'd tap into that power, if I were Cryptic, and let it fill my sails. These people want their ships and they want to be the crew on them. So do I and I'm no Trekkie (but I may get there yet).

*Check out the easter egg flyby in the battle of Sector 001 from First Contact! Some ILM special effects joker stuck the Millenium Falcon in there!

[Loekii]

Link please

Sorry, I had thought you had seen them.

Here is one for example, from the HailingFrequency Interview with Craig Z - http://hailingfrequency.co.uk/boards/index.php?topic=1458.0:

CZ: At launch, we are probably only going to have ship interiors available during mission instances, however we hope to add the ability to players to freely walk around their ship and host gatherings in an expansion pack.

Again, not a guarantee, but certainly an expression of intent.

[KO_Gilligan]

Sorry, I had thought you had seen them.

Here is one for example, from the HailingFrequency Interview with Craig Z - http://hailingfrequency.co.uk/boards/index.php?topic=1458.0:


Again, not a guarantee, but certainly an expression of intent.

It is consistant with what they have said from the beginning - and you should know better - I never left this discussion - pretty much seen it all :D

CZ: At launch, we are probably only going to have ship interiors available during mission instances, however we hope to add the ability to players to freely walk around their ship and host gatherings in an expansion pack.

It clearly does not even indicate they are even working on the idea. Like I said, it is still just up for consideration, and it is just a socializing environment, not an operational one. They have never even said they would do it, or that if they do, that it would come anytime soon. Could be very low on the priority list from what was said... Hopefully it's not coming before they add Horta first :p

[KO_Gilligan]

I love my PoB in SWG. My crew loves my PoB in SWG. My guild loves my crew which loves my PoB in SWG. They work, they're fun. If only there were anything, anything at all, to do with them. STO seems to have a great universe but no PoBs (yet). Can someone do a Reese's please? I'd like my SWG PoB in STO's universe! Hey, it's not like a YT-1300 never made a guest appearance before.*

The key here really is to try and be reasonable. I realize that ship, if you'll pardon the pun, may have sailed already on rational discussion but I'm going to give it a whirl.

All we really need, all the vasty wide public really remembers, of Star Trek combat is the crazy antics on the bridge. We need Red Alert! We need crewmembers reacting to orders or bouncing around when something hits! We need panels blowing out! We need medics patching up the wounded on the floor!

That old cliche image is what distinguishes Star Trek's space combat from Star Wars or anything else. It's a punchline in SNL and Living Color and Second City comedy skits. Everyone knows this.

We need the bridge and the bridge crew. Whether it's player or nonplayer, at first, this is one of those iconic elements you can't lose. Make it optional, make it so people don't have to worry about it, but it had better be in there for people looking for something they recognize. Recognition is a key element in satisfying expectations when working with a franchise and this, baby, is one of those things that makes Star Trek, Star Trek.

Now I know some people would like to see the entirety of a ship rendered or at least relevant chunks of it. To those people I say, don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. Focus on what's practical. Focus on what's essential to the experience.

One day, in a perfect world, we may have some parts of some ships rendered out fully. The best way it's going to happen in a manner that's both acceptable to the fans and practical for Cryptic is to seriously, seriously, consider mod friendly art. Perhaps have oversight, if there are restrictions from Paramount, but allow players to submit interior skins and art. You know they can do it. You know they'd love doing it. And with oversight and standards they'd do it well.

This wouldn't be novel. Pirates of the Burning Sea has a community of players that spend more time building ships and designing flags than they do actually playing the game. Why not tap into this? Star Trek singleplayer games have armies of modders out there. Let them help shape this experience, an experience that we'll all still be a part of ten or twenty years from now.

But for right now let's be reasonable people. On one hand, players need to solo and not have an overly complex time of it with the interface. On the other hand, the people who will stick with a Star Trek product because it is a Star Trek product are a safer bet to make this game a cash cow than people coming for any other reason. I'd tap into that power, if I were Cryptic, and let it fill my sails. These people want their ships and they want to be the crew on them. So do I and I'm no Trekkie (but I may get there yet).

*Check out the easter egg flyby in the battle of Sector 001 from First Contact! Some ILM special effects joker stuck the Millenium Falcon in there!


So far the Interiors they have envisioned will not function as a multiplayer action element yet... the Red Alert Scenario and how the outside of the ship relates to the world at large is probably the two largest paradox's we have yet to overcome.

[Loekii]

Again, it is their intent - not a guarantee - which is much more than 'considering'.

Had it just be something they were considering, they would have said exactly that.

[KO_Gilligan]

Again, it is their intent - not a guarantee - which is much more than 'considering'.

Had it just be something they were considering, they would have said exactly that.

If it was their intent, they wouldn't just say "we would like to add interiors for socializing"

An intent is a plan - what part looks like more than just "considering" to you?
But you obviously have a thing for semantics since you minced my words and said it wasn't evidence, it was "indicative" :eek:

But while we're on about wording, did you notice that the majority of people hear are still ignoring the wording about interiors NOT being an actual gameplay mechanic, it will just be a gathering place? How many people will cry foul after this expansion comes out.... and again cry out "YOU PROMISED" :rolleyes:

[KnightofKhonshu]

Interiors not important for game. Except Brig to put whiney trolls in. Life support optional.

[Loekii]

Here is another example where they specifically express their intent:

http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-online-cryptic-meet-greet-nyc-comic-con-2009/

Watch Video #2 and at ~1:45 you see him say:
...as for interiors of your ship...as a social area...we do want to make it you so you have your own private space...bridge, ready room.....will it be at launch or update there after...I want to have your TOS bridge, etc....its all about the customization....

Again, not a guarantee, just exploration, PvP, Neutral zones, and any other aspect of the game is not guaranteed.

[Loekii]

If it was their intent, they wouldn't just say "we would like to add interiors for socializing"

An intent is a plan - what part looks like more than just "considering" to you?
But you obviously have a thing for semantics since you minced my words and said it wasn't evidence, it was "indicative" :eek:

But while we're on about wording, did you notice that the majority of people hear are still ignoring the wording about interiors NOT being an actual gameplay mechanic, it will just be a gathering place? How many people will cry foul after this expansion comes out.... and again cry out "YOU PROMISED" :rolleyes:

How about you stop posting misinformation.

You said there is not information that Interiors will ever be added. I provided TWO links where the devs have clearly stated their desires for ship interiors, and their desire to add them post launch -- the 2nd even going into detail.

[Miniv]

Can you stop going on about interiors? its like all you want to do is run around ten forward, you dont actually want to play the game at all. OK if you arnt going to buy the game because interiors arnt in the game yet and might not be for the forseeable future after launch then dont! You dont have to go on the forums all the time saying to cryptic you wont buy your ONE copy of the game unless they add this.

[KO_Gilligan]

How about you stop posting misinformation.

You said there is not information that Interiors will ever be added. I provided TWO links where the devs have clearly stated their desires for ship interiors, and their desire to add them post launch -- the 2nd even going into detail.

You are clearly on a foolhardy pusuit.

The information does not say that interiors will ever be added. The information clearly says that they are considering interiors, and to what extent.

Now you are accusing me of what? Because your word twist is an argument that implies that I said they wouldn't be added. I clearly said nothing like that. I have provided no information that there wouldn't be interiors, you have provided nothing that there will certainly be, quote it if you think I'm wrong.

I have a desire to lose 30lbs, you know the desire now, you even know the amount.

I will play your word game with you if you want...

I have not promised to my wife that I will indeed lose 30lbs. But she knows I desire it. She could even assume I plan to diet, although she has no evidence of my diet plans. Now if my wife tells me "you promised, now when will it happen?" Can she claim I was actually planning it? Even more importantly and to the point, did I tell her " IT WILL HAPPEN" , and break a promise if it doesn't? Can she even say I changed my diet plan? Maybe I'm not planning it, and expecting exercise later will help me do it.

Maybe..... Just maybe..... Cryptic wants to beta and further consider the potential of extra social areas.
Gee that's a bit of a no-brainer - eh?
Did you answer my question about Interiors as social areas only?
did you notice that the majority of people hear are still ignoring the wording about interiors NOT being an actual gameplay mechanic, it will just be a gathering place?

You speak of misinformation, but I know who's throwing around the empty promises, and it aint Cryptic.

[KO_Gilligan]

...as for interiors of your ship...as a social area...we do want to make it you so you have your own private space...bridge, ready room.....will it be at launch or update there after.(HERE IS A MISSING" we're looking at that right now " MISSING INFORMATION INDICATING NOTHING ACTUALLY PLANNED YET)..I want to have your TOS bridge, etc....its all about the customization....

This transcript is misinformation it is missing the we don't know statements that further enunciate the "We want to" statement.

There is absolutely nothing that says it will be either at launch or after... the video supports my position.

You now misquote the developers themselves.

Nice job

[_Pax_]

I can't get behind people who are registered on these forums criticizing every little detail that doesn't fit with their 'Perfect' Star Trek Online experience. The game will cater for the many, not the few. Get over it.
D'OH!!

Why didn't I remember the famouse line from Spock: "The needs of the many outweight the needs of the few, or the one."

As some work has already been done on interiors (for missions only or otherwise), I would say that perhaps Cryptic will release them within perhaps 6months of initial release? I have no evidence to back that up it's just my opinion from looking at the screenies :)
I'd say the probability of getting this feature, depending on timeframe, would be best summed up as::

Within 3 months - maybe (**), but I wouldn't bet money on it (it's a LOT fo work to get done in only three months)
In 3-6 months - possibly (***); up to half a year to design something sounds achievable - but I've no experience with designing such things, so I may be underestimating the amount of work involved.
In 6-9 months - probably (****). This is honestly the timeframe in which I expect this feature to arrive.
In 9-12 months - possibly (***), but it would surprise me if it took this long.
Over a year - unlikely (*); if it's at all possible, I doubt Cryptic will take this long to get it done.
NEVER - maybe (**); remember, there's ALWAYS a chance that it's just not POSSIBLE to design an interior space for every starship that actually DOES something within the game, something meaningful that will help keep us subscribers, well, subscribing.


:cool:

[_Pax_]

No they are removed for the moment my friend.
You cannot REMOVE what was NEVER THERE TO BEGIN WITH.

I do not have a third arm. Therefor, I cannot REMOVE my third arm.

All in all there are countless of things you could do with interiors if they were added
And the majority of what you list, will be part of STO at launch, because they will only occur within the scope of DURING. A. MISSION. Which means, within a mission instance.

[Loekii]

I'd like to see what evidence there is that we will ever get any ship interiors besides missions.


What sort of evidence are you looking for? I think the dev statements are indicative of their intent. Granted that is not a guarantee, but neither is STO being launched either.

Link please

Sorry, I had thought you had seen them.

Here is one for example, from the HailingFrequency Interview with Craig Z - http://hailingfrequency.co.uk/boards/index.php?topic=1458.0:


Again, not a guarantee, but certainly an expression of intent.
Here is another example where they specifically express their intent:

http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-online-cryptic-meet-greet-nyc-comic-con-2009/

Watch Video #2 and at ~1:45 you see him say:


Again, not a guarantee, just exploration, PvP, Neutral zones, and any other aspect of the game is not guaranteed.


How about this, instead of posting 'your opinion' on the matter, just post the two links I provided of the actual Developer's comments, and let the readers decide for themselves?


http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-online-cryptic-meet-greet-nyc-comic-con-2009/
http://hailingfrequency.co.uk/boards/index.php?topic=1458.0:

[KO_Gilligan]

D'OH!!


In 6-9 months - probably (****). This is honestly the timeframe in which I expect this feature to arrive.
:cool:

Very nice... I agree

Now, may I consult the mighty oracle of likely scenarios ( _Pax_ ) about this bit of mysterious prose:


We expect at launch that we will stick to mainly humanoids or bipedal but it doesn’t stop us from introducing new tail or legs, but don’t expect to get that Horta right at day one.

When do you estimate I can have a Horta on my crew?

[Traveller]

if there in I'll PLAY
if there not I'll PLAY
as simple as that really

[KO_Gilligan]

How about this, instead of posting 'your opinion' on the matter, just post the two links I provided of the actual Developer's comments, and let the readers decide for themselves?


[/LIST]

My words were forged from the flames of "promises" claimed, they were quenched and hardened by the truth.
Do not expect them to now bend.

You could ask the others not to claim Cryptic promised interiors though. Since they are lying, maybe they won't be as stubborn about the truth as I am.

[_Pax_]

When do you estimate I can have a Horta on my crew?

... "sometime before the heat-death of the universe".

Generally, for ANY non-humanoid species ... I'd have to know more about how Cryptic handles emotes and eanimations in the new engine, to know how difficult it would (in my already admittedly-non-expert opinion) be to make non-humanoid characters a feasible possibility. The original engine has troubles just with a digitigrade stance, but still humanoid, model (the knees have to stay in the same place due to the skeleton on which animations are based - as a result, all digitigrade characters are horribly over-balanced towards their own front).

In the specific case of the Horta, though? I think the answer comes down to "Never." Seriously - they don't even have the ability to manipulate tools; I doubt many (if ANY) of them serve aboard starships. On extended missions to specific planets, sure - especially as the lead construction crew for bases on airless or toxic-atmosphere planets: they can carve out a series of tunnels and chambers, just by eating.

But, as crew aboard a starship, as I said ... I sincerely doubt it will ever come to pass, I'm sorry.

However, getting back to "nonhumanoids" in general ... I can see the possibility of a centaroid model, or non-humanoid insectform model, being made available in the future. Possibly as micro-expansion-pack material ("Pay $5US, and you can make crew with 4 or 6 legs" sorts of things), or hopefully as a free update.

I'd think that nonhumanoid PC models would be fairly low prrority though - after all, how many nonhumanoids do YOU recall seeing in a Starfleet uniform, onscreen during a TV episode or Film? So, um ... at a blind guess, add 6 or even 12 months to all the estimates above ...?

[Loekii]

Again, it is really simple.

When someone asks about what has been said about interiors, just provide these two links:

http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-...omic-con-2009/
http://hailingfrequency.co.uk/boards...?topic=1458.0:

and let them decide for themselves.

[KO_Gilligan]

if there in I'll PLAY
if there not I'll PLAY
as simple as that really

Cryptic is definitely leaning on beta to see how people play, and they have stated as such.

It's when the rubber meets the road on the interior issue. If social areas are highly popular in beta, I believe an interior for customizing and socializing will be an element that they will then consider as absolutely necessary.

So in other words, if you're in Beta, and want customizable ship interiors for your friends to visit, you will be noticed in the dynamics of your social interaction. For me this is a huge dynamic for them to try considering... we really don't know if these people screaming for interiors are the type of social butterflies that the social version of interiors will provide.

I'm leaning towards acknowledging the fact that people want playable interiors, not a customizable recreation room.

[_Pax_]

Loekii, KO isn't really saying "we'll NEVER get interiors" ... what he's saying - and he's RIGHT - is that Cryptic never PROMISED interiors. They want to do them, but again they make no promises.

And IMO, I agree with him when his hackles rise at someone saying "they promised us interiors", because that sets up the playerbase for a possible MASSIVE disapointment ... and sets up Cryptic for an undeserved sh*tstorm of accusations and recriminations, if they don't deliver on their non-existant promise (being called LIARS, for example).

[Profedius]

I don’t see them adding all areas of the ships so that you could spend hours roaming the inside of your ship. I see bridge, captain’s ready room, captain’s quarters, engineering and something like ten forward. I don’t see a whole lot in the way of function for these areas since you will want to be able to control your ship from the main interface.

I would hope they have the star base interiors done at launch and it isn’t like Eve where you dock and an overlay screen comes up with all the things you can do at the star base. The first time I docked at a star base in Eve and saw the screen come up I shut down the game went to the website and canceled my account.

[Loekii]

Loekii, KO isn't really saying "we'll NEVER get interiors" ... what he's saying - and he's RIGHT - is that Cryptic never PROMISED interiors. They want to do them, but again they make no promises.

And IMO, I agree with him when his hackles rise at someone saying "they promised us interiors", because that sets up the playerbase for a possible MASSIVE disapointment ... and sets up Cryptic for an undeserved sh*tstorm of accusations and recriminations, if they don't deliver on their non-existant promise (being called LIARS, for example).

That is not what I have as him saying - see post 89 - http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=410208&postcount=89. He asked for a link to where they have 'expressed intent to include interiors', not 'where did they PROMISE to include interiors'. Also notice how I not only never said 'promised or guarenteed', but I also repeatedly clarified that it in fact was not a guarantee.

I don't see too many people even claiming that they 'promised' interiors, nor people expressing doubt that we will see the typical accusations (Cryptic Lied, they promised, etc).

Again, the better thing to do is to simply post the Dev Links for the persons to read/view for themselves. Links are always better than just posting opinions when it comes to discussing what the devs have stated.

[KO_Gilligan]

I'd think that nonhumanoid PC models would be fairly low prrority though - after all, how many nonhumanoids do YOU recall seeing in a Starfleet uniform, onscreen during a TV episode or Film? So, um ... at a blind guess, add 6 or even 12 months to all the estimates above ...?

I remember when Jack probably made a little boo boo in this regard when he offered that we would have Tholians :eek: ... I wonder if he thought about fitting a Tholian on his Biped character mesh, or if he just forgot Tholians don't have two legs :p

[Loekii]

I'd think that nonhumanoid PC models would be fairly low prrority though - after all, how many nonhumanoids do YOU recall seeing in a Starfleet uniform, onscreen during a TV episode or Film? So, um ... at a blind guess, add 6 or even 12 months to all the estimates above ...?

I think their biggest obstacles is to making sure that nonhumanoid models fit/interact properly with the existing artwork/world. Just as an illustrative example, there is an obvious difference between how a Biped and Polyped would 'sit' in a command chair -- or if there objects that might 'hang' a Polyped player model (ie narrow passage, etc). And that is assuming that the physics are no more difficult than the standard Biped models.

[_Pax_]

Aaaaaah, he said Tholians, did he? I wonder if he saw the ENT episodes with 'em or not.

Prior to those ENT episodes, there was no canonical data to indicate that they weren't bipedal humanoids. Only with those episodes did we see anythign of the tholians except their faces, their ships, and their wonderful, glorious Web technology. (Remember, in SFB, I am the Tholian fan, heh).

And, even then: that's easier to achieve (humanoid torso/head/arms, more than two legs) than, say ...the at best vaguely humanoid-stance-capable (but by no means ACTUALLY humanoid) Sathar (http://starfrontiers.wikia.com/wiki/Sathar), from the game Star Frontiers.

[KO_Gilligan]

That is not what I have as him saying - see post above. He asked for a link to where they have 'expressed intent to include interiors', not 'where did they PROMISE to include interiors'. Also notice how I not only never said 'promised or guarenteed', but I also repeatedly clarified that it in fact was not a guarantee.

I don't see too many people even claiming that they 'promised' interiors, nor people expressing doubt that we will see the typical accusations (Cryptic Lied, they promised, etc).

There were some right here in this thread before I said anything.

To me there is a mile of difference between the growing misinformation crowd that says "planning" or "promised",

and what I've said all along:

They would like to - it's a good idea - it's an idea that has priority over other ideas - but there is absolutely no promise that they are even working on anything more than considering it.

But you won't quote me and put it into context, so I again ask: what are you accusing me of? Asking for links? Your links added nothing to your platform.

[KO_Gilligan]

Aaaaaah, he said Tholians, did he? I wonder if he saw the ENT episodes with 'em or not.

Prior to those ENT episodes, there was no canonical data to indicate that they weren't bipedal humanoids. Only with those episodes did we see anythign of the tholians except their faces, their ships, and their wonderful, glorious Web technology. (Remember, in SFB, I am the Tholian fan, heh).

And, even then: that's easier to achieve (humanoid torso/head/arms, more than two legs) than, say ...the at best vaguely humanoid-stance-capable (but by no means ACTUALLY humanoid) Sathar (http://starfrontiers.wikia.com/wiki/Sathar), from the game Star Frontiers.

Makes me wonder if he knew something about the character creator that will allow non-biped, with symetrical humanoid upper bodies. Maybe it's not limited to "tails"

[Loekii]

There were some right here in this thread before I said anything.

To me there is a mile of difference between the growing misinformation crowd that says "planning" or "promised",

and what I've said all along:

They would like to - it's a good idea - it's an idea that has priority over other ideas - but there is absolutely no promise that they are even working on anything more than considering it.

But you won't quote me and put it into context, so I again ask: what are you accusing me of? Asking for links? Your links added nothing to your platform.

http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=410208&postcount=89

It is pretty clear. quotes in order and everything. Wanna post the 'missing' quotes that supposedly were omitted?

It is really simple. You stated that there is no evidence of player interiors being in the game, I posted two Dev Quotes demonstrating their plans to include them, and you claim that is not evidence.

Rather than demanding that your opinion is 'correct', how about just letting posters look at the Dev links and let them decide for themselves, or are Dev links invalid unless they have your commentary? :rolleyes:

[KO_Gilligan]

http://forums.startrekonline.com/showpost.php?p=410208&postcount=89

It is pretty clear. quotes in order and everything. Wanna post the 'missing' quotes that supposedly were omitted?

It is really simple. You stated that there is no evidence of player interiors being in the game, I posted two Dev Quotes demonstrating their plans to include them, and you claim that is not evidence.

Rather than demanding that your opinion is 'correct', how about just letting posters look at the Dev links and let them decide for themselves, or are Dev links invalid unless they have your commentary? :rolleyes:


...as for interiors of your ship...as a social area...we do want to make it you so you have your own private space...bridge, ready room.....will it be at launch or update there after.(HERE IS A MISSING" we're looking at that right now " MISSING INFORMATION INDICATING NOTHING ACTUALLY PLANNED YET)..I want to have your TOS bridge, etc....its all about the customization....

I did already, and I put it in bright blue...and now I just did again.

Now you want to say I'm misinforming people because I oppose what you call "plans" and I call "Considering it" - they are not plans or promises, they are considering it. Your spam of links does not impress me, but it clearly shows people they are not, and will not promise anything. Just seeing how the impromptu response had them reaching for words to indicate they are not promising anything at this time - makes me absolutely 100% sure you are riding with the promise pushers and spamming misinformation.

How exactly are they "planning"? What is your definition of planning?
You clearly imply that interiors are coming, and they are planning that. I clearly state that they have made no actual release of interiors planned but are considering it.
and never shall the two positions meet - no matter how you try to twist this up, or ignore my pretty light blue transcript corrections.

Go beat your zealots drum against people using the word promise, if you are in such pursuit of truth.

[KO_Gilligan]

I don't mind not having places like sick bay and engineering ect.... but what i really hope Cryptic does is at least get an interior for your Bridge up and running which you can custom build. I really want to be able to experience the game from sitting in my captains chair with the option of changing the camera view to the exterior of my ship when i want.
I want to be able to see the crew i have spent time creating actually doing their jobs on the bridge, not just seeing them on away missions ect..

I think that this should be put in the first "expansion" which i would imagine will be released within the first 6 months of the game being released as this is surely something that most people want plus i would think that it would get the interest of new players as well.

They need to take as long as they need I do not wont to have it in the game if it don't work right.

These two posts sum up what many of the posts in this thread and others indicate.

I have said all along that simply wanting interiors is not common ground. They are considering a customizable social area at this point.

... and I said considering it for a very important reason. What if people (like the posts above, and many others) will reject a customizable social area... considering it nothing but a quick gimmick, and not being anything like they were asking for.

Seems like from what we have heard from Cryptic, this is why the dynamic for a social area is still up in the air. Seems that people are still confusing it with a playable bridge.

[OrabIbo]

It took years for LucasArts to release JTL and add space and ship interiors. It is a big feat for Cryptic to get out both ground and space gameplay at launch, but the sacrifice is the lack of ship interiors, and starbase interiors, altough it appears we will get DS9 at launch.

EVE Online has promised interiors for stations for years, yet no progress has been made.

I would be willing to wait 5 months of less for an expansion or content update to add ship interiors and station interiors. And I want the ship interiors to be comprehensive, not just the bridge and ready room. I want the decks and corridors and all the rooms.

Lowering our standards now are we? Now your willing to play the game still if they add it later rather at launch? I think you will eventually play with the rest of us ;)

But anyway, SWG it only took 1.5 years for JtL to come out. And there really wasn't that many interiors to make. Most of their ships were small fighter type ships. So the interior of a TIE fighter was anything but glamorous! LOL There were only a handful of ships that had interiors you could walk around in. And still are.

EvE is well, EvE. Small company doing the best they can with what they got. It's like rooting for the underdog. They are really offering a value to their customers with what they add to the game and not asking for ppl to purchase additional expansions to boost income. They just let you have it for free, as "Thanks for playing!"

Dwelling on this only makes it "feel" like it's taking longer.

I would be fine if it took them 2yrs if they do a good job on it! Make it interactive and add other components like Viewscreens for Hails, interactive consoles, damage inside the ship when under attack etc...

If it's just a hollow shell to walk around in, then is that really what the majority of us are asking for?
If all we do is walk around to experience the inside of an interior and it has no purpose that really effects gameplay. Then why would ppl use it for anything but roleplaying?

I think it would be nice if repairs could be done faster if you work on it manually. Rather than just assign your crew to do it for you. Granted your the Captain, and all you should do is sit in your captains chair and give orders. But how fun is that? If you followed the rulebook, as captain we shouldn't even go on Away teams! but we all know thats not going to happen. So I'm sure some aspects of Trek will be bent.

[wootage]

i dont mind if they add it 3 years from now.
it will take a long time to design interior for every ship and who knows what else will be added they just dont have the time to make them and all the content needed for a launch and bug fix/ test it all.

i rather play the game with out interiors then to wait till spring 2011so i can walk around in my ship at launch

i for sure wont have time to walk around my ship for more then 5min in the first 6 months of the game.

i got places to explore ,missions to do and people to kill.

ofc when i warp to a system and it will take 10min to get there if you dont use the transwarp then yeah i hope they add the officer poker den so i got something to do for 10min

Actually, you'd probably make them by ship class for each race, and there's not a huge set of areas to make- like a couple dozen or so. Customization could be done at the introduction - what color do you want this or that, what art do you want hanging around, what furnishing style for each area, etc.

And boom, you're done. Add some sitting or lounging animations and people can hang out in orbit and beam around to each other's ships. And your bridge crew could be hanging around socializing too.

Add some functional consoles for galaxy-wide news, information, etc., and it'd be pretty cozy.

Edit: add the ability to watch other people's ships within sensor range, and it'd be really cool!

[ZappBrannigan]

I don't mind not having places like sick bay and engineering ect.... but what i really hope Cryptic does is at least get an interior for your Bridge up and running which you can custom build. I really want to be able to experience the game from sitting in my captains chair with the option of changing the camera view to the exterior of my ship when i want.
I want to be able to see the crew i have spent time creating actually doing their jobs on the bridge, not just seeing them on away missions ect..

I think that this should be put in the first "expansion" which i would imagine will be released within the first 6 months of the game being released as this is surely something that most people want plus i would think that it would get the interest of new players as well.

My thoughts exactly.

[Loekii]

Lowering our standards now are we? Now your willing to play the game still if they add it later rather at launch? I think you will eventually play with the rest of us ;)

But anyway, SWG it only took 1.5 years for JtL to come out. And there really wasn't that many interiors to make. Most of their ships were small fighter type ships. So the interior of a TIE fighter was anything but glamorous! LOL There were only a handful of ships that had interiors you could walk around in. And still are.

EvE is well, EvE. Small company doing the best they can with what they got. It's like rooting for the underdog. They are really offering a value to their customers with what they add to the game and not asking for ppl to purchase additional expansions to boost income. They just let you have it for free, as "Thanks for playing!"

Dwelling on this only makes it "feel" like it's taking longer.

I would be fine if it took them 2yrs if they do a good job on it! Make it interactive and add other components like Viewscreens for Hails, interactive consoles, damage inside the ship when under attack etc...

If it's just a hollow shell to walk around in, then is that really what the majority of us are asking for?
If all we do is walk around to experience the inside of an interior and it has no purpose that really effects gameplay. Then why would ppl use it for anything but roleplaying?

I think it would be nice if repairs could be done faster if you work on it manually. Rather than just assign your crew to do it for you. Granted your the Captain, and all you should do is sit in your captains chair and give orders. But how fun is that? If you followed the rulebook, as captain we shouldn't even go on Away teams! but we all know thats not going to happen. So I'm sure some aspects of Trek will be bent.

I think Cryptics past performance is an indication of how they will handle STO. They added missing content in their other games about 2 months (not 2 years, or even 1 year) after launch. So there is a potential that Ship interiors could appear within the first 6 months of retail. It sounds like it is simply a matter of getting it done to their satisfaction, rather than some marketing ploy to get sales of some expansion.

[Trekkie]

Honestly, as long as the game that is released at launch is fun to play and has enough in it to keep me content for some time, I am willing to wait as long as necessary for ship interiors. Obviously, I am looking forward to ship interiors -- perhaps more than almost any other aspect of the game -- but I don't think that not having them will prove to be a downfall for the game or anything like that. That being said, I would like them to be a top priority, but as long as they are released within the first year or so after the game launches I will be perfectly content.

[theexplorer1]

So far the Interiors they have envisioned will not function as a multiplayer action element yet... the Red Alert Scenario and how the outside of the ship relates to the world at large is probably the two largest paradox's we have yet to overcome.

though it sounds difficult and probably needs a lot of programming it can be done.It was done both in swg and especially in sw battlefront 1,2(Were it was done really really well).You could fight in a huge star destroyer while a huge battle was been fought all around you and between you and the other ships.You could look from the windows the enemy attacks and the
defence and attack blasts from your ship.And if you ship got destroyed so everyone that was inside friend of foe.(Unless you were fast enought to fly with a tie fighter or a xwing from the hangars while the ship got blown into oblivion...

In any case it can be done if your ship is treated as a vechicle and this is where the problem lies.The coh engine even though is updated in 2.0 version cannot handle actual vechicles.It can have vechicles as characters if you can get what i mean by that.Your ship what you are flying is actually a character by itself...

They must modify the engine so they can have moving buildings (the ships) with characters inside them indepentently...

[Silverspar]

It was done in SWG, over a year later. It was done in Battlefront because it was essentially an RTS. Finally, again, you need to really stop with your mis-information of there not going to be interioros at launch when the very screenshots on this site prove you wrong, not to mention at least Craig saying, on four occassions off the top of my head, that starbase and instance mission ship interiors were in.

[theexplorer1]

You cannot REMOVE what was NEVER THERE TO BEGIN WITH.

I do not have a third arm. Therefor, I cannot REMOVE my third arm.


And the majority of what you list, will be part of STO at launch, because they will only occur within the scope of DURING. A. MISSION. Which means, within a mission instance.

Pax i know that you don't like me but at least on some things be honest and don't try to sidestep from some things please.
Initially there were supposed to be interiors.Remember the Vegas convention were Leonard Nemoy presented the game to fans ? And many many fans asked a lot of questions about the game...Remember were one of the fans asks if it would be possible to pvp other players when he wants to and if he would have the choice to go aboard an enemy ship he is fighting and try to capture it by fighting from the inside?He was told he would not be able to actually try to capture the ship by himself but he would be able to choose to send crewmates to capture it and that the interior would be there to explore and show off your ship to other players.

At that point the interiors were part of the game.
And coming to your second arqument about the things i said you could do while you are in the interior of your ship or star base.
Is it the same to be able to explore randomly your ship before or after a major mission and hear or talk with people for the outcomes of the missions or their concerns about the upcoming mission ? Yes while you play a instanced mission there could be scenes like that but they would be very constrained and scripted were in a full modeled interior you could have thousands of lines of dialog and hundreds of crewmates.You could even have additional crewmates transfering to your ship to cover your dead or sick crewmates.This was done on many older games before and it really added to the game as it gave you a motive to stick with your crew.Remember terranova?Or remember games like omicron the nomad soul ? Or deus ex for that matter or shenmue? They are all very different games but what they all done was have a explorable world that changed and adapted with your advancement of the game and it really made you feel like you were part of a real world were your actions had real concequences...

[Silverspar]

Initially there were supposed to be interiors. Remember the Vegas convention were Leonard Nemoy presented the game to fans?No such promise was made. The only thing remotely close to that was when Jack said sending repair crews to deck whatever it was or something of that nature, there was, in no way conceivable, a statement of interiors hinted at for your personal starship.

He was told he would not be able to actually try to capture the ship by himself but he would be able to choose to send crewmates to capture it and that the interior would be there to explore and show off your ship to other players.Because personal ship interiors are not going to be in at launch, instanced ship interiors are going to be there. Oops, you are still wrong. Wow, even the very website with fresh screenshots, statements on at least four seperate interviews from Craig, recent ones, and the STO trailer say you are wrong.

At that point the interiors were part of the game.Wrong. Interiors are there for instances and starbase interiors as well as outpost interiors. What we will not have is our own personal starship interiors, which people, like yourself, can't seem to get. The only interiors stated that would not appear at launch is personal ship, in being that you will not just randomly stop somewhere in space and be able to just walk around your ship or just walk around your own bridge. None of that was even promised, unlike what you keep thinking.

The second part of your post isn't even worth the time to try and dispute because it's just a wild flight of fancy that doesn't even begin to discuss a valid point.

[Trekster]

whatev about interiors, id rather have them spend quality time on exteriors and make ships uber for looking @ because honestly, whose ever gonna see the inside of my ship.

cap1~ "oh (other captain person)... want to beam over to my ship for a spot of tea?"

cap2~"sure!! may i bring my doctor, he has some awfully funny jokes about klingon bathroom habits!! har"

cap1~"righto! sounds like a great time!"

ugh. LaaaaaMe.

[Loekii]

Initially there were supposed to be interiors

For the most part, Nic is correct here.

Source: http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-online-cryptic-meet-greet-nyc-comic-con-2009/

Again, at about ~1:55 in the Comic Con Panel, Cryptic says "whether at launch or after....", which would indicate that at one point Cryptic was shooting to get the social interiors in. However, they have never 'promised', or 'guaranteed' that ship interiors would be in, nor what they may or may not entail.

As a side note, any game in development should never be considered 'Promised', 'guaranteed', etc, but rather should always be considered a 'work in progress' with the possibility of radical changes up to release. I would recommend that it is best to be prepared for things to change, regardless of how many times a Developer talks about a feature. Again, WAR is a current example, where they made sweeping changes a month or so from retail, to content that had been considered 'established' for a year.

In MMO Development, the phrase, 'Everything is Set in Mud' applies.

[-Rufus-]

Well, I hope at launch they have at least the bridge and ready room available, even if not customizable at that point. But then again, we don't know (at least I don't) about the interface yet ... maybe the bridge or the ready room isn't even necessary.

Eventually I'd like to be able to visit engineering, cargo bays, launch bays, and maybe some social area on my ship but I can live with it if its not in there at launch.

[_Pax_]

Pax i know that you don't like me but at least on some things be honest and don't try to sidestep from some things please.
I'm not sidestepping anything - but you are outright lying.

Initially there were supposed to be interiors.Remember the Vegas convention were Leonard Nemoy presented the game to fans ? And many many fans asked a lot of questions about the game...Remember were one of the fans asks if it would be possible to pvp other players when he wants to and if he would have the choice to go aboard an enemy ship he is fighting and try to capture it by fighting from the inside? He was told he would not be able to actually try to capture the ship by himself but he would be able to choose to send crewmates to capture it and that the interior would be there to explore and show off your ship to other players.
Sounds like "mission instance" interiors to me.

At that point the interiors were part of the game.
Wrong. They were at best part of the PLAN, nic ... but plans change. The game didn't even exist yet.

Again: you cannot remove what NEVER EXISTED.

Is it the same to be able to explore randomly your ship before or after a major mission and hear or talk with people for the outcomes of the missions or their concerns about the upcoming mission ?
The same as what, exactly?

Yes while you play a instanced mission there could be scenes like that but they would be very constrained and scripted were in a full modeled interior you could have thousands of lines of dialog and hundreds of crewmates.
... thousands of lines of dialog ...? THOUSANDSOF LINES ...?!?

Great. If that's what you want from shi interiors, I'll see you in 2052.

You obviously have absolutely NO conception of how much work that would entail. O_O

This was done on many older games before and it really added to the game as it gave you a motive to stick with your crew.Remember terranova?Or remember games like omicron the nomad soul ? Or deus ex for that matter or shenmue? They are all very different games but what they all done was have a explorable world that changed and adapted with your advancement of the game and it really made you feel like you were part of a real world were your actions had real concequences...
They were all SINGLE PLAYER games. And at least in Deus Ex - a game I enjoyed greatly, so, I remember it pretty well - no, the world really WASN'T that large, explorable, nor altered by your choices. Not in any significant way, at least.

[Silverspar]

Loekeli you might want to post a real link, not a dead link. You might want to also post the entire question and not an answer that can be substituted for anything. Furthermore, we already knew that the devs want to get personal ship interiors, however, nic is not correct as nic is busy spending his time spreading misinformation completely. nic isn't saying just ship interiors were scrapped, nic is saying all interiors were scrapped, which is completely false.

Mission instance interiors are in as well as well as starbase and outpost interiors as social hubs. Craig has already said that much. Personal ship interiors I know for a fact the devs have said they would like to put it in, but is unlikely to happen before launch.

[Braunbaer]

I can not believe this discussions isn't over, yet. And I can not believe that all of you are wasting your time discussing with nic. If he is not willing to rethink the known facts, fine, leave him alone. Maybe he is going to spread his misinformations much more and maybe it will confuse some new forum members - but, if these new visitors are really interessted in the game, they will start reading all the giving informations, they will have a look at the video and the screenshots and they will come up with their own conclusions.

Ignore nic. And, more important, you should ignore everyone else except the devs. There are too much discussions going on in this forum. Too much flaming, too much childish whining. The game isn't released, yet. There is no beta. We only saw one video, which is pretty old to say the truth. And the screenshots do not vary much. We all can see the developement in textures etc., okay. But we do not know anything about the GUI, we do not know anything about the combat system except lose phrases like "Ground combat will be fast and space combat, which will be slower, will be skill driven and not only item based.".

In fact, we don't know much about the game. All we know are concepts. Nobody knows how the game will feel. And nobody can imagine it! We have to wait till we get the first in-game action videos. There are alot of people who have to stop arguing about a game which isn't released. You do not know if or if not FULL interiors are going to enhance gameplay experience or whether they will be pretty much useless. I know that some of you are still arguing and telling us that interiors are important. But how can you say that if you haven't played the game? You can't! I repeat, because it is important. YOU CAN'T!

Some of you are expecting too much from STO. Some of you seem to except something like a Star Trek simulator. This is not going to happen. It is not going to happen because it is nearly impossible to do.

But I know one thing. Many of you seem to reject the need of thinking about the differences between single player games and MMOs. Many of you do know **** about game development or software development in general. Are you unwilling to see that not every feature some of you DEMAND won't be fun for the most of the community? Everyone in this community really has to realise that there are different tastes, different views what a Star Trek MMO has to look like and you have to realise that Cryptic HAS TO fullfill the needs of non Star Trek fans, too. That is way Cryptic is saying they want the game to be FUN. There is so much more in this sentence than most of you seem to realise. Cryptic has a hell of a job to fullfill the wishes of hardcore Trek fans and casual gamers. They have to develope a game with a Star Trek atmosphere, which is easy enough to access for non Trek fans. AND they have to do the math. Software development is expensive.

I am sick of all those useless discussions. WAIT till in-game videos are out, or the beta started. Wait till you played the game. Then you can start arguing and flaming. That is the advantage of a MMO. It is in development all the time, at least as long people are playing (and paying). Changes can be made. Changes will be made, because no MMO is perfect at the release.

I have no problem with threads about ideas for the game. Even if some of them are really far fetched and won't fit in a MMO, but in a single player game. What I really hate is that nearly every idea disussion gets out of control pretty fast. The flaming starts, the hatred. Trolls are making useless posts. People are unwilling to accept that some ideas are impracticable, others start smashing good ideas without a reason.

Most of the time I can't stand reading the replies to a new thread. I tend to read the first two or three posts, then I leave.

Oh and is it possible that some of you start reading posts before they reply? Many threads contain of so many pages, just because people repeat things which were already said (and of course, the discussions restart).

I do not say that discussing Cryptic ideas is a bad thing. BUT, the way it is done is wrong. And at some point, we all have to stop arguing. We can share our ideas, our hopes and our concerns. In the end, we have to wait and trust Cryptic.

No one forces you to play the game or pay a monthly fee. Some of you act like they have already paid a lot of money and start demanding stuff. None of you has the right to demand ANYTHING. You haven't paid for anything, yet.

Some of you know about the SW: TOR MMO. There was at least one comic released, yet. Free stuff. Everyone can access it. But many of the fans are smashing the done work. Why can't they just appreciate the free stuff they get? They don't have to like it. But some of them really hates the comic. But why? IT'S FOR FREE. And some of this behavior can be seen in this community. It's insane. It's immature.

Now start smashing me.

[djnattyd]

I can not believe this discussions isn't over, yet. And I can not believe that all of you are wasting your time discussing with nic. If he is not willing to rethink the known facts, fine, leave him alone. Maybe he is going to spread his misinformations much more and maybe it will confuse some new forum members - but, if these new visitors are really interessted in the game, they will start reading all the giving informations, they will have a look at the video and the screenshots and they will come up with their own conclusions.

Ignore nic. And, more important, you should ignore everyone else except the devs. There are too much discussions going on in this forum. Too much flaming, too much childish whining. The game isn't released, yet. There is no beta. We only saw one video, which is pretty old to say the truth. And the screenshots do not vary much. We all can see the developement in textures etc., okay. But we do not know anything about the GUI, we do not know anything about the combat system except lose phrases like "Ground combat will be fast and space combat, which will be slower, will be skill driven and not only item based.".

In fact, we don't know much about the game. All we know are concepts. Nobody knows how the game will feel. And nobody can imagine it! We have to wait till we get the first in-game action videos. There are alot of people who have to stop arguing about a game which isn't released. You do not know if or if not FULL interiors are going to enhance gameplay experience or whether they will be pretty much useless. I know that some of you are still arguing and telling us that interiors are important. But how can you say that if you haven't played the game? You can't! I repeat, because it is important. YOU CAN'T!

Some of you are expecting too much from STO. Some of you seem to except something like a Star Trek simulator. This is not going to happen. It is not going to happen because it is nearly impossible to do.

But I know one thing. Many of you seem to reject the need of thinking about the differences between single player games and MMOs. Many of you do know **** about game development or software development in general. Are you unwilling to see that not every feature some of you DEMAND won't be fun for the most of the community? Everyone in this community really has to realise that there are different tastes, different views what a Star Trek MMO has to look like and you have to realise that Cryptic HAS TO fullfill the needs of non Star Trek fans, too. That is way Cryptic is saying they want the game to be FUN. There is so much more in this sentence than most of you seem to realise. Cryptic has a hell of a job to fullfill the wishes of hardcore Trek fans and casual gamers. They have to develope a game with a Star Trek atmosphere, which is easy enough to access for non Trek fans. AND they have to do the math. Software development is expensive.

I am sick of all those useless discussions. WAIT till in-game videos are out, or the beta started. Wait till you played the game. Then you can start arguing and flaming. That is the advantage of a MMO. It is in development all the time, at least as long people are playing (and paying). Changes can be made. Changes will be made, because no MMO is perfect at the release.

I have no problem with threads about ideas for the game. Even if some of them are really far fetched and won't fit in a MMO, but in a single player game. What I really hate is that nearly every idea disussion gets out of control pretty fast. The flaming starts, the hatred. Trolls are making useless posts. People are unwilling to accept that some ideas are impracticable, others start smashing good ideas without a reason.

Most of the time I can't stand reading the replies to a new thread. I tend to read the first two or three posts, then I leave.

Oh and is it possible that some of you start reading posts before they reply? Many threads contain of so many pages, just because people repeat things which were already said (and of course, the discussions restart).

I do not say that discussing Cryptic ideas is a bad thing. BUT, the way it is done is wrong. And at some point, we all have to stop arguing. We can share our ideas, our hopes and our concerns. In the end, we have to wait and trust Cryptic.

No one forces you to play the game or pay a monthly fee. Some of you act like they have already paid a lot of money and start demanding stuff. None of you has the right to demand ANYTHING. You haven't paid for anything, yet.

Some of you know about the SW: TOR MMO. There was at least one comic released, yet. Free stuff. Everyone can access it. But many of the fans are smashing the done work. Why can't they just appreciate the free stuff they get? They don't have to like it. But some of them really hates the comic. But why? IT'S FOR FREE. And some of this behavior can be seen in this community. It's insane. It's immature.

Now start smashing me.

What he said. Although, i do think that we should at least try and highlight Nics' constant and blatent lying and prove him wrong, as misinformed people, or people that like to misinform others are one of the things that could hinder STO.

[KO_Gilligan]

For the most part, Nic is correct here.

Source: http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-...omic-con-2009/

Again, at about ~1:55 in the Comic Con Panel, Cryptic says "whether at launch or after....", which would indicate that at one point Cryptic was shooting to get the social interiors in. However, they have never 'promised', or 'guaranteed' that ship interiors would be in, nor what they may or may not entail.

As a side note, any game in development should never be considered 'Promised', 'guaranteed', etc, but rather should always be considered a 'work in progress' with the possibility of radical changes up to release. I would recommend that it is best to be prepared for things to change, regardless of how many times a Developer talks about a feature. Again, WAR is a current example, where they made sweeping changes a month or so from retail, to content that had been considered 'established' for a year.

In MMO Development, the phrase, 'Everything is Set in Mud' applies.

Right, they really haven't planned anything, and keeping it in context "whether at launch or after" did not mean either at launch or after, and was clarified by the statement of only indicating it as only something they were considering , in it's full context, as follows:


...as for interiors of your ship...as a social area...we do want to make it you so you have your own private space...bridge, ready room.....will it be at launch or update there after.(HERE IS A MISSING" we're looking at that right now " NOTE TRANSCRIPT WORDING INDICATING NOTHING ACTUALLY PLANNED YET)..I want to have your TOS bridge, etc....its all about the customization....

[KO_Gilligan]

What he said. Although, i do think that we should at least try and highlight Nics' constant and blatent lying and prove him wrong, as misinformed people, or people that like to misinform others are one of the things that could hinder STO.

Ye nic was spamming pictures of a recently completed EFII mod and saying it was graphics from 10 years ago.

The first time, I didn't make much notice, but recently I noticed this graphics issue, the interior promise issue and the space station issue, and they are recycling unkind words used on Perpetual and all the deception can be seen in it's full glory on MMORPG.com.

Some people think that the mods should be easy on "opinions"... but right about now, I'd be thinking about those trying to rally dissent with lies... and I'd be breaking out the banhammer for every little misquote that get's intentionally spammed.

[OrabIbo]

I think Cryptics past performance is an indication of how they will handle STO. They added missing content in their other games about 2 months (not 2 years, or even 1 year) after launch. So there is a potential that Ship interiors could appear within the first 6 months of retail. It sounds like it is simply a matter of getting it done to their satisfaction, rather than some marketing ploy to get sales of some expansion.

True, on the otherhand I'm considering fully interactive interiors. Not just social spaces that other ppl are indicating. This would add gameplay mechanics that would need to work well with the existing ones. I expected this to take awhile. Hence my 1year guesstimation.

If it's just going to be a stage for RP'ers to play in, then meh. I will appreciate the effort, but I would wish they had done more with it.

[Posidon]

True, on the otherhand I'm considering fully interactive interiors. Not just social spaces that other ppl are indicating. This would add gameplay mechanics that would need to work well with the existing ones. I expected this to take awhile. Hence my 1year guesstimation.

If it's just going to be a stage for RP'ers to play in, then meh. I will appreciate the effort, but I would wish they had done more with it.

I agree. If well thought out (Like I spent 2+ years doing in preparations for Frontiers) it would take a while to implement. If I were to take my work and implement it into STO, the time would be shorted a bit, due to all of the nuances already in place, would simply need the textures and display functions to be hard coded in. That is what would take most of the time anyway. And, if Cryptic did not code extensions for the current game operations, then it will take even longer.

[_Pax_]

I can not believe this discussions isn't over, yet. And I can not believe that all of you are wasting your time discussing with nic. If he is not willing to rethink the known facts, fine, leave him alone. Maybe he is going to spread his misinformations much more and maybe it will confuse some new forum members - but, if these new visitors are really interessted in the game, they will start reading all the giving informations, they will have a look at the video and the screenshots and they will come up with their own conclusions.
No, I will not allow his lies, falsehoods, and other general misinformation to stand unchallenged. BEcause, no, NOT everyone interested in teh game will take hte time to read MORE - many come here curious, and will accept the first things they read as fact, if they are presented as if they are such, and noone swiftly contradicts that claim.

And, more important, you should ignore everyone else except the devs.
... oh, yeah, THAT'S a good idea. :rolleyes:

There are too much discussions going on in this forum. Too much flaming, too much childish whining.
You, um ... don't get around much, do you, Internet-wise? Go check out the forums for other MMOs. Especially, the ones for World of Warcraft.

I am sick of all those useless discussions.
Then don't read them? Honestly, if the only thing YOU personally want to see is Developer posts - stick to the Dev Tracker. But me? Most of the time, I enjoy the lively, civil debate I get from and with MOST of the people here. It's only a few bad eggs like NIC who truly irk me.

[walker555]

Wishful thinking, but honestly, what use do you have for 100 miles of corridors with nothing in them but crew quarters

[Posidon]

Wishful thinking, but honestly, what use do you have for 100 miles of corridors with nothing in them but crew quarters

Funny thing is, you do not need to render many corridors at all. You would model 3 or 4 types that had connecting cross ways, turbo lift and door access. Most corridors are virtually the same anyway. All you really need to do is establish (at what deck, and area, ect.) where your access points are located. Non-essentual areas do not need to be modeled. The deck by deck schematic can be quite simple enough for practically all ships. If you look at a lot of deck schematics from the NG, DS9 and Yoy series, the decks are laid out quite simply with references to the main ares only. Most of the time, you will enter a turbo lift and arrive at a deck that you would walk down to a door that accessed the area (say engineering) that you wanted to visit. That kind of mod would be simple to implement actually. It is functioning terminals (ship wide) that is a bit more challenging.

[jhem99]

Nah:mad:.......................................... ..

[theexplorer1]

No such promise was made. The only thing remotely close to that was when Jack said sending repair crews to deck whatever it was or something of that nature, there was, in no way conceivable, a statement of interiors hinted at for your personal starship.

Because personal ship interiors are not going to be in at launch, instanced ship interiors are going to be there. Oops, you are still wrong. Wow, even the very website with fresh screenshots, statements on at least four seperate interviews from Craig, recent ones, and the STO trailer say you are wrong.

Wrong. Interiors are there for instances and starbase interiors as well as outpost interiors. What we will not have is our own personal starship interiors, which people, like yourself, can't seem to get. The only interiors stated that would not appear at launch is personal ship, in being that you will not just randomly stop somewhere in space and be able to just walk around your ship or just walk around your own bridge. None of that was even promised, unlike what you keep thinking.

The second part of your post isn't even worth the time to try and dispute because it's just a wild flight of fancy that doesn't even begin to discuss a valid point.


"The second part of your post isn't even worth the time to try and dispute because it's just a wild flight of fancy that doesn't even begin to discuss a valid point"

Why are you doing this? Are you paid to do this or are you really that bitter with everyone that dares to express his opinion? A wild flight of fancy? Did you dug this words from a dictionary ? I just try to explain to stubborn people like you how important for something called immersion interiors are.And yet you are constantly trying to bend and corrupt anything i say.And you say a lot of lies too and that is sad.
You don't even read what i write.I have written whole essays to explain a couple of things and you just took
a single phrase and warped it so you can insult me.

Interiors are important.And one thing is been able to talk to a couple of crew mates and see a few scripted events while you are on a mission either on a ship or on a space station and its another to be able to actually roam freely through these environments and be able to partake to conversations with hundreds of people.

Immersion is among the most important and most difficult things to do right in a game.Many have tried but few have succeeded.To have immersion you must have great graphics,rich audio,huge levels but intricately detailed,a lot of things to do and many people to talk with and a lot of adaptivity of the world around you to your actions.This is the most important role as a whole of the interiors.Its not about having custom interiors or various mini games.Its about having a cohesive and interconnected world.

When you simply have a character that is supposed to be your ship and your crew mates are nothing more than menu icons and choices how can there be immersion i ask you ?
So lets say a few of your crew mates died.So what the icons get changed but again so what ?
But if you actually have ai crew mates that look different,have their own rooms,have a ton of dialog choices and different voices than having these ai characters die its a completely different subject.And is it the same
to fly your character-ship do your next mission or return from a successfull mission and simply have some icons talk to each other-OR- walking to 10 forward and sit down with your crew mated and have a drink and everybody discussing their thoughts of what to do or what happened ?
I could give you a thousand other ideas and examples but i really don't know if it even worths the trouble

[Loekii]

Right, they really haven't planned anything, and keeping it in context "whether at launch or after" did not mean either at launch or after, and was clarified by the statement of only indicating it as only something they were considering , in it's full context, as follows:

Actually, seeing how they discussed their Plans, means the plan existed.


http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-online-cryptic-meet-greet-nyc-comic-con-2009/


What I see here is Cryptic Devs - none of which are you - talking about their plans and hopes for ship interiors. What I don't see is the devs saying they have no plans of ship interiors, nor that they have never had a plan for ship interiors, or the other semantic crap you are trying to pull.

Had there not been a plan, and no intention, the dev reply would have been, we have no plans for interiors.

The Devs are talking about interiors, and you claim otherwise. :rolleyes:

You chastise Nic for posting misinformation, yet you do the same -- even when we have Video of the Devs openly talking about their PLANS for interiors.

[OddjobXL]

Guys, I think we get it.

[Posidon]

"The second part of your post isn't even worth the time to try and dispute because it's just a wild flight of fancy that doesn't even begin to discuss a valid point"

Why are you doing this? Are you paid to do this or are you really that bitter with everyone that dares to express his opinion? A wild flight of fancy? Did you dug this words from a dictionary ? I just try to explain to stubborn people like you how important for something called immersion interiors are.And yet you are constantly trying to bend and corrupt anything i say.And you say a lot of lies too and that is sad.
You don't even read what i write.I have written whole essays to explain a couple of things and you just took
a single phrase and warped it so you can insult me.

Interiors are important.And one thing is been able to talk to a couple of crew mates and see a few scripted events while you are on a mission either on a ship or on a space station and its another to be able to actually roam freely through these environments and be able to partake to conversations with hundreds of people.

Immersion is among the most important and most difficult things to do right in a game.Many have tried but few have succeeded.To have immersion you must have great graphics,rich audio,huge levels but intricately detailed,a lot of things to do and many people to talk with and a lot of adaptivity of the world around you to your actions.This is the most important role as a whole of the interiors.Its not about having custom interiors or various mini games.Its about having a cohesive and interconnected world.

When you simply have a character that is supposed to be your ship and your crew mates are nothing more than menu icons and choices how can there be immersion i ask you ?
So lets say a few of your crew mates died.So what the icons get changed but again so what ?
But if you actually have ai crew mates that look different,have their own rooms,have a ton of dialog choices and different voices than having these ai characters die its a completely different subject.And is it the same
to fly your character-ship do your next mission or return from a successfull mission and simply have some icons talk to each other-OR- walking to 10 forward and sit down with your crew mated and have a drink and everybody discussing their thoughts of what to do or what happened ?
I could give you a thousand other ideas and examples but i really don't know if it even worths the trouble

I agree. It will be much more immersive if STO had these things. I do think that STO may have an add'on that will feature this kind of game play, but at launch, STO will (most likely) be a lot like Legacy. Since I know A LOT about Legacy, STO will need to create add'on content that can greatly expand the game as we go. If not, STO will suffer a similar fate as Legacy did.

[Posidon]

Guys, I think we get it.

....and what is wrong with discussing it? Nic is being rational here. As long as Nic is being rational, I have no problems with Nic. This is a good discussion. There is much to be said about ship interiors. Much that can be done.

[Loekii]

....and what is wrong with discussing it? Nic is being rational here. As long as Nic is being rational, I have no problems with Nic. This is a good discussion. There is much to be said about ship interiors. Much that can be done.



I concur.

I may disagree with Nic, but that doesn't mean that anything he says is false, and that he is allowed to be bullied, especially when he says something that has some truth to it or is contributing to a rational discussion.

We are all entitled to our opinion.

The problem is when people post misinformation.

The bottom line is that links (ie dev quotes and videos) should trump 'opinion', in the interest of keeping everyone properly informed.

[theexplorer1]

I can not believe this discussions isn't over, yet. And I can not believe that all of you are wasting your time discussing with nic. If he is not willing to rethink the known facts, fine, leave him alone. Maybe he is going to spread his misinformations much more and maybe it will confuse some new forum members - but, if these new visitors are really interessted in the game, they will start reading all the giving informations, they will have a look at the video and the screenshots and they will come up with their own conclusions.

Ignore nic. And, more important, you should ignore everyone else except the devs. There are too much discussions going on in this forum. Too much flaming, too much childish whining. The game isn't released, yet. There is no beta. We only saw one video, which is pretty old to say the truth. And the screenshots do not vary much. We all can see the developement in textures etc., okay. But we do not know anything about the GUI, we do not know anything about the combat system except lose phrases like "Ground combat will be fast and space combat, which will be slower, will be skill driven and not only item based.".

In fact, we don't know much about the game. All we know are concepts. Nobody knows how the game will feel. And nobody can imagine it! We have to wait till we get the first in-game action videos. There are alot of people who have to stop arguing about a game which isn't released. You do not know if or if not FULL interiors are going to enhance gameplay experience or whether they will be pretty much useless. I know that some of you are still arguing and telling us that interiors are important. But how can you say that if you haven't played the game? You can't! I repeat, because it is important. YOU CAN'T!

Some of you are expecting too much from STO. Some of you seem to except something like a Star Trek simulator. This is not going to happen. It is not going to happen because it is nearly impossible to do.

But I know one thing. Many of you seem to reject the need of thinking about the differences between single player games and MMOs. Many of you do know **** about game development or software development in general. Are you unwilling to see that not every feature some of you DEMAND won't be fun for the most of the community? Everyone in this community really has to realise that there are different tastes, different views what a Star Trek MMO has to look like and you have to realise that Cryptic HAS TO fullfill the needs of non Star Trek fans, too. That is way Cryptic is saying they want the game to be FUN. There is so much more in this sentence than most of you seem to realise. Cryptic has a hell of a job to fullfill the wishes of hardcore Trek fans and casual gamers. They have to develope a game with a Star Trek atmosphere, which is easy enough to access for non Trek fans. AND they have to do the math. Software development is expensive.

I am sick of all those useless discussions. WAIT till in-game videos are out, or the beta started. Wait till you played the game. Then you can start arguing and flaming. That is the advantage of a MMO. It is in development all the time, at least as long people are playing (and paying). Changes can be made. Changes will be made, because no MMO is perfect at the release.

I have no problem with threads about ideas for the game. Even if some of them are really far fetched and won't fit in a MMO, but in a single player game. What I really hate is that nearly every idea disussion gets out of control pretty fast. The flaming starts, the hatred. Trolls are making useless posts. People are unwilling to accept that some ideas are impracticable, others start smashing good ideas without a reason.

Most of the time I can't stand reading the replies to a new thread. I tend to read the first two or three posts, then I leave.

Oh and is it possible that some of you start reading posts before they reply? Many threads contain of so many pages, just because people repeat things which were already said (and of course, the discussions restart).

I do not say that discussing Cryptic ideas is a bad thing. BUT, the way it is done is wrong. And at some point, we all have to stop arguing. We can share our ideas, our hopes and our concerns. In the end, we have to wait and trust Cryptic.

No one forces you to play the game or pay a monthly fee. Some of you act like they have already paid a lot of money and start demanding stuff. None of you has the right to demand ANYTHING. You haven't paid for anything, yet.

Some of you know about the SW: TOR MMO. There was at least one comic released, yet. Free stuff. Everyone can access it. But many of the fans are smashing the done work. Why can't they just appreciate the free stuff they get? They don't have to like it. But some of them really hates the comic. But why? IT'S FOR FREE. And some of this behavior can be seen in this community. It's insane. It's immature.

Now start smashing me.

Why everyone bashes me but almost noone reads my whole posts...?
You are frustrated because we arque about a game that is not yet finished and is still in early beta...But the whole point is to make your opinion heard before the game is finished so there is a posibility to improve some things.You say that we don't have an idea about the game but i think we actually do.

You see my friend there is star trek legacy a game at this moment is exactly the same with the space part of
sto as now there will be no interiors -with the exceptions of instanced missions.Legacy had so many things going on for it yet it is a pretty boring game and the main reason for this was the lack of interiors-witch was something initially planned...

And at the same time there were games in the past that had everything that we demand now from sto.
That game was Earth and Beyond.It had the graphics,it had the physics and controls, it had the story and it had full interiors,planet surface and a beutifull space to explore...

[KO_Gilligan]

Actually, seeing how they discussed their Plans, means the plan existed.


http://startrek-games.com/star-trek-online-cryptic-meet-greet-nyc-comic-con-2009/


What I see here is Cryptic Devs - none of which are you - talking about their plans and hopes for ship interiors. What I don't see is the devs saying they have no plans of ship interiors, nor that they have never had a plan for ship interiors, or the other semantic crap you are trying to pull.

Had there not been a plan, and no intention, the dev reply would have been, we have no plans for interiors.

The Devs are talking about interiors, and you claim otherwise. :rolleyes:

You chastise Nic for posting misinformation, yet you do the same -- even when we have Video of the Devs openly talking about their PLANS for interiors.

Prove it then.... post every single word of that little video impromptu sound bit, in transcription. You left the most important part of the wording out intentionally, and refuse to acknowledge these seven words "we are looking at that right now"
You call looking at an idea "planning" and accuse me of lying when clearly they are considering the idea, rather than planning it.

Planning it by definition means that you will get your interiors unless there is a change of plans.
I actually think they will give us these social areas.... but I also want the actual truth of "Plans and Promises" to be known.


Not planning it by definition is slightly different, because if you want to take my words out of context and say that I don't think we will have social areas, the truth is WE DON'T KNOW... Wake up and read your own flames... We have no idea if they have actually decided to give us our personal customized RPG rooms - some clearly don't want those kind of interiors, and they haven't decided - a fact that you also will not address.

If they decide to do it differently or reduce the priority to none, at this point you could say they considered it but didn't want to do it. Do not even think about accusing them of changing their plans - I will shut you down.

You call it semantics... I'm using straight forward english

Just like I used straight forward english about the "no starbase interiors" and the supposed "10 year old" screenshots that you think i should not be accusing nic of. Go fight with LordDave about all the things that were totally fabricated pieces of information... I stayed out of it, now i get to deal with your spam here.

Nice work guys, but as long as a few of us are here, nobody's buying it.

Cryptic has been throwing around some ideas on these customizable interiors - they are not actually commited to making them yet. Keep accusing me of lying on this issue, and see where it gets you :D

[KO_Gilligan]

And at the same time there were games in the past that had everything that we demand now from sto.
That game was Earth and Beyond.It had the graphics,it had the physics and controls, it had the story and it had full interiors,planet surface and a beutifull space to explore...

You want the gameplay to be just like this right?

Earth and Beyond - Gameplay (http://i40.tinypic.com/suvk7b.jpg)



FTW :D:D:D:D

[Silverspar]

You want the gameplay to be just like this right?

Earth and Beyond - Gameplay (http://i40.tinypic.com/suvk7b.jpg)



FTW :D:D:D:D

You know, nic's misinformation is getting slightly annoying. Earth and Beyond did not have full physics, you were limited on a plane of flight, you could not fly up or down very far at all. Space stations were exceptionally limited in size, you did not have a ship interior, you were given a bridge shot in first person mode, that was it, you coudln't do anything else, and planetary exploration was done in a ship, not ground based.

nic, really, stop posting your misinformation. The only thing not going to be in Star Trek Online is personal ship interior. Starbases, outposts, and instances will all have interiors.

[KO_Gilligan]

You know, nic's misinformation is getting slightly annoying. Earth and Beyond did not have full physics, you were limited on a plane of flight, you could not fly up or down very far at all. Space stations were exceptionally limited in size, you did not have a ship interior, you were given a bridge shot in first person mode, that was it, you coudln't do anything else, and planetary exploration was done in a ship, not ground based.

nic, really, stop posting your misinformation. The only thing not going to be in Star Trek Online is personal ship interior. Starbases, outposts, and instances will all have interiors.

Have you been to mmorpg.com? They have an active thread with the name "How Long to Wait For Interiors?"

People there are also looking forward to what Cryptic has said will be in this game.

To be honest, the current crusade is going nowhere. Most gamers that would play STO can already see we have a huge game to look forward to - the hype factor is almost entirely unaffected by all this ranting about details and features. The Perpetual model of forum members creating fan dissent is a fail now that this is in Cryptic's hands.
:)

[CinC-UFPForces-Cardassia]

The Perpetual model of forum members creating fan dissent is a fail now that this is in Cryptic's hands.
:)

I'd say it's exactly as meritless, but just as effective, as it was then.

[Loekii]

Have you been to mmorpg.com? They have an active thread with the name "How Long to Wait For Interiors?"

People there are also looking forward to what Cryptic has said will be in this game.

To be honest, the current crusade is going nowhere. Most gamers that would play STO can already see we have a huge game to look forward to - the hype factor is almost entirely unaffected by all this ranting about details and features. The Perpetual model of forum members creating fan dissent is a fail now that this is in Cryptic's hands.
:)

Was this statement really necessary? Nope.

No need to be disrespectful and dismissive. Nic has as much right to post here as anyone else, and given that the owners of this site have not removed him, I would say his comments are as welcome here as you own.

[_Pax_]

"The second part of your post isn't even worth the time to try and dispute because it's just a wild flight of fancy that doesn't even begin to discuss a valid point"

Why are you doing this? Are you paid to do this or are you really that bitter with everyone that dares to express his opinion?
Your problem - and yes, it is YOUR problem - is that you try to present your ompinion, as if it were a fact.

And in the process, you lie and spread misinformation.

A wild flight of fancy? Did you dug this words from a dictionary ?
Dig. "Did you dug ____" is incorrect; "did you dig ____" is the proper usage.

These. The subject "words" is plural. "This words" is incorrect; "these words" is the proper usage.

I just try to explain to stubborn people like you how important for something called immersion interiors are.
No, that is not all you do, or have done. :rolleyes:

When you simply have a character that is supposed to be your ship and your crew mates are nothing more than menu icons and choices how can there be immersion i ask you ?
I've maintained immersion in D&D games, where all I had to show my character was a sheet of (messily scribbled upon) paper, and all I had to picture anything - the weather, the time of day, the NPCs around my character - was my own imagination, and the all-too-often inadequate one-sentence descriptions provided by the person running the game.


[...] walking to 10 forward and sit down with your crew mated and have a drink and everybody discussing their thoughts of what to do or what happened ? [...]
...

What, do you want something like the annoying, stupid, NOT FUN "friends" system from GTA, then ...? :confused:

[_Pax_]

Nic has as much right to post here as anyone else, and given that the owners of this site have not removed him, [...]
Not permanently, perhaps. But ... repeatedly is definitely an applicable (and accurate) adjective.

[Loekii]

Not permanently, perhaps. But ... repeatedly is definitely an applicable (and accurate) adjective.

Which still doesn't mean that he is not allowed to post opinions that are with in the forum rules, or that it is okay to treat him with disrespect.

[Silverspar]

Which still doesn't mean that he is not allowed to post opinions that are with in the forum rules, or that it is okay to treat him with disrespect.

Correcting his misinformation is not disrespect. He disrespect's himself by constantly posting his misinformation and trying to pass it off as fact when everything, including this site, proves him wrong.

[zinc]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

[Drunk1n]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Wow, that sounds fantastic... and i have nothing else to say to that, so back to my watching of the original series, and more paperwork to shuffle around *shuffle shuffle shuffle*

[Silverspar]

Hehe, thanks for stepping in Craig :) Going to mark this thread for prosterity so I can copy and paste Craig's words for anyone who wants to continue this debaucle that there won't be ship interiors :p

[SenshiBat]

Great to hear Zinc..

now we can argue abut what confused means...

[Elfender]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn


then, given the overflowingly vague influx of non-information (j/k....seriously) i'll put my misgivings aside for the "No ship interiors, as a trek realist id like them, but as a gamer i see where having a complete system is wayy wayy better than a shoddy one . . . plus im okay with expanded content in Xpacs or content patches. im confident given cryptics history with COX that when they are available, it will be primo ^_^

[OddjobXL]

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

"When we [put] a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love..."

That was a 'when'. Did I hear a when?! *laughs*

Hey, I can't help it. I'm a guy who posts on gaming forums. If I didn't take things out of context and jump up and down, why, that would be plumb unnatural. Still, gives a guy hope.

[CinC-UFPForces-Cardassia]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Craig, great post, and thanks for giving a picture of how you intend to implement interiors at launch.

Just as a point of clarification, and I know the answer to this question, but for the sake of ensuring nothing is taken out of context - when you say that launch will not feature the ability to customize your own starship, you're referring to the ability to customize the interior of your starship, correct?

[Lennon]

it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.
I am not a fanboi but thank you for that.

[phifur]

Thanks you!!!! no more headaches from Ship interiors forums anymore :)

[TreffnonX]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Awesome!!! That we would get interiors during instanced missions was known, but that we would be inside our own ship on a regular basis seems to come as a surprise. Finally we get the news we all waited for, there ARE gonna be ship interiors and missions will take place there, not just sporadicly.
Zinc has spoken and so shall it be :)
This means that my eagernes to play this game has just increased by a factor of 200%
Bring it on! Lock and load! For I shall not rest until I am back within space:D

[CinC-UFPForces-Cardassia]

Awesome!!! That we would get interiors during instanced missions was known, but that we would be inside our own ship on a regular basis seems to come as a surprise.

I really - really - don't mean to start this all back up again, but that's the opposite of what Craig said.

[cyris]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

As long as you plan to add it in eventually... :)

[TreffnonX]

I really - really - don't mean to start this all back up again, but that's the opposite of what Craig said.

Why not? To say there are plenty of interiors suggests to me that they are going to be scenery quite often.
My only fear was that we would only see interiors every 10th episode or so. But that seems not to be the case. In the contrary. I'm not saying we can go there by choice I only say it will happen often enough (for my taste)

[STO]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

OMG OMG OMG OMG just like you guys have said from the beginning hehehe. Maybe everyone that has been wasting energy talking about this will hush up for a while :) heh although I doubt it.

[CinC-UFPForces-Cardassia]

Why not? To say there are plenty of interiors suggests to me that they are going to be scenery quite often.
My only fear was that we would only see interiors every 10th episode or so. But that seems not to be the case. In the contrary. I'm not saying we can go there by choice I only say it will happen often enough (for my taste)

Yes, there will be ship interiors. Per Craig, you will not be seeing the interior of your own ship on a regular basis. They're two very different concepts, and if we would be seeing the interior of our own ships on a regular basis, Craig would've written a very different post.

[JPJappic]

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Thanks for posting Craig!

To add to what you've said, personally when and if Fleet Starbases are introduced in STO, I'd like to see us having the ability to customize things within the starbase and add customer shops and shop keepers, customize our very own bar!, have a crew housing type of system where players enter the turbolift and like go to deck 23 or something and go to their own quarters on the starbase. Starbases could even be host to missions to benefit your fleet! Though this could take some time to implement, it would be great for roleplayers.. i imagine there will be many of us who will be roleplayers... and it would also push customization in my opinion to the next level.

[Voyager24]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn


Thats great news, that just made my day. :cool:

[FelFox]

When we do get the true interiors for starships and space stations, it means we'll be able to decided every little detail about -our- ships and -our- potential star bases (guild things) However, at this time, there will still be thousands of interiors in the game but they will be pre-made dev stuff for missions and locations to get missions and RP hubs. We won't be able to effect their look because they are basically part of the terrain.

When/if we get the real interiors, we'll be able to customize -our- ships for fun and to show off to friends and RP :) that's all craig meant. Looking foward to the game and hope you guys do get around to customizable interiors someday!

[KO_Gilligan]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Thanks Craig...

I know it's probably not easy to give us information like this...

Especially here. When I seen the DEV POST flag on the thread, I figured something exploded and was hoping it didn't have one of my quotes in it.

...but rather than close a somewhat volatile discussion (which we all, no doubt, deserved), we get your input direct, and rather than disenfranchising anyone here, you are among us, and obviously reading our posts, and speaking to all.

..............................................:)_: )_:)_:)

[Loekii]

When we do get the true interiors for starships and space stations, it means we'll be able to decided every little detail about -our- ships and -our- potential star bases (guild things) However, at this time, there will still be thousands of interiors in the game but they will be pre-made dev stuff for missions and locations to get missions and RP hubs. We won't be able to effect their look because they are basically part of the terrain.

When/if we get the real interiors, we'll be able to customize -our- ships for fun and to show off to friends and RP :) that's all craig meant. Looking foward to the game and hope you guys do get around to customizable interiors someday!

That is the way I see it as well. Its basically a quality over quantity type approach. If/When they add them, they want to 'really' add them, instead of doing it Half-heartedly.

Definitely something worthy of waiting for.

[_Pax_]

Which still doesn't mean that he is not allowed to post opinions that are with in the forum rules, or that it is okay to treat him with disrespect.

.... except that his misinformation-laden method of expressing those "opinions" have been part of why he's been repeatedly removed.

[_Pax_]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

^_^

Believe me, Zinc, most of us really and honestly did know that exact thing, already. Still, it's very very nice to have a quote-able, link-point-able Developer post with which to hammer upon the head(s) of Ignorance and Untruth.

...

...

Now, where did that nail get to, exactly? I gots me a new hammer I'd like to try out ... :D

[Loekii]

.... except that his misinformation-laden method of expressing those "opinions" have been part of why he's been repeatedly removed.

Again, but his other posts have remained.

Just because someone has an unpopular opinion, and/or gets some of their threads removed, does not give you or other members the right to ignore the forum guidelines and trash that poster.

What I have seen is a trend by a few Vets to basically continually harass Nic, even when there is not wrong with his post -- and last time I checked, harassment is against the guidelines, even for Vet members.

Rather than attack Nic personally, just correct any misinformation, but stop with the personal attacks, harassment, and other disrespect.

[_Pax_]

Again, but his other posts have remained.
Moderators are neither omniscient nor all-present. And after a while, I get leery of constantly hitting "report bad post" on teh same person, day in and day out, no matte rHOW horridly they're behaving ... because there's a risk the wrong moderator will see "huge number of reports from Pax, against the same person" and pull the trigger, before looking at what hte posts really ARE.

Yes, that's happened to me before, on another forum; it was a huge PITA to get the moderators to revise their choice of actions. As such, I'm not volunteering my neck for THAT chopping-block ever again.

[Silverspar]

Loekii, it doesn't help your position when you start putting words in a person's mouth. nic has constantly made a target of himself. He has had action taken on his accoutn numerous times, and he continuously posted misinformation, and tries to call anyone his friend. Personally, this is just dishonest and dishonorable behavior as I don't consider someone who willfully posts misinformation to exactly being friendly. This is the type of person that get's otehrs in deep levels of trouble. He is the type of person that can't accept the lunar landing was real or that Kenedy was shot by Oswald, despite all the proof.

[Flatfingers]

Thanks for the update, Craig. I'm glad to hear about some of the ways that different kinds of interior locations will be included in Star Trek Online.

Just to clarify something important, however:

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

If the feature you just described is never implemented at all, I think that'll be fine. I have no problem personally with it not happening, and I think it would be OK for the game overall if it never happens.

What I do hope Cryptic will implement is some iconic player ship interior locations with specific functional gameplay activities.

Not for the sake of appearance only, or for "look but don't touch" social gatherings, but for utility: a starship that works as a container of places with useful and entertaining and IP-appropriate functions.

That, and not merely a "walk around and see everything" feature, is what I believe would add the most value to Star Trek Online, and what I hope you'll consider worth implementing.

Eventually. :)

--Flatfingers

[theexplorer1]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Amazing! I just read the post and this is the reply i secretly wished we had and it made me really really happy :) Basically thank you Cryptic for answearing and making my day :)
Having a confirmation that what we all wish for will be there eventually and it will be the way we wish it to
be (With hundreds of npc's crew members,lot of intricate details everywhere and a lot of customization) is what we all wanted to hear.Certainly i wished for full interiors to be there from launch but as long as i know that they Will be Properly there i don't mind waiting for a patch or an expansion for their release.It was nice also hearing that there will be persistent ways for interiors(and not only social) and not only instanced missions.I do hope though there are the before and after a mission periods where all the npc's will talk about the forthcoming or your completed mission and the situation the world is during your current time.And also i do hope there are some detailed stories or submissions for the various npc's you can learn or do by talking often with someone.
Well at least for me personally i believe i can relax with the interiors now.

[CaptainHoliday]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Loved this. Hope it's not IF we have a feauture like this, but WHEN as in definitively it is happening. I hope within 6 months of release.

[Crab66]

No shag carpeting on the bridge of the Pimpinprise at launch?

Aww.

[NicoleDuBois]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

This is what most people dont seem to get in their heads.
They complain about Interiours not present at the release. But it isnt true. There are interiours, just not for free-roaming ATM.

Just relax and wait, what Cryptic is doing about this feature within the next add-ons. Probably it wil be great. My opinion is better dont ahve the ability to roam the ship at the release date, but with later add-ons it will be great, not just "wow you can walk around but theres really nothing of interest"

[DarthWarth]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn

Superb news thanks for that. I'm going to play the game with or without the ability to walk around my ship it doesn't bother me, but the info you just gave really pleased me.

I like that the Cryptic dev team actually talks to us. That's a new thing for me in MMO's

[djnattyd]

Amazing! I just read the post and this is the reply i secretly wished we had and it made me really really happy :) Basically thank you Cryptic for answearing and making my day :)

Have i had a stroke and developed amnesia, or have we been telling you the same thing (for over a month) as what your now thanking Zinc for telling you?

[_Pax_]

You haven't got amnesia, and you didn't just have a stroke.

Not unless I do/did, too.

*sigh*

[KO_Gilligan]

Again, but his other posts have remained.

Just because someone has an unpopular opinion, and/or gets some of their threads removed, does not give you or other members the right to ignore the forum guidelines and trash that poster.

What I have seen is a trend by a few Vets to basically continually harass Nic, even when there is not wrong with his post -- and last time I checked, harassment is against the guidelines, even for Vet members.

Rather than attack Nic personally, just correct any misinformation, but stop with the personal attacks, harassment, and other disrespect.

Which "Vets" specifically - use the report feature please ( it's the little exclamation point icon under my avatar)

You started this with accusing us (including me specifically) of something against nic, and you are wrong...again.

Post the Quote where I did anything wrong, if it is your opinion.

[KO_Gilligan]

You haven't got amnesia, and you didn't just have a stroke.

Not unless I do/did, too.

*sigh*

No clinical diagnosis for me yet. But I am getting older.

I'll have my wife warn you if I start slippin'.

[theexplorer1]

Have i had a stroke and developed amnesia, or have we been telling you the same thing (for over a month) as what your now thanking Zinc for telling you?

Well no what you were telling me was based on blind faith.Its one thing to plan for something witch eventually can be canceled and even if its made it may be completely different than what everyone thinks of it.For example interiors could be seen only as a house and be completely seperate from the main game.Something like a pokemon game...
Now we have a CONFIRMATION that there will be interiors and they will be something more than simple housing.Yes their role will be primary social but they will be a part of the game,there will be a lot of npc's doing their work and you will be able to talk with them (I do hope they expand this feature to the level i described previously),your ship will be considered as a vehicle and not as a character like it is now,they will be intricately detailed and finally they will use them for other ways (So there is hope there are the previously mentioned submissions or additional story bit parts to hear by partaken on conversation or by simply exploring the interiors.
I still believe they should take their time and release the game when its done.For many people the initial impression is very important and they may not give the game another chance even if all they would have to do is to download a patch.
In any case for me the interior subject is concluded.I am relived that such an important part for making a truly great star trek will be there and properly.
Was this their intention from the begining ? Or did they hear the people's suggestions and decided to actually include them on a later stage? We probably would never actually know .Yet the right thing for anybody to do was to express his/hers opinion freely.Because to make something truly great somebody should hear critique no matter how harsh it may sound.Only then he can improve himself or what he is doing.Look at the real world.We constantly mess things around.We are only human after all.But by looking at our mistakes we can get better.

What matters is that they will be there properly and sto is a game i can truly anticipate.For all its worth i thank Cryptic again for hearing the people and answearing to us. :)

[zinc]

Just as a point of clarification, and I know the answer to this question, but for the sake of ensuring nothing is taken out of context - when you say that launch will not feature the ability to customize your own starship, you're referring to the ability to customize the interior of your starship, correct?

Yes - thanks for pointing that out. I was just talking interiors. Your ship exterior will be customizable.

-Zn

[Posidon]

Thanks for the update, Craig. I'm glad to hear about some of the ways that different kinds of interior locations will be included in Star Trek Online.

Just to clarify something important, however:



If the feature you just described is never implemented at all, I think that'll be fine. I have no problem personally with it not happening, and I think it would be OK for the game overall if it never happens.

What I do hope Cryptic will implement is some iconic player ship interior locations with specific functional gameplay activities.

Not for the sake of appearance only, or for "look but don't touch" social gatherings, but for utility: a starship that works as a container of places with useful and entertaining and IP-appropriate functions.

That, and not merely a "walk around and see everything" feature, is what I believe would add the most value to Star Trek Online, and what I hope you'll consider worth implementing.

Eventually. :)

--Flatfingers

I am hoping for this sort of thing too. Much more imersive. Fully functioning terminals (bridge and though out the ship) would be a great addition at some point. Also, tactical systems being at the forefront of bridge combat interface terminals would be an evolution in MMOG. Someday, perhaps.....................

[Loekii]

I am hoping for this sort of thing too. Much more imersive. Fully functioning terminals (bridge and though out the ship) would be a great addition at some point. Also, tactical systems being at the forefront of bridge combat interface terminals would be an evolution in MMOG. Someday, perhaps.....................

I tend to look at what existing MMOS, and video games have been able to accomplish, as a measure of what could potentially be seen in a developing game.

Are there any games out there that displays such utility? Are they MMOs or Single player games.

I mean people talk about wanting to have a fully functioning Medical bay, but in game terms (not star trek terms) what exactly would be that function -- it cannot be unbalancing, nor burdensome.

Looking at MassEffects, there were alot of ship interiors, that effectively did nothing.

I guess what I am asking, is what are current examples of what could be accomplished in other games, to demonstrate the feasibility.

[OddjobXL]

I think we'd have to decide how much of a location's function would be 'routine' and how much would apply to specific mission resolutions.

Just shooting off the hip, I'd say that only the bridge really needs to be functional as a practical ongoing concern. It's just too much fun to play around with sensors, shields, ship's library and so on. Most functions of the ship can be remotely handled from the bridge itself. In a crisis situation, say bridge crew getting wounded during a battle in space, the doctor or medics can treat them on the spot before 'moving' them out of harm's way.

However, specific scenarios might make use of research capabilities in the med bay or science lab. It'd have to be an interesting minigame of some kind, of course. You might see engineering if there is a threat to the engines or doing something to them is one possible solution to a problem.

I'd really need to know how missions will be before I speculate too much. In away team missions, for example, quite a bit of science can be done with tricorders alone. Would it be too much of a hassle, and would it serve a point, to bring samples back to the ship for another minigame?

[Posidon]

I tend to look at what existing MMOS, and video games have been able to accomplish, as a measure of what could potentially be seen in a developing game.

Are there any games out there that displays such utility? Are they MMOs or Single player games.

I mean people talk about wanting to have a fully functioning Medical bay, but in game terms (not star trek terms) what exactly would be that function -- it cannot be unbalancing, nor burdensome.

Looking at MassEffects, there were alot of ship interiors, that effectively did nothing.

I guess what I am asking, is what are current examples of what could be accomplished in other games, to demonstrate the feasibility.

Good questions (I love GREAT questions).

Feasibly, you would need 2 approaches to this. (1) is the drag and drop method. Simplistic and straight forward. Lacking in detail, but effective to play the game none the less. It pretty much sums up ship board personal to AI "pet" status. (2) Fully functional ship wide terminals. AI controlled, but fully interactive.

Let's take a look at your "sickbay" question. You can have AI run most of the situations and simply watch the "pet" treat the wounds, or you would interact with the doctor as he/she treated the patient. Think of Mcoy talking to Kirk about treating an alien. Mcoy discussed what he was attempting to do. Kirk was interacting with Mcoy as he treated the alien (such as, "Bones, if you give him Quardrazine, will he survive?" Mcoy replys "it's a 50/50 chance Jim, but the only way to bring him around.", ect.). You could also take over the sickbay facilities and treat injured on your own (using interactive tools found in sickbay), but your game avatar needs to be proficient (i.e. have medical, xenoio, ect. skills) to be able to treat or do anything. Assuming you can take control of your medical officer, then you could treat all the injured you can handle using sickbay interactive tools.

Has this ever been done? Nope, but it can be. I keep saying this but it so happens to be very true. It is all in how you do it. How you approach AI v's interaction v's fully active rolls. How detailed do you want it? The draw on system resources are actually quite minimal, due to the program having all the elements to emulate the outcome anyway. Whether the patient dies, lives, or some other fate in sickbay, all the elements are there. It is the AI and interaction that determines the outcome, not which approach you make except for letting the AI make all of the decisions, which might not be favorable in some situations. If the patient dies, it may not be a mission killer, but it might be more difficult to complete, or you me get less credit for the mission (I hate using a credit system for leveling).

Anyway, the point is, it IS doable. It all in how you do it. I have given over 2 years of constant work on this. I see issues, but only because I have not reached that bridge and crossed it yet, but I have thought out this system for Frontiers. I am particularly pleased with my combat tactical system interface. Yes, it would take some time to implement, but it would be a revolution in MMOG.

[KO_Gilligan]

I am hoping for this sort of thing too. Much more imersive. Fully functioning terminals (bridge and though out the ship) would be a great addition at some point. Also, tactical systems being at the forefront of bridge combat interface terminals would be an evolution in MMOG. Someday, perhaps.....................

Could you imagine a B-52 in a dogfight and only being able to look out the front window?
Games in the past have not only had problems with assigning the controls, but giving the user a feel lor what's around. A little combination of flat radar screen will not give you the best three dimensional tactical advantage.

Seems like a real Starship bridge might be fitted with a very large Holographic Representation of the space around the ship in order to make split second tactical decisions. It would be highly scalable in order to "Zoom out" and encompass an even larger view when needed.

A third person behind the ship view with a rear view sensor for behind the camera is the next best thing

[Posidon]

I think we'd have to decide how much of a location's function would be 'routine' and how much would apply to specific mission resolutions.

Just shooting off the hip, I'd say that only the bridge really needs to be functional as a practical ongoing concern. It's just too much fun to play around with sensors, shields, ship's library and so on. Most functions of the ship can be remotely handled from the bridge itself. In a crisis situation, say bridge crew getting wounded during a battle in space, the doctor or medics can treat them on the spot before 'moving' them out of harm's way.

However, specific scenarios might make use of research capabilities in the med bay or science lab. It'd have to be an interesting minigame of some kind, of course. You might see engineering if there is a threat to the engines or doing something to them is one possible solution to a problem.

I'd really need to know how missions will be before I speculate too much. In away team missions, for example, quite a bit of science can be done with tricorders alone. Would it be too much of a hassle, and would it serve a point, to bring samples back to the ship for another minigame?

You have transporters for med evacs. Aux. control and Engineering that can run all of the shipboard operations, ect. Most of the corridors have computer interfaces, but that would be primarily used for communications. Specific locations on the ship would have to be modeled. However, each location would only model what is specific about that location.

[Posidon]

Could you imagine a B-52 in a dogfight and only being able to look out the front window?
Games in the past have not only had problems with assigning the controls, but giving the user a feel lor what's around. A little combination of flat radar screen will not give you the best three dimensional tactical advantage.

Seems like a real Starship bridge might be fitted with a very large Holographic Representation of the space around the ship in order to make split second tactical decisions. It would be highly scalable in order to "Zoom out" and encompass an even larger view when needed.

A third person behind the ship view with a rear view sensor for behind the camera is the next best thing

I agree, but move ahead a few steps beyond this. You will get to where I am with respect to combat tactical controls and views. Also, keeping this more "game oriented" with respect to what you see. If you have a "Gods" eye view of combat as the combat is taking place, is not realistic. Your just pointing and shooting in real time. After watching the all of the latest (and even the TOS) a see that the way the episode during combat evolves, is that you are looking at a tactical display that is a "Gods" eye view in real time, however the movement is controlled and mapped as it goes, as well as pre-determined mapping (or where you will end up). Attack postures and defensive maneuvers can be superimposed and adjusted on the fly. Other than that, you are simply pointing and shooting (like Legacy) and that is rather redundant to me.

There is SO much more to this but I think you get the picture. I only scratched the surface of advanced tactical combat for star ships. As you can see, there are great advantages to this.

Also, I wanted to add that once weapons are fired (either from the enemy vessel or your ship) I would like to see cut scenes showing an external view of the action as it happens. That would be very episodic in content as well.

[KO_Gilligan]

I agree, but move ahead a few steps beyond this. You will get to where I am with respect to combat tactical controls and views. Also, keeping this more "game oriented" with respect to what you see. If you have a "Gods" eye view of combat as the combat is taking place, is not realistic. Your just pointing and shooting in real time. After watching the all of the latest (and even the TOS) a see that the way the episode during combat evolves, is that you are looking at a tactical display that is a "Gods" eye view in real time, however the movement is controlled and mapped as it goes, as well as pre-determined mapping (or where you will end up). Attack postures and defensive maneuvers can be superimposed and adjusted on the fly. Other than that, you are simply pointing and shooting (like Legacy) and that is rather redundant to me.

There is SO much more to this but I think you get the picture. I only scratched the surface of advanced tactical combat for star ships. As you can see, there are great advantages to this.

My auto pilot always pwns when I'm flying a REAL 25th century space ship

[Posidon]

My auto pilot always pwns when I'm flying a REAL 25th century space ship

LMOA!!!!

Good one Gilligan!

[Moryan_Sorg]

Good questions (I love GREAT questions).

Feasibly, you would need 2 approaches to this. (1) is the drag and drop method. Simplistic and straight forward. Lacking in detail, but effective to play the game none the less. It pretty much sums up ship board personal to AI "pet" status. (2) Fully functional ship wide terminals. AI controlled, but fully interactive.

Let's take a look at your "sickbay" question. You can have AI run most of the situations and simply watch the "pet" treat the wounds, or you would interact with the doctor as he/she treated the patient. Think of Mcoy talking to Kirk about treating an alien. Mcoy discussed what he was attempting to do. Kirk was interacting with Mcoy as he treated the alien (such as, "Bones, if you give him Quardrazine, will he survive?" Mcoy replys "it's a 50/50 chance Jim, but the only way to bring him around.", ect.). You could also take over the sickbay facilities and treat injured on your own (using interactive tools found in sickbay), but your game avatar needs to be proficient (i.e. have medical, xenoio, ect. skills) to be able to treat or do anything. Assuming you can take control of your medical officer, then you could treat all the injured you can handle using sickbay interactive tools.

Has this ever been done? Nope, but it can be. I keep saying this but it so happens to be very true. It is all in how you do it. How you approach AI v's interaction v's fully active rolls. How detailed do you want it? The draw on system resources are actually quite minimal, due to the program having all the elements to emulate the outcome anyway. Whether the patient dies, lives, or some other fate in sickbay, all the elements are there. It is the AI and interaction that determines the outcome, not which approach you make except for letting the AI make all of the decisions, which might not be favorable in some situations. If the patient dies, it may not be a mission killer, but it might be more difficult to complete, or you me get less credit for the mission (I hate using a credit system for leveling).

Anyway, the point is, it IS doable. It all in how you do it. I have given over 2 years of constant work on this. I see issues, but only because I have not reached that bridge and crossed it yet, but I have thought out this system for Frontiers. I am particularly pleased with my combat tactical system interface. Yes, it would take some time to implement, but it would be a revolution in MMOG.

I really like this. I've been throwing around ides about this whenever I can as well. For me, every task that the NPC crew has should be able to be fully automated by them with some pre-set commands from the captain, the PC. BUT, the captain should be able to step in at any time to gather info, change the orders and hopefully take over the task (especially if the area being taken over is in the captain's 'specialty).

To expand upon the sickbay example. The sickbay has pre combat mission commands for triage, personnel jobs, types of scans and info being taken in during combat, etc.

For triage the captain could order the med officer to treat heavy wounds first and save more lives or treat light wounds first so that more people can get back to their stations quicker. Now for the customization: As the captain I'd like to be able to adjust this real time during combat. Say I'm in a long combat situation, my preferences may change... This is something that I don't see why the devs wouldn't include.

I'm also really hoping they include giving the captain some ability to step in. PvE missions would have a lot more depth if I could actually look at a medical scan and make a more informed decision about the doctor's recommendation rather than just being spoon fed a resolution.

This type of idea could be spread to any aspect of the ship through the NPC system.

[djnattyd]

Well no what you were telling me was based on blind faith.

No, it was based on fact. Zinc had already told us and you and others heard it/saw it but refused to listen/read.

[Voorhees]

It took years for LucasArts to release JTL and add space and ship interiors. It is a big feat for Cryptic to get out both ground and space gameplay at launch, but the sacrifice is the lack of ship interiors, and starbase interiors, altough it appears we will get DS9 at launch.

EVE Online has promised interiors for stations for years, yet no progress has been made.

I would be willing to wait 5 months of less for an expansion or content update to add ship interiors and station interiors. And I want the ship interiors to be comprehensive, not just the bridge and ready room. I want the decks and corridors and all the rooms.

You know funny how people take facts and make them worst then they are. It took 1 year for them to come out for jump to light speed. Get the facts before posting constructive posts. I am a swg vet played for 5 years streight.

[Voorhees]

Game: Star Wars Galaxies: Jump to Lightspeed (PC)
Review Score: 7.6 | Release Date: Oct 26, 2004


star wars galaxies came out june the year before. I do remember it coming out oct the following year as i remember going to the mall with some friends as i needed a ride to pick it up and they were doing costume shopping for holloween and i wanted jump to light speed.

[Flatfingers]

I mean people talk about wanting to have a fully functioning Medical bay, but in game terms (not star trek terms) what exactly would be that function -- it cannot be unbalancing, nor burdensome.

Just to be absolutely clear, for my part I am not after a "fully functioning" anything -- that's not my goal.

I support implementing a few of the most well-known locations -- Bridge, Engineering, perhaps Sick Bay -- and keying to each of those locations specific, fun, and IP-appropriate gameplay activities. If it doesn't directly support IP-appropriate gameplay (bearing in mind that I define "gameplay" as encompassing discovery and social play as well as action/accumulation-oriented play), then I do not support spending time implementing it in Star Trek Online.

If other people don't want that, that's fine; but if folks are going to disagree with what I want, I hope they'll speak to what I actually want, and not to some false "everything/fully functioning/perfect sim" notion that I've never advocated for this game.

My view is that this game would benefit from having a few key locations that just implement the most iconic Star Trek activities as entertaining gameplay features.

"Just," he says. :)

I guess what I am asking, is what are current examples of what could be accomplished in other games, to demonstrate the feasibility.

For the record, I think the premise behind this question may be faulty. Just because today's games don't offer some feature doesn't necessarily mean that feature must be unpopular or undesirable. Technical capability or applicability for the IP are two perfectly valid reasons why a feature has not yet become common. They don't imply any inherent defect in that feature. If it's doable, makes sense within an IP, and is likely to be enough fun for enough people to pay for itself, why not do it even if no one else has done it before?

As long as they're fun for the gamers who want them, and there are enough such gamers likely to subscribe to justify the development costs, why not include two stations -- Diagnostic and Surgical -- in a Sick Bay interior, with each station given an appropriate look and an enjoyable minigame that uses the character's medical skills? Why not build an Engineering interior that gives an Engineering-oriented character tools for using power-management and system maintenance and repair skills, or an Astrometrics lab for Scientists with controls for manipulating sensors and computers in an enjoyably detailed way, or a Bridge interior with stations allowing players to enjoy elements of all these gameplay modes?

If other games don't have these things, how does that demonstrate that it would be a mistake for this particular game to offer them, or that doing so is in some way unfeasible?

...

The history of product development has always been that until somebody creates some new capability, everyone says that it's either impossible or unnecessary... but after someone does it and it turns out to be wildly popular, everyone says it was obvious and inevitable. ;)

I don't know that having some starship interiors with the most IP-appropriate and fun working systems (which is all I'm after) will turn out to be one of those "obvious and inevitable" ideas. Maybe the naysayers are right in this case.

The thing is, how can we know that until someone actually gives it a fair shot?

--Flatfingers

[Loekii]

Flat,

To clarify, when I say 'feasability', I basically mean that it is technologically possible, especially as a 'side game'.

IMO, sometimes people expect game development to invent things, that really are not that practical at this time.

Could they make a game where everything is run by various rooms inside a ship? Possibly, but at what cost? Something on such a grand scale might basically demand far more resources than budgeted. And even then, because it is '1st time tech', it might still not work.

Basically, it is like talking to the wife that has dreams of what her new kitchen should look like -- translating it with what is allowed by local codes, the existing layout, and the budget - and seeing what the compromise is. A lot of times, people want a wall to be removed, but do not realize that wall must remain to support the upstairs and to there is not enough money in the budget for a restructure.

In video game development, 'the sky' is not the limit. Reality and money is.

So my question is what is the 'reality' of what we could logically expect from ship interiors, knowing full well that the game is not about ship interiors. I would expect to see the Devs draw on exiting examples, and trying to work with in their budget as well.

[LordDave]

Wow, here I am, minding my own business, avoiding this thread like I should and it's answered! All the debate has been put to rest. Nic has done a complete turn around from "Cryptic is going to make this game fail" to "This game will rock" even though nothing has actually changed, just information clarified.
It reminds me of Chinese Whispers. The farther down the line information is passed, the more distorted it becomes. This is a case of distortion alright. We went from "no player ship interiors" to "no interiors at all" though this forum.

Its funny to watch really.

[MorganL4]

Depends how much they have already done.

But since they said the first expansion is said to be the addition of the Romulan and Dominion factions, I got the feeling that interiors are going to be on the back burner for a while. (2 years?)

Id rather have interiors and wait for a year or 2 before they introduce the Rom/Dom factions. I mean lets face it the majority of Trek the series took place on the inside of ships, so not having that relatively soon after launch ( by soon I mean within a year) is rather anti trek, the only real exception to that was DS9, but that was because it was a space station and not a ship.

[djnattyd]

Wow, here I am, minding my own business, avoiding this thread like I should and it's answered! All the debate has been put to rest. Nic has done a complete turn around from "Cryptic is going to make this game fail" to "This game will rock" even though nothing has actually changed, just information clarified.
It reminds me of Chinese Whispers. The farther down the line information is passed, the more distorted it becomes. This is a case of distortion alright. We went from "no player ship interiors" to "no interiors at all" though this forum.

Its funny to watch really.

:p Welcome back Dave

[Moryan_Sorg]

Flat,

To clarify, when I say 'feasability', I basically mean that it is technologically possible, especially as a 'side game'. [...]

[...]So my question is what is the 'reality' of what we could logically expect from ship interiors, knowing full well that the game is not about ship interiors. I would expect to see the Devs draw on exiting examples, and trying to work with in their budget as well.

I don't think this requires reinventing the wheel as much as you are suggesting. You don't even need the ship interiors to add much of the stuff we are asking for (note: not that I'm speaking for flatfingers, but i definitely generally agree with him). Much of what I want is just displays that can be brought up from an npc window on the UI. This screen will allow you to give commands, get information, and occasionally step in.

Now, 'stepping in'. There are a lots of instances in the show where they actually show you what screen they are looking out when things are out of alignment or what not. If their task is to realign something, why not make a fun little realignment game. It could be very easy to program. As you get higher and higher in level you add a little bit to the activity that you have to deal with.

Have you ever played a basketball video game where you have to match pressure on both L/R triggers to align a the free throw? Or maybe a game like gladius where you have to stop a moving bar within a range by pressing a button at the right time, perhaps several in repetition. All I'm asking is to be able to expand on those types of mini games in a way that makes sense to whatever task is being performed. A 'surgery' mini game could just be you waving your cursor (the dermal regenerator) over the injured area. Things could get more and more complex as you unlock medical abilities.

[Posidon]

I really like this. I've been throwing around ides about this whenever I can as well. For me, every task that the NPC crew has should be able to be fully automated by them with some pre-set commands from the captain, the PC. BUT, the captain should be able to step in at any time to gather info, change the orders and hopefully take over the task (especially if the area being taken over is in the captain's 'specialty).

To expand upon the sickbay example. The sickbay has pre combat mission commands for triage, personnel jobs, types of scans and info being taken in during combat, etc.

For triage the captain could order the med officer to treat heavy wounds first and save more lives or treat light wounds first so that more people can get back to their stations quicker. Now for the customization: As the captain I'd like to be able to adjust this real time during combat. Say I'm in a long combat situation, my preferences may change... This is something that I don't see why the devs wouldn't include.

I'm also really hoping they include giving the captain some ability to step in. PvE missions would have a lot more depth if I could actually look at a medical scan and make a more informed decision about the doctor's recommendation rather than just being spoon fed a resolution.

This type of idea could be spread to any aspect of the ship through the NPC system.

Yep, this is just the tip of the ice burg so to speak. It is a simple, yet elligant approach. It emphisises emersion and eposodic content (spelling :rolleyes:). Anyway, it takes good planing to implement it. A lot of thought has already gone into this. :D

[_Pax_]

Well no what you were telling me was based on blind faith.
Reasonable conclusion based on all available evidence, you meant to say. Yes? We showed you a developer statement - which specifically said there would still be interiors for during missions, AND, explicitly said that Cryptic wanted to add in a "free-roaming player starship interior" feature as soon as they could. We pointed out that the last time there was a situation comparable (Capes, for City of Heroes), and a Cryptic employee said that exact same thing ("we want to add them to teh game, as soon as we possibly can"), they DID do so ... very soon (within ninety dys of Launch). :rolleyes:

Now we have a CONFIRMATION that there will be interiors and they will be something more than simple housing.Yes their role will be primary social but they will be a part of the game,there will be a lot of npc's doing their work and you will be able to talk with them [...]
Zinc didn't say that part. While I hope it HAPPENS ... that's not what he said.

[Flatfingers]

As others have suggested, I think it's too early to declare implementing a few ship interior locations with some very specific functional ship-control gameplay to be at a "grand scale" or "the sky" level of design complexity and/or technical feasibility.

But in fairness, I suppose that most of us here are just interested gamers; if anyone wants to believe that a few interiors with some department-specific ship control features is too hard to do, I'm not in a position to assert that they must be wrong. All I can say is that neither their belief that it's too hard or my belief that it's doable is supported by enough hard evidence to say that it's the Only Correct Belief.

So I certainly can't say you're wrong, Loekii.

I'm just saying that, until some motivated and creative developer actually tries this, you can't reasonably say I must be wrong to think it's possible. :)

--Flatfingers

[KO_Gilligan]

Wow, here I am, minding my own business, avoiding this thread like I should and it's answered! All the debate has been put to rest. Nic has done a complete turn around from "Cryptic is going to make this game fail" to "This game will rock" even though nothing has actually changed, just information clarified.
It reminds me of Chinese Whispers. The farther down the line information is passed, the more distorted it becomes. This is a case of distortion alright. We went from "no player ship interiors" to "no interiors at all" though this forum.

Its funny to watch really.
hey, Dave :D

apparently you don't have an excuse for being late for the party.

Don't give me that "I've been watching" stuff. You missed Earth and Beyond as the model.

But I digress.

[_Pax_]

Seems like a real Starship bridge might be fitted with a very large Holographic Representation of the space around the ship in order to make split second tactical decisions. It would be highly scalable in order to "Zoom out" and encompass an even larger view when needed.
Another place where Star Trek falls down, IMO, while the Honorverse gets it very, very, VERY right. "The Main Plot" is precisely that: a free-floating holographic display, in true 3D, of the current tactical and navigational situation. (And on warships, the Captain often has a smaller copy of that, with a simplified display, right by their seat.)

I'm surprised that at least the Klingons don't have something like that. I suppose it's because war itself strongly disinterested Gene, so he really didn't give much thought to what a starship would really need, in order to effectively fight.

A third person behind the ship view with a rear view sensor for behind the camera is the next best thing
Or just a third-person view where you can change the camera direction without affecting your ship's heading. And, now that I think of it, one where you can zoom WAY out from your ship.

[KO_Gilligan]

Another place where Star Trek falls down, IMO, while the Honorverse gets it very, very, VERY right. "The Main Plot" is precisely that: a free-floating holographic display, in true 3D, of the current tactical and navigational situation. (And on warships, the Captain often has a smaller copy of that, with a simplified display, right by their seat.)

I'm surprised that at least the Klingons don't have something like that. I suppose it's because war itself strongly disinterested Gene, so he really didn't give much thought to what a starship would really need, in order to effectively fight.
.

If you had a big screen and high gaming resolution, such a device that you could run as a "Helm", in game, would totally rock... and while you see your ship take a hit to the bridge, you can see things are falling apart within your bridge around you :eek:

[Silverspar]

Well no what you were telling me was based on blind faithNo, we didn't. We gave you link to interviews, statements by Craig himself, the pictures on this site, and much more, and you boldly ignored it.

[Loekii]

As others have suggested, I think it's too early to declare implementing a few ship interior locations with some very specific functional ship-control gameplay to be at a "grand scale" or "the sky" level of design complexity and/or technical feasibility.

But in fairness, I suppose that most of us here are just interested gamers; if anyone wants to believe that a few interiors with some department-specific ship control features is too hard to do, I'm not in a position to assert that they must be wrong. All I can say is that neither their belief that it's too hard or my belief that it's doable is supported by enough hard evidence to say that it's the Only Correct Belief.

So I certainly can't say you're wrong, Loekii.

I'm just saying that, until some motivated and creative developer actually tries this, you can't reasonably say I must be wrong to think it's possible. :)

--Flatfingers

I apologies if I am implying it is 'impossible'. What I mean is 'impractical' - and not in the "Im right, your wrong" sense, but rather acknowledging there are budget and tech limitations which could prevent it. And again, this is in my opinion, rather than trying to say it is in fact impractical.

In my line of work, there are many things that are possible, but cannot be accomplished because of budget, time, and other limiting factors. I am sure this is the case in game development as well (Awen basically confirmed this imo).

In my opinion, I think that STO has already overstated too many ideas -- I expect to see either things removed or result in being much 'smaller' than we would hope. So I don't see room for ship interiors being too grandeous, when you consider all the other stuff that they will want to add after launch.

In short, it is potentially having a Banquet Appetite on a Fast food salary, imo.

[_Pax_]

If you had a big screen and high gaming resolution, such a device that you could run as a "Helm", in game, would totally rock... and while you see your ship take a hit to the bridge, you can see things are falling apart within your bridge around you :eek:

DAMN you, KO ... you keep giving me ideas to add to my "never gonna afford it" ULTIMATE TREK GAMING STATION ...!!! :D:eek:

Now, I'm at the following list of bullet points:

1:1 scale Shuttlepod interior ...
inside a 1:1 scale shuttlepod exterior ...
inside a 1:1 scale mock shuttle bay (built in/from a smallish warehouse-style structure) ...
Multiple screens inside for the various displays and the forward window;
... with an appropriate cinematic of taking off from the shuttlebay (complete with authentic details outside the structure, from real-life) during the power-up sequence;
Use Microsoft Surface (http://www.microsoft.com/surface/) for all LCARS control panels;


... jeeze, I'll have to win the LOTTO to even contemplate TRYING to build that ...

...

...

...

... say, um ... d'you got a dollar I can borrow, for a lotto ticket? :D

[jhem99]

Be careful what you ask for, you might never get it. That would be very disappointing.:o

[Posidon]

As others have suggested, I think it's too early to declare implementing a few ship interior locations with some very specific functional ship-control gameplay to be at a "grand scale" or "the sky" level of design complexity and/or technical feasibility.

But in fairness, I suppose that most of us here are just interested gamers; if anyone wants to believe that a few interiors with some department-specific ship control features is too hard to do, I'm not in a position to assert that they must be wrong. All I can say is that neither their belief that it's too hard or my belief that it's doable is supported by enough hard evidence to say that it's the Only Correct Belief.

So I certainly can't say you're wrong, Loekii.

I'm just saying that, until some motivated and creative developer actually tries this, you can't reasonably say I must be wrong to think it's possible. :)

--Flatfingers

I applaud you sir. Very good! ;)

[Posidon]

If you had a big screen and high gaming resolution, such a device that you could run as a "Helm", in game, would totally rock... and while you see your ship take a hit to the bridge, you can see things are falling apart within your bridge around you :eek:

Your getting warmer, but Ohh, so much more then that.............................

[Posidon]

I apologies if I am implying it is 'impossible'. What I mean is 'impractical' - and not in the "Im right, your wrong" sense, but rather acknowledging there are budget and tech limitations which could prevent it. And again, this is in my opinion, rather than trying to say it is in fact impractical.

In my line of work, there are many things that are possible, but cannot be accomplished because of budget, time, and other limiting factors. I am sure this is the case in game development as well (Awen basically confirmed this imo).

In my opinion, I think that STO has already overstated too many ideas -- I expect to see either things removed or result in being much 'smaller' than we would hope. So I don't see room for ship interiors being too grandeous, when you consider all the other stuff that they will want to add after launch.

In short, it is potentially having a Banquet Appetite on a Fast food salary, imo.

I think your right on top of that one Loekii! I am looking down the road, in hopes they put this in, and to the detail they, and I am sure everyone else, will want.

[KO_Gilligan]

In my opinion, I think that STO has already overstated too many ideas -- I expect to see either things removed or result in being much 'smaller' than we would hope.

Anything in particular that you are skeptical of? Or just thinking they are overstating things in general?

[Arokh72]

I've asked this before and shall ask again...mainly because before was a very long time ago....willl the Fed interiors have exploding panels?

[SenshiBat]

Blind Faith was a band with Eric Clapton.. Cryptic is a game DEV based in Los Gatos,CA..

I put my faith in whats scientifically review able and independently tested.. So I listen to the Consistency of Zinc interviews.
Until PC Gamer gets a test run or
G4 gets a test run
or I acquire a Beta Birthing to compare its actual performance to SFA for interior or SFC for exterior Combat modeling
we[personal speaking] don't really really know..

Not a Doubting Thomas.. The truths out there..its all in where you're looking for it..
and at this stage in the "game" it''s looking good.. Champions what a year head start on the forum..
[not quite] a Fuller staff of Creatives..
just look at the Cryptic join the team for positions available and you see major team positions for STO yet they are doing well with the scripting and concepts.. Its the early story board phase of the movie
and this ain't Hellgate London.. Is a proven IP with a massive fan base they simply cannot fail to ship. or they disappear as an DEV..so they will do anything in the Cryptic Omega Directive to make it so.

Or we'll hold are breath...Good one KO.
We keep them honest let them know what we think and they read and get ideas or development paths for the future . Then coalesce the feedback to the community.
The teams being fair with the feedback on the cosistant stage right now. I dont think they are promising anything they cant deliver so expect suprises? As the visual techs out there its a debate
of is it STO or MSFlight Sim were asking for?

[Posidon]

I've asked this before and shall ask again...mainly because before was a very long time ago....willl the Fed interiors have exploding panels?

If I were doing the interiors, YES, and many other situations can/will arise through using your terminals. Is STO going to do this, I don't know, but I would hope they would sometime down the road.

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I've asked this before and shall ask again...mainly because before was a very long time ago....willl the Fed interiors have exploding panels?

Lets think for a minute here: the only time a panel SHOULD explode is during combat. During combat, you will be controlling your ship from the outside, NOT the inside. So even IF pannels exploded during combat, you wouldnt see it :o

[_Pax_]

Nah, Nagus - if there's an episode similar to the one where the Enterprise hit a "superstring" (or whatever it was called) and was seriously damaged ... THEN, you're in a situation where you might see exploding panels while in the interior of your ship (as a mission instance, of course).

[Posidon]

What about a Nebula that is so dense, you normal sensors can read it. You may have to modify, or what is know as "overload" power to the sensors to see it? I am starting to give away why terminals are awesome and what I was intending to do with them. Well, before I REALLY let the cat out of the bag, I will hush up. I spent years working on this you know........................

[OddjobXL]

I really hope that's not true, Nagus. The smart money's on Cryptic sorting out that interior bridge views during combat (at least PvE combat) are a definining characteristic of Star Trek ship combat. Without that you've got a three legged chair when it comes to immersion. Maybe not at launch but eventually.

[Varrangian]

I really hope that's not true, Nagus. The smart money's on Cryptic sorting out that interior bridge views during combat (at least PvE combat) are a definining characteristic of Star Trek ship combat. Without that you've got a three legged chair when it comes to immersion. Maybe not at launch but eventually.

Sorry, but that's a total matter of preference. I would far prefer to engage in combat from the 3rd person view. As it is my SHIP that is in combat, I'd rather be fully aware of the space around it than how Worf's butt looks at tactical.

[OddjobXL]

I think it's broader than just opinion. The actions, the antics, on a Star Trek bridge are a cultural meme. They're a punchline that's so obvious it's in comedy sketches on popular shows.

Grab a camera, walk onto the street, and ask people what they remember about space battles on Star Trek. 4 out of 5 will mention the people flailing around the bridge and the red lights and the sirens.

That goes beyond opinion.

In my opinion. :D

[Varrangian]

I think it's broader than just opinion. The actions, the antics, on a Star Trek bridge are a cultural meme. They're a punchline that's so obvious it's in comedy sketches on popular shows.

Grab a camera, walk onto the street, and ask people what they remember about space battles on Star Trek. 4 out of 5 will mention the people flailing around the bridge and the red lights and the sirens.

How do you propose to make meaningful combat that includes this "comic relief"? I'm sorry in my opinion that request is rather impractical.

[KO_Gilligan]

And being able to actually do maneuvering and battle from that perspective will have you asking for the option to toggle 3rd person. Suddenly your bridge view during red alert becomes totally impractical.

[OddjobXL]

How do you propose to make meaningful combat that includes this "comic relief"? I'm sorry in my opinion that request is rather impractical.

Well, it shouldn't be comic relief. I was must making the point that the broader public, not just hardcore fans, may well be expecting this in the game.

I'd probably make it work along the lines of Bridge Commander or a simplified version thereof. It's been done before. I fly from the cockpit view in flight sims and in SWG so that works. This is just taking it to the next level.

[Varrangian]

I'd probably make it work along the lines of Bridge Commander or a simplified version thereof. It's been done before. I fly from the cockpit view in flight sims and in SWG so that works. This is just taking it to the next level.

In flight sims and SWG you are dog-fighting. They've specifically said STO space combat will be paced and tactical. I agree with KO when people actually get in game they will be using 3rd person because it is far more practical.

[OddjobXL]

That's why I said, for PvE at least, meaning when you need every bit of combat utility as in PvP I'm sure people will favor the external view. Most of the time, in most games, in PvE you really don't. You can afford to kick back and enjoy the experience rather than stress over it. Having that view, in a measured and tactical PvE situation, seems eminently practical just not optimal for gameplay. For immersion, for fun, for 'being there', for living the Star Trek experience it's indispensible.

[Varrangian]

That's why I said, for PvE at least, meaning when you need every bit of combat utility as in PvP I'm sure people will favor the external view. Most of the time, in most games, in PvE you really don't. You can afford to kick back and enjoy the experience rather than stress over it. Having that view, in a measured and tactical PvE situation, seems eminently practical just not optimal for gameplay. For immersion, for fun, for 'being there', for living the Star Trek experience it's indispensible.

For you. For me it is not indispensable. We can agree to disagree on this, but my point is that the bridge view being vital to a Trek game is a matter of personal preference.

[OddjobXL]

I won't pretend I'm unbiased but I'm also a very experienced gamer and student of human nature. So, yeah, my opinion. Take it for what it's worth.

[Inquizitor]

Wow. After reading this thread, even I'm confused about what we're planning to do. : )

No, not really. I think I have a clear idea:

There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

Sadly, what we won't have at launch is the ability for you to customize your own ship, invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it. We want to make sure that when we a feature like this in, it is a robust system that people will love, not just a marketing bullet point on the back of the box.

-Zn


Well heck. Why didn';t you guys just say so? Why be so cryptic. Ship interiors are in then. All teh bells and whistle I am more than happy to wait for. MY main concern was you weren'tputting in the springboard in which to build upon.


*jumps back on the bandwagon*

EDIT: *Jumps back off bandwagon*

Misread what you said. We already know there aer going to be instanced interiors. AWill I be able to pop into an isntance of my own ship at a whim and look around. Whil I be able to goto Sickbay or Engineering at my whim, be it an inastanced "mission" or not and try to work in tehre. Improve my engines or do some hands on work to solve a porblem.

For example we get caught in a section of space where the Warp engines are not working properly. Will I be able to goto my own engnieering room and help solve the problem and break us free of whatever is causing the problem?

[KO_Gilligan]

Well heck. Why didn';t you guys just say so? Why be so cryptic. Ship interiors are in then. All teh bells and whistle I am more than happy to wait for. MY main concern was you weren'tputting in the springboard in which to build upon.


*jumps back on the bandwagon*

EDIT: *Jumps back off bandwagon*

Misread what you said. We already know there aer going to be instanced interiors. AWill I be able to pop into an isntance of my own ship at a whim and look around. Whil I be able to goto Sickbay or Engineering at my whim, be it an inastanced "mission" or not and try to work in tehre. Improve my engines or do some hands on work to solve a porblem.

For example we get caught in a section of space where the Warp engines are not working properly. Will I be able to goto my own engnieering room and help solve the problem and break us free of whatever is causing the problem?

I'd bet your overreacting about the depth possibilities of instances. You will not be able to just stroll around at will, but Craig seems to be making it clear that there will be things going on, and that this game will have the depth you desire in regards to something like your scenario of something going wrong in enginnering. That would generally be an instanced scenario, and you'd have things to do and could even stick around to make sure you've fiddled with the settings enough before exiting the instance.

IF and WHEN

Honestly, I don't see Craig's statement as quite long enough regarding the IF and WHEN.

If and When the ability to stroll around your ship at will becomes available, it needs to consider two things.
1. The world outside - at large (what's going on during your stroll)
2. The depth of your activities, and how it will effect the world and your future.

When Craig said he didn't just want a bullet point (for custom interiors) he obviously is indicating that they don't just want a quick gimmick in order to add a desired feature. Nobody will be very happy if the interiors aren't a significant and fun activity. They should be large, immersive, interactive, and possibly effect other aspects of the game.

For that, we will have to wait for IF and WHEN. Seems more than reasonable to me, in fact I'd say it's unrealistic to expect more, and unrealistic to expect as much any sooner.

[Inquizitor]

You are problably right. Maybe I am overreacting. I don't think I am being clear on what I am wanting quite frankly. Especially since People keep bringing up customizing an interior though it is something important when in reality it is barely notworthy.

I'll piece together an article detailing what I am after once I collect my thoughts on the matter. Frankly I don't think I am all together out of sync with what cryptic is doing. However I do think that interiors shoudl be more accessable than Cryptic is making them sound. I want to be clear on it and I want to do it at home since I don't have my normal typo checker here at work. It problably won't be implemented but at least it will help people undersand where I am coming from. Of course maybe it iis already in and they are just being way to quiet on the subject. I don't know. They sem to be beating around the bush on the topics tha concern me in favor of playing up this notion that everything must be customized five ways from sunday and that's why they arent doing interiors.

[KO_Gilligan]

You are problably right. Maybe I am overreacting. I don't think I am being clear on what I am wanting quite frankly. Especially since People keep bringing up customizing an interior though it is something important when in reality it is barely notworthy.

I'll piece together an article detailing what I am after once I collect my thoughts on the matter. Frankly I don't think I am all together out of sync with what cryptic is doing. However I do think that interiors shoudl be more accessable than Cryptic is making them sound. I want to be clear on it and I want to do it at home since I don't have my normal typo checker here at work. It problably won't be implemented but at least it will help people undersand where I am coming from. Of course maybe it iis already in and they are just being way to quiet on the subject. I don't know. They sem to be beating around the bush on the topics tha concern me in favor of playing up this notion that everything must be customized five ways from sunday and that's why they arent doing interiors.

Your right... My other thought on their decision making is that it's hard to know which aspects should be focused on. I honestly think that they want a large number of people to co-op in the common areas in Beta, and see how the dynamic plays out... do people want to mess with controls, effect the environment, or make small talk?
Or what if they have these homeworlds and space stations, and people don't bother with them... hardly seems they would put much effort into adding social areas in our ships if that is the case.

[Flatfingers]

do people want to mess with controls, effect the environment, or make small talk?
Or what if they have these homeworlds and space stations, and people don't bother with them... hardly seems they would put much effort into adding social areas in our ships if that is the case.

If player behaviors in other MMORPGs are any guide, "both" is probably the correct answer.

I know I'd like to see the key locations of my ship rendered with some functionality. But there were also a lot of people in SWG (for example) who really got into decorating their houses. Heck, I even did some interior decorating myself. It was fun, even if that's not my main playstyle.

So I'm not opposed to player ship interiors as places to (as Craig put it) "invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it." If some interior customization is possible, I have zero objection to that -- I hope it's done well so that the gamers who enjoy personalizing their world-space can have a blast doing it.

I'm just hoping that the gamers who enjoy exploring detailed systems get some functionality out of those player ship interiors, too, and that they're not just for looks.

--Flatfingers

[CaptainHoliday]

If player behaviors in other MMORPGs are any guide, "both" is probably the correct answer.

I know I'd like to see the key locations of my ship rendered with some functionality. But there were also a lot of people in SWG (for example) who really got into decorating their houses. Heck, I even did some interior decorating myself. It was fun, even if that's not my main playstyle.

So I'm not opposed to player ship interiors as places to (as Craig put it) "invite other players over and walkaround, seeing hundreds of NPC crew members and investigate every nook, cranny and Jefferies tube on it." If some interior customization is possible, I have zero objection to that -- I hope it's done well so that the gamers who enjoy personalizing their world-space can have a blast doing it.

I'm just hoping that the gamers who enjoy exploring detailed systems get some functionality out of those player ship interiors, too, and that they're not just for looks.

--Flatfingers

I agree with you there. But I am strongly supporting player ship interiors, as I think they would add valuable depth and gameplay to STO. And a LOT of people want them.

I also want there to be some functionality to it as well. I want the panels to be functionable, and when you go to Ten-Forward you should be able to use the Matter Generators to fix up some drinks or snacks, and the Holodeck should be usable too.

There should be cool stuff to do with interiors.

A good example of what interiors should not be is the Virtual Voyager expansion from Elite Force. While it was neat to see the interiors or Voyager for a while, there was hardly anything to do and it got old FAST.

But with STO it could be different. And doable to within a year of release.

[Inquizitor]

I wont make a big write up like I was planning on but I think what Gillian is saying is what I'm after. I am seeing a system where in I am exploring a new planet and, to pull a scenario from a book I recently read, The space I am in is so substantially different that the Warp engines have nothing to "push against" I would then have to go to Engineering or astrophysics, depending on if I wanted to try a science or engineering solution, to correct the problem. I would then be able to speak with my crew for clues on how to solve the problem and engage in a puzzle type mini game to solve the problem . This mini game would draw heavily on the pseudo science of the Star Trek lore.

Once I solve the problem I can be on my way and if I ever come across the same problem again I wouldn't have to go through the whole process again because my crew has already seen it and knows how to deal with it. This would add novelty when an actual new unexplained thing happened while not boring us with a repetitive task.

I also see a scenario where You have to help in Sickbay to find a cure for a virus or help with surgery using a different mini game type system.

In all of those instances I would want this to draw on the captains skill to help solve it. The Captain who does not have those skills, or just doesn't want to deal with the mini games, could choose to let the crew solve it on their own. This would take more time and the puzzle wouldn't be auto skipped in the future but it would play upon the skills of the individual captains and their crews. To me that should be frequent but novel approaches that gets players involved with their own hips and crews and would give us a game play focused chance to walk around in our own ship.

Ideally we could walk around in our own ship regardless of mission status even if it's just these key locations. I wouldn't necessarily want to go into every nook and cranny even though that would be kinda cool. especially if you were doing some mini game to speed up field repairs on your ship. At the same time I know some people might get annoyed with trying to solve the puzzles all the time. For them they could access the ships computers and see if other captains had solved the issue and go that route. When doing so every player who solves the puzzle can choose to post the solution to Memory alpha. The people who solved the puzzle the fastest are displayed and the captain wanting to bypass the problem can select the top captain and have it solved in the same amount of time.

If the problem is a new one no one has ever seen before, which the devs would hopefully continually introduce, then the captain will at least have the feeling of truly experiencing something no one has ever experienced before. Each solution should be a unique, experience even if the mini game itself is the same at it's core.

That is what I want with interiors. To me it is important to know the interior of my own ship, I once read that a good captain knows every bolt of his own ship. In that respect I want to know what it looks like but not just to roam around and say, gee isn't that pretty wallpaper. Even more important however is the interaction and problem solving with my crew. To me that was a very important part of Star Trek and is probably why I liked Voyager more than the other series. The original series hit on it although they went into weird areas often. With Voyager it was just the ship and their crew against the unknown.

That is the experience I want to capture in a Star Trek Game. I'm not after a Simulator as much as I am just wanting a game where the adventure takes place inside the ship as well as outside. I want to feel connected to my crew. I want them to be more than a status page I can call up and occasionally see on an away mission. Every multiplayer Trek "game" I've come across has failed me in this. The most prominent was a Must called ATS. For all it's potential the ships and the crews were insignificant. Everything was based out of a star base. Ships were doled out on a whim and the ship you served on one day wasn't the one you were on the next. I know to a degree I will have control over that in STO but will I Still be tied to a star base?

Yes all of these interior mission could be instanced. If they are then I am happy with that. What I am hearing seems to be dancing around weather or not that is what is going to happen. Some of this is game play issues I suppose but I think we really need to start hearing about all these "great" game play features. I've heard enough about the fluff. This is what really aggravates me about interiors. I mentioned this before. When I heard it was removed because of fluff I was more aggravated because they didn't deem it an important for game play Maybe they are confused because they did put them in but they are missions. If so then I'm glad but I hope they are frequent.

[AussieTrekkie91]

Have any of you people seen the trailers and the screen shots of the interiors.. Who could possibly get tired of that!!!

I'm sure cryptic have everything under control and will have everything look superb once it's available for retail purchase:)

[CaptainHoliday]

Have any of you people seen the trailers and the screen shots of the interiors.. Who could possibly get tired of that!!!

I'm sure cryptic have everything under control and will have everything look superb once it's available for retail purchase:)

I sure hope so!

The question still remains, eve with Craig's comment in this thread, is HOW LONG TO WAIT FOR INTERIORS?

[Inquizitor]

Have any of you people seen the trailers and the screen shots of the interiors.. Who could possibly get tired of that!!!

I'm sure cryptic have everything under control and will have everything look superb once it's available for retail purchase:)

I could get tired of it in a heartbeat if it doesn't feel like Star Trek to me. Looking like Star Trek is only half of what the game needs to do.

[KO_Gilligan]

I sure hope so!

The question still remains, eve with Craig's comment in this thread, is HOW LONG TO WAIT FOR INTERIORS?

Wow... read this, and elaborate, if you'd be so kind.


There will be plenty of interiors in the game at launch - there are plenty in the game right now and I don't see them going anywhere. : )

You will be taken to interiors during instanced missions. You'll go to them in persistent ways as well - mostly social, but also in other cases that I'm going to be vague about right now on purpose : ) - There are starbases, satellites, ship interiors (yes, ships), buildings on the ground, caverns under the earth or deep in asteroids - all sorts of places you'll adventure within interiors.

[Elfender]

I'm not really looking for full interiors, all i really want is the popularly shown areas in the show

Bridge
Briefing/Ready Room
Ten Forward
Sickbay
Engineering
maybe Astrometrics and the Armory
Definately the Transporter room for when your actually going on a mission.

almost full interiors for fleet owned starbases, both for social and ....(whats the word) Prestige puposes

no, im not gonna be sore if these functionalities dont make release, id just like cryptic to look at making these possible, that along with the ability to beam aboard your friends/fleetmates ships for social calls or fleet meetings assuming you dont have a base or base interiors...i realize this post is slightly disjointed, but most pople will get my polint, and those that dont...hrm....need to get smarter... :D

[The.Grand.Nagus]

Nah, Nagus - if there's an episode similar to the one where the Enterprise hit a "superstring" (or whatever it was called) and was seriously damaged ... THEN, you're in a situation where you might see exploding panels while in the interior of your ship (as a mission instance, of course).

Devs have already stated that ship interiors will be combat scenerios, not something you can wander around in .

[The.Grand.Nagus]

I really hope that's not true, Nagus. The smart money's on Cryptic sorting out that interior bridge views during combat (at least PvE combat) are a definining characteristic of Star Trek ship combat. Without that you've got a three legged chair when it comes to immersion. Maybe not at launch but eventually.

Despite what we think is "smart", Cryptic has already told us how it will work, and interiors will only be combat scenerios(such as boarding parties) at launch.

[CaptainHoliday]

Wow... read this, and elaborate, if you'd be so kind.

I meant, HOW LONG FOR FREE-ROAMING PERSISTENT SHIP AND STARBASE INTERIORS?

BEYOND DS9!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Miniv]

I meant, HOW LONG FOR FREE-ROAMING PERSISTENT SHIP AND STARBASE INTERIORS?

BEYOND DS9!!!!!!!!!!!!!




Yes because walking around a ship over and over again is the only thing worth doing in a star trek game apparently and if that feature isn't in the game the logical course of action would be to become a little whiney ***** making a forum post about it every week saying how you won't buy the game unless its added.

[Silverspar]

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